My whole family is full of money grabbers?

[WatermelonSugarRainbow]

This is a long one, so bear with me please.

A bit of a background

I am one of three siblings, my sister is a single mother and my brother (much younger, single) holds an ok job. My parents and siblings live in a small town whilst I moved to London to study and work (20 years ago). I'm the only one in the family to go to uni and hold a 'professional' job.

Over the years, I've always treated my mum and siblings - I would take my mum shopping (cashmere jumpers, linen dresses, perfumes, new mobile phones and even a laptop). I took her to Barcelona (all paid long weekend) for her 60th birthday. I'd also take my family out for dinners (to the pub or pizza express - nothing too fancy) and pick up the bill etc. knowing that they were not able to afford it but I just wanted to spend time with them/strenghten our bond.

We booked a holiday cottage with my sister and invited my mum (splitting the cost between us) but she backed out on the day we were meant to leave because her 'car broke down and it was very expensive to fix' so I just asked her to join us the next day. She drove the next day and never mentioned the car but I ended up paying for the accommodation, with my mum saying that it was too expensive for my sister because she's a single mum (even though she agreed to the cost previous to that). I must admit my dp was very angry about this whole situation.

Since I've had my dd, my mum stayed with us for the first couple months to help and I'm really grateful for that. When I went back to work, I've put dd at nursery. Meanwhile when my sister had her son, my mum looked after him until he was 3yo (for free).

After having my second, I asked if my mum would help me with childcare and nursery drop offs and pick ups. I suggested she moves in with us until my son is ready to start nursery (at 2 years old). She asked that I pay her for childcare and we agreed that I would pay her £500 a month whilst covering her food, accommodation etc.

Both me and my husband hold well paid jobs and on the face of it, we are doing really well but we are 'self made' and have huge monthly expenses - mortgage on an expensive house (good area/schools etc.), car loan, student loans (about to be paid off) and credit card debt that we used when we were decorating the house, so £500 per month for childcare is not an insignificant amount for us but it's obviously less than nursery and we agreed because we felt that she was the best person to look after dc to give us a piece of mind.

Since she started looking after children (6 months ago) I've purchased her a few things as 'gifts' like a smart watch, taken out a phone contract with a new handset for her (her phone was old), covered her travel expenses, expensive trainers etc. All in all about £450 worth of things. She also requested to have a 2 week break in June to go home and rest, so I took annual leave to cover that.

Fast forward to now, we booked and paid for her to come on holiday in Spain (first in 2 yrs) to help with childcare and she agreed to that. She's asked my brother to join us in the villa. (I agreed that me and my brother split the villa cost for my mum evenly). On day one of holiday, both my dp and ds became ill, that's when she told me she was 'on holiday' and wasn't going to help. On day 4, my brother demanded we give him money back as he would/should not pay for my mum. He accused me of ripping him off, took out a hammer and threatened to damage the villa, I ended up asking him to leave and gave him all his money back for his share (£400) even though it was already half way through the holiday, as I didn't feel safe having him around.

My mum took his side and demanded that I pay her for childcare in June (I haven't yet done so, as she 'took 2 week off' to go back to her house and only came back to catch a flight with us) she then told me she no longer wanted to look after my children and accused me of being ungrateful and 'not generous' with my family when I said I've spent so much money on this holiday paying for everyone.

I was so upset, at my lowest point with both my partner and my son sick, I've had zero sleep (sharing bedroom with dc whilst my mum and brother had separate bedrooms), I was up all night giving him medication, he was so grumpy and tired all day. I could have done with help specially in terms of my daughter - just someone to take her out as I was pretty much stuck indoors with ds because of fever. The fact that she took my brothers side (who acted like a psycho) and I feel like I've been nothing but generous towards her.

I'm disappointed - I've agreed to pay her when she didn't ask anything from my sister. All my life, I never got given anything - she gave my sister and my brother money for a deposit - I never said anything but I feel that she expects me to pay for her everywhere - every dinner, every drink, every Christmas.

For my 40th birthday, she stayed overnight with dc so that my partner and I could go away for one night (first time since having children). She was already staying with us and paid to do so and said that was her 'present to me'.

I think what it is, is that I feel that I've been generous and paid for lots of things from my mum, so her to demand last month's payment whilst on a fully paid holiday is a bit 'much'.

I owe her money (£250), should I just give her money I owe her, or should I 'deduct' all the cost for 'gifts' (£450) plus the cost of holiday villa and flights (£500) - meaning we would be all square?

Am I being unreasonable deducting gifts and holidays?

I also think you need to pay yout mother what you owe and also don’t deduct gifts, that’s the most arsehole thing I’ve ever heard, and then I hope your mother moves back and you need to pay for childcare and a cleaner properly.

