To say you take both or you don't get DD

[jamoncrumpets]

I have two children, DS is nearly eight, autistic and has additional needs. DD is four and neurotypical.

Neither side of the family has ever offered us practical support or help with DS, never offered to babysit or take him out. The only help I received with him was a few hours while I had planned c section for DD and then my husband had to go home by teatime to put him to bed.

DD is growing and developing at the same rate as her peers, she's a very funny and outgoing little girl who makes us all laugh. We put a lot of effort into giving her our attention and support so that she doesn't feel resentful of time that we have to give to her brother, who she loves.

She is getting to the age now where both sets of grandparents are talking about having her go to their houses to stay, or taking her on holiday. But when they talk about this they only ever mention her. Never my son.

My heart says you don't get to pick and choose which of my kids you give this attention to. But I don't want to deny DD happy memories. AIBU?

@PinguIglu Exactly. It always - ALWAYS - comes out on Mumsnet threads about autism but it's best to know that that's what people secretly think of us no matter how nicely they try to dress it up.

I think it's very naïve to downplay the significant impact an ND sibling can have on a child's life. The siblings of children with additional needs most often find that their needs and wants are sidelined and overlooked on a near-constant basis, through no fault of their parents or their siblings.

You did not just say that…

My sister isn’t just ‘in a wheelchair’…

I agree with XmasElf10 and your family sound great.
@jamoncrumpets if your family can’t or won’t do the same for both children it is a shame. It’s very hurtful to exclude one child, sadly a child with ASD is going to be left out in lots of situations during their lifetime they don’t need grandparents adding to this.

@MolliciousIntent Yes, for example, my NT sister resented me so much - and I'm very, very high functioning - that she joined in with my school bullies tormenting me for it. I don't speak to her now if I can avoid it so it's not like the resentment can only work one way, nor is it always poor saintly put-upon normal siblings.
Again, I'm not being naive, I know OP's DD will have her own difficulties, but I hate the undertones of how her life will be so difficult etc etc because of her brother with no care for how the brother's disabilities affect his life. And from what OP's said about the grandparents' attitudes, that as soon as his disabilities became apparent their interest tailed right off, and that they're relieved that the DD is "normal" - it's not unreasonable to think that these attitudes are fundamentally ableist because they are. How more blatant do you have to get?!

Well said @PinguIglu

No worries. I think one poster read my post wrong. As I said, my sister has ‘extensive difficulties’, including LD. She’s not just ‘in a wheelchair’, as they said.

What I was trying to illustrate is that while she’s clearly, obviously, apparently very disabled, because we’d all been raised the same, treated the same, no exceptions made for anyone, I didn’t define her by her disability(ies). And I never really put a label on it until I was a teen, when I had this moment of weird realisation. Which I quickly moved on from.

We never felt angered or hard done by because her needs were probably greater than ours. We didn’t see it. We all had chores and responsibilities at home, our grandparents took us all or none at all, and as such we all have a great relationship and I think a very healthy and inclusive mindset about any ‘differences’ a person might have.

OP,

I've seen from another poster that you've also got autism. How were your parents with you growing up? Did they treat you the same as your siblings (if you have them)?

It’s interesting the the majority of parents with ND children are saying it’s both children or nothing. Cut contact etc.

Yet most of the people who have ND siblings are saying how it would have been very helpful for them to have this time away from their sibling.

So OP, it seems to be your choice is to appease your own feelings or appease your daughter’s (even if she feels too guilty to voice those feelings)

Well I'm going to say YANBU - it's one thing if they had expressed equal interest in them until now and said something like, "obviously we'd love to take him on holiday but we're assuming DS wouldn't like a break with us because he'd become distressed out of his routine".

But they clearly haven't.

I think your not wrong in that it would be lovely if your parents stepped up and got more involved with your son but the reality is that seems unlikely based on what you've said. ( what ever they're reasons)). The question is around is it fair to deny your dd this opportunity as a result. I'm not sure that it is )

I know that in your shoes, I would feel equally aggrieved. However, I can understand the perspective of the grandparents just as easily .

