To think there is little incentive to work hard in the UK

[BeachTree]

Context. 30's, no kids, single, work full time.

Just a bit disheartened. I have never claimed benefits, or any type of support, I work hard to make sure I can support myself (Not disputing those who genuinely require benefits/support) I have always paid all my taxes, and national insurance. I expect by the time I reach retirement age, the 'state pension' may look very different to what it does now and may not be available despite having paid in my whole life.

I feel sometimes that I pay so much into the 'system' and get very little return and don't 'take' from it, whereas there are many people claiming every benefit possible, and constantly 'taking' from the system they don't pay into. There are so many ways to extract money from the system but only for those who don't work full time. I know someone who worked for about 1 or 2 year in late teens in the UK, then worked abroad for a number of years, during this time did not keep up with national insurance payments and obviously not paying UK tax as no in the country, also didn't pay tax in the country they resided in. Returned to England to have a baby on the NHS, now residing back in England, claiming benefits as a single parent for 2+ years, gets assistance with rent council tax etc despite having paid next to nothing in to the system. I cannot compute how this is fair.

For example the cost of living payment, people who claim benefits will get £650, where as those who work and do not claim benefits will get £400. The cost of living crisis affects all of us - perhaps more so the people who work their socks off and aren't 'entitled' to 'support' The system is backwards and not in favour of people who work full time to support our ridiculous benefit system. So many examples - ie. people get help with rent, council tax, working tax credits etc etc etc - however those who work get zero, zilch.

AIBU?

I don't know where people get this idea of the magic 16 hours. I work 23 hours and I wouldn't be better off working less hours at all. Would be financially much worse off not to mention my pension taking a hit too. My youngest starts school in September so I'd like to work more hours but my work says no. The more hours I work the better off I would be. Plenty of people want to work more

I don't understand what you think the friend did wrong. Any work should pay a "living wage" regardless of what previous jobs you had. You shouldn't have to work through your break or take overtime to be able to survive.

Unless you're working part time of course, then you probably won't earn enough to survive unless you've got a well paid job.

He's not surviving. He's lazy. He compares what he does and what he has to those who work more physically and mentally demanding roles. He had a higher-paying job and decided to give it up to faff about in a warehouse.
As for breaks, his team went on a break whilst a driver from a supplier arrived to deliver goods.
Lazy.
No subsidy of people's choices by the taxpayer.

As for breaks, I don't have any whilst I'm working. I'd never finish the jobs.

There shouldn't be any "shit jobs" in this country. Every job should pay enough to buy a house and live a modest lifestyle with some luxuries and a two week holiday abroad.

The older I get, the more I agree with you. I hope it isn’t a sign I’m turning Tory . We’re not entitled to anything at all, I’m supposed to be going back to uni in September but we’re not entitled to the student finance childcare grant because DH earns too much (he isn’t a millionaire and isn’t even earning 3 figures). We’re only entitled to the free hours all 3 year old’s are for the older one but nothing for the younger one so it’s looking likely I can’t go to uni now because we can’t afford childcare.

If I left DH and went on benefits I’d not only receive a childcare grant, I’d also receive other grants specifically for low income families. We won’t get the ‘cost of living’ payments for the same reason and we’ve never been entitled to free school meals or any help with our DC at all either. It’s just bullshit really, since the cost of everything has risen as much as it has we barely scrape through each month. I want to study again to better myself but can’t afford to go because DH earns slightly over the threshold.

I am starting to get bitter about the level of help some people get when we get fuck all. It does make you think what’s the point? We’d probably be better off if DH got a lower paid job in all honesty.

"As for breaks, I don't have any whilst I'm working. I'd never finish the jobs."

You're not paid for breaks. So even if you work through them, you don't get paid for them. You know that, right?

"As for breaks, I don't have any whilst I'm working. I'd never finish the jobs."

You're not paid for breaks. So even if you work through them, you don't get paid for them. You know that, right?

The sentiment is lovely but how does this work in practice? You’d have councils in South Lanarkshire able to pay their care home staff little more than NMW whilst London councils would have to pay theirs £100k a year. The latter would go bankrupt within a week.

It's always been the same

I remember really struggling when mine were little as dh earned too much on paper and we had a mortgage which kept increasing (thanks Tony Blair).

They were not interested in your outgoings itms

I feel sometimes that I pay so much into the 'system' and get very little return and don't 'take' from it

You could be diagnosed with metastatic cancer or hit by a lorry when driving to work next month, get 'let go' from work whilst you're in ICU and be unable to live independently for the rest of your life. Would knowing you're then getting your money's worth from the State (assuming you still have enough awareness to understand the situation) make you feel better?

Yes you are being unreasonable.
personally I hate the low tax “ideal” I think we should pay more tax for services. But I also expect more for my money. Better health care (inc mental), better benefits for those unable to work, better social housing, better police, better prison service with rehabilitation prospects.

i think as a society we do better when we are all supported. Yes we have individual responsibility, but we aren’t all dealt an equal hand. And sometimes life dumps on you.

You wouldn’t be. You’d be at the mercy of sanctions etc.

the answer isn’t “fuck it, I’m hard up so everyone else should be”

it makes it a race to the bottom.
it should be working out ways we can make it better for everyone.

You sound like my brother. Always claiming I was lazy because my job was different to his so 'hard' in a different way.

You don't take breaks? That's up to you. I often didn't when I was working either. My colleagues always did. Didn't make them "work to rule fools" or lazy. Maybe they were the sensible ones who didn't burnout and have a breakdown!

I see some people have swallowed the higher wages = harder work bullcrap.

The amount would be based on a national average house price, not weighted to area. Which would result in people moving out of London, which would cause house prices in London to decrease and the country as a whole to become more equal.

People already have the option to move from a high cost of living area to one where house prices are more in line with wages - South Lanarkshire is one of those examples. If that was a feasible option or desirable for the majority, surely it would already have happened?

This is not going to work. Are you imagining that established industries will all move around the country? Or just fail?

But if I can't afford more than the current rent where I am and am on a ZHC with widely varying income, how do I a) pass an affordability check for rent somewhere where I wouldn't have a job or b) have the money up front to move somewhere else with no job to go to?

If nothing else, I'd be making myself intentionally unemployed. So there would also be the likelihood of at best, a big gap waiting for the evidence to be able to claim UC and at worst, sanctioned for that intentional unemployment and have no income.

Those on lower incomes used to have access to low rent social housing. The lack of sufficient social housing nowadays is a real problem.

I own a business, so every minute of every day I generate revenue and the opposing expenditures.

I don't have time for dinners, lunches, or chatting.
5hrs per week is lost eating or smoking.
That's £400 per week or £20800 having a sandwich, or a ciggy 🥪.

@NellesVilla if you get regular medication you can pay for a prepaid certificate, paid monthly if you like and however many prescriptions you get you don’t pay for them individually

I think if there are 2 paid for prescriptions per month it works out better to get the prepayment certificate

If you are a single parent, 2 children in rented accommodation working 16 hours a week you earn £659 a month in wages and get £1,929 in benefits (ref 3) - £2,588 in total

Total income puts you in the top 20% of "earners" in the U.K.

You are subsidising him just like you are subsidising others on low wage such as care workers and shop workers. Those roles need to be filled.

Taking breaks at work makes you more efficient when you are working! If I was an employer I definitely wouldn't be encouraging people to work through breaks.