Agreed. She didn't have the kids, you lot did. If you can't afford childcare, don't have the kids? And you're rich you state so you can afford it, just don't want to pay for it. That's basically being a cheapskate.

Pay her the £250, and get yourself proper childcare. Like most people do other than the other chancers who use their parents.

I think YABU for having ever expected this childcare situation to end in anything but misery. Just pay a nanny for your childcare, set boundaries with your family and respect the boundaries yourself too.

In some cultures this would be the norm. Especially if mum was on her own anyway. It can work very well but seems to have gone wrong here.

Op does she even like your DC?

One would think she would naturally want to take our the youngest one? The one stuck in?

That seems like fhe saddest thing.

On the kfjef hand I can also see how she may secretly resent being paid etc.

Settle up with her and thanks herm then get different support

Your mom and brother are messed up but you don't come across very well here. £500 for an essentially live in 24/7 nanny is very very cheap, and you seem to hold it over her. If I understand correctly she has also left her village to come to London to help you out?

You can't buy her love OP and you clearly are the scapegoat child.

Ask her to move out.
Pay for childcare you can rely on.
Base your future relationship with your family on how they treat you and never share finances again.

Your mother is a bitch but that's not your fault.

It all sounds very messed up but you seem to be forgetting how much you ask of your Mother. She gave up her whole life to help you, for minimum wage if that.

You even want her as paid help on holiday instead of enjoying a family hiday together. You can't have it both ways, if you want a full-time live in nanny you need to pay for one. It's a lot more than £500 a month.

Your family sound very transactional. Adding up the cost of this and that and offsetting it against favours done. If they’ve stayed where they were and you went on to greater things there might be a bit of resentment about all the cost keeping. I would keep family as family if I were you-pay someone to look after your child on a daily basis not uproot your mother from her home and pay her less while still regarding her like an employee. Treat your family only if you want to and enjoy being generous-but don’t keep receipts. If not, then don’t buy things for them-they can love you without having money spent on them.

Imagine how much you'd have saved without showering your selfish family members with smart watches, holidays and trainers. Probably have sorted that credit card debt.

You've been the family cash cow. It's very sad you couldn't see it. Families are supposed to love each other without needing to be bought. The amount you've spent on them is astonishing.

Your brother sounds like a scumbag and anyone who threatens with a hammer cannot be around your children. If your brother is likely to visit your mother while she has the children, she can no longer have them either.

Your family and your kids need to come first. Keep seeing these freeloaders if you like, but keep the wallet firmly shut. Maybe they could try getting a job.

Thing is, you’ve conditioned them to expect you to pay. You always pay and so that’s become what they expect, and they’ve forgotten that it’s not normal or fair.

Stop flashing the cash. Why are you buying your mum Apple watches and laptops when you have credit card debt and student loans to pay, for example?

You need to change the whole dynamic here.

Forgot to say drop your obnoxious brother-who behaves like that and thinks it’s acceptable?

Time for their gravy train (and boy was it a good one) to dry up. Completely.

Be friendly, be amiable but stop buying stuff and paying towards stuff for them.

Firstly - I'd move the mobile phone bill into your mother's name or as a ready to go/Pay As You Go contract. Any 'upgrades' are for her to sort out.
Next, stop buying expensive items such as smart watches etc. for them or paying for their holidays.

While you're paying for them to go on holidays, the money that they would have to spend on a holiday is being 'saved' by them and possibly being spent on their kids. They are essentially taking from your kids and you're letting them.

Start putting that money that you would spend on them into a savings account or some sort for your own kids. You'll soon see how it adds up.

very strange that you asked your mum to move in with you for childcare in the first place
odd dynamics
bound to end in tears

I think some posters have been a bit harsh on the OP. Remember that the mum didn't even buy her a birthday present for her 40th and just said that looking after the kids was her present, when she was being paid to stay over? There seems to be little thought or care, which is what the OP is trying to get with all the gifts. She is trying to buy the live that her siblings were just given!

If the arrangement was that mum helps you out on holiday and she left you to struggle with both kids, then you don't owe her any money. Also because she brought your brother, which incurred extra costs due to having a bigger villa and then both refused to pay towards it. It's not your job to subsidise the whole bloody lot of them - it's not right that they all keep committing to things and then flaking out and leaving you to foot the bill.

I do think you were wrong to ask your mum to move in - looking after grandchildren who live in the same town is entirely different to leaving your home to mind kids in someone else's house. Although I got the impression from your op that it was helping out rather than full time childcare. And she did help your sister do I can see why you felt that help should be available to you too.

Good know you've said already but if there's any doubt, stop with all the gifts and picking up the tab for your siblings. This all needs to go back to a normal family relationship, if possible.

I get that's frustrating but it's also entirely normal when you have two young children. You get way more help than anyone else. I think you need to clarify and have clearer expectations with your mother whether this is a holiday or whether she is being asked to work for 2 weeks. You have made assumptions, I think, about what would happen and your mother has made other ones. To be fair, if you and your OH are both on holiday it does seem odd to need or expect any other help. It's normal for the mum to look after poorly DS if DH is also poorly. I think you have come to expect things to be different for you though and perhaps picking about your reasoning there might be helpful. Your brother's behaviour was clearly inappropriate by the way. Threatening violence is despicable. I can see why he might get cross that he thought he was paying for your mum to have a holiday and you have just taken her as staff. If the former, yes reasonable for him to pay half. If the latter, of course you should pay it all.

This is one or those threads where it would be interesting to see the dm and dbro pov I suspect op lords over the fact she earns more. Who expects childcare on holiday from a family member? The holiday should have been thanks for helping her out giving up her time. If your dc are ill you parent them yourself like any other normal parent would. Your a cf of the highest order.

What a messy situation. I don’t think you’re appreciating how much your mum has done for you. Live in Nanny for £500 a month!! That’s a massive ask and a massive favour. I expect she’s exhausted. I also wouldn’t expect my family to care for my sick child in anyway.

I can’t see they are resenting you for being well off, just resenting you for expecting they can afford to pay to your level of holiday.

back off from this all. You can’t buy respect and love from your family with expensive gifts.

You need to find alternative childcare, no family members, and for goodness sake just go on holiday on your own. You’ll have much less stress and drama. If you can’t afford to pay for such a nice place on your own then you need to cut your cloth better. Do Christmas on your own this year.

reset this weird family dynamic, family shouldn’t be transactional.

Oh and keep well away from your brother. He sounds dangerous and unhinged.

Banana 🍌 what a ridiculously horrible post

If op is literally funding everyone of course as a thank you what harm is there in offer to baby sit supposed beloved grandchildren and nieces and nephews!

These people are supposed to love pp and her dc.

I also suspect they feel used/pressured however in Which case....don't go on the holiday!!

Yikes, what a mess! Sounds like they are taking advantage but with the expensive gifts and paying for meals/holidays etc you're giving an image of being happy to splash the cash.

Stop paying for everything, put your children in nursery while you're working (and look after them yourselves the rest of the time!)
And stop being so transactional with gifts - they should be tokens of how much you care, not values to be totted up.

You are treating your mother like staff. This cannot be healthy. You describe your family as money grabbers, but I think you have a seriously messed up idea of family values too. Why on earth would you expect your mother to do full time childcare for two children for £500/ month ? You'd never get a live in nanny for that.
Your family are not your staff, no matter how much money you have. Let your mother go home, make other childcare arrangements and start the relationship with her again based on affection not expectation and money. Ad stop with the expensive gifts. I'm sure you mean well, but it may not be received in the way you intent...

What do you think other people do when on holidays or when the children are sick? We don't all pay slave wages for 24/7 childcare, some of us have to suck it up and look after our own children.

Stop comparing yourself to your siblings and get off your high horse. Nobody forced you to buy all these extravagant gifts.

OP I don't think it would have mattered how much you gave your mother for childcare or how many holidays you paid for, etc - your mother when combined with your brother on holiday were spoiling for a fight. They want to have arguments with you. If your mother doesn't want to provide childcare, then she is perfectly capable of stopping.

I think this family dynamic is now so unhealthy that I'd avoid them both for a long period of time. It must be galling to see childcare provided free of charge for your sister and you meant only to do good by paying your mother, but she resents it and so does your brother.

They are treating you like a cash cow and being vile to you as well and have turned into hangers on. I would be surprised if they were motivated by motives of getting more out of you. Providing childcare and then kicking off about it is possibly designed to make her seem indispensable and your brother is acting like her manager. Just cut them both off financially and pay for childcare, it will be a relatively short phase of your life and be over soon enough.

I think YABU - your mum was so exhausted by your childcare expectations she asked for two weeks off 'just to go home and rest'. Did this not set alarm bells for you? For an elderly lady needing a holiday to rest? Your two children are clearly too much for her to look after. Use your money to pay for childcare and dont go cheap on it.

£500 for giving up her normal and you getting live in childcare is an awful offering on your part.

Do you keep a spreadsheet of what you have gifted your mum .. sounds so.

Money talks to you yet not to them I think.

Also when your child is sick ... most children only want their mum in their situation.