Can you have an open conversation with them about how they spent time with your son? Taking him away for a few days may feel too challenging for them but they could spend one on one time with him in shorter, regular bursts?

Your children can’t be treated equally they have very different needs but they absolutely can be treated equitably in terms of quality time spent with each.

Having time away from your siblings doesn't have to mean you go off with GPs or aunts/uncles or whoever. The ND child could actually go and have some time with relatives and the other child have some time away from whilst staying with their parents. It doesn't have to be the ND being left behind all the time.

YANBU. I wouldn’t. They need to recognise you have two children, they have two grandchildren, who are both worthy of their attention.
I’ve seen the other side of the imbalance of attention. My current and previous partners were both the least favoured child, which continued into adulthood, and that also brings issues. I remember my mum being so upset when my auntie took me and my cousins to the cinema. She said she’d take my brother, who had some behaviour issues, on his own another time but never did. Kids know and whilst it would be great for your DD it would equally be not-great for your DS.
The grandparents need to start small with activities with both children (or one and then the other like suggested earlier) before they build up a relationship and enough experience to take them away. Is this something you and your DH could facilitate?

But that isn’t an option. The option is the daughter gets to spend time away with her grandparents alone or she doesn’t.
Whose best interest is it that she doesn’t?

Spending time with GPs who aren't interested in a vulnerable little boy who happens to be their GC? Doesn't seem a great option, I think she's better off with OP who seems a very caring and involved mother.

Maybe someone needs to have a word with the GPs about their attitude and the upset it is causing.

I had the same as you. DS with autism and younger DD. She’s not bitter but I think my DD always thought her DB got more attention because of his needs. They’re both adults now and DS has overcome a lot of his issues, but don’t deny your DD nice things for the sake of your DS. Don’t forget grandparents don’t have the same understanding of autism that you do and the may think they couldn’t cope with DS

It was in May this year to be fair OP so 5/6 weeks ago that’s how you were describing your sons needs

Not offering to take ds out alone doesn't mean they don't love him.

Do they engage with him? take an interest when you talk about him? Buy equal Christmas presents? If so then they do give him attention and love they just dont feel able to take him alone.

Please can I ask what you wanted from this thread OP?

Was it to simply to verify your thoughts that family who don’t spend time with your DS don’t get to spend time with DD?

Or was it to try and see other people’s points of view and potential solutions? You do seem upset about people trying to do this, although the stance of some members of your family is understandably causing you resentment for the sake of your DS.

What would you like to see happen in the long term? I imagine that ideally you would like your family to be involved in the lives of both of your children in a way that supports them in a positive way. Like it or not, if this is any chance this may happen you might have to try and enable it. If it doesn’t work- it would be a dreadful shame, but at least you tried.

I’m sorry op, I know it’s heart breaking to see your son left out and feel like he is being rejected.

Im a disability parent and the one who everyone leaves their kids with but no one offers to have my kid because ultimately people are shite!

I don’t have other children but if I did I would let them go.
Siblings shouldn’t miss out on any more than they have to accommodating their siblings needs and cutting off her nose to spite someone’s else’s face isn’t actually going to improve anything for your son, only take away from your daughters experience.

So I would feel just as cross and resentful and protective as you do of your son, but I would send her on the holiday and day trips anyway because that’s what’s best for her

I think it’s awful that they want to spend time with one and not the other.
even having your son for an hour with something he could do every now and then would have been something and would have meant they got to know each other better. Even an hour in his own home whist you popped out.
Taking your DD away on night and holidays but not him is totally cruel and I would have thought made him feel crap and unworthy longer term.
for me it would be spend time with both (in ways they can manage) or neither.

My son has autism i have 5 kids my mum took them all.She sadly passed 2 years ago but before that she made a massive effort in understanding my ds needs she built a strong bond with him.She would simply just ask him if he wanted to go if he said no that would be fine but she loved it when he said yes!She was like a second mother to all my children.Also she would always sit down with my kids before taking them somewhere and explain un detail what they were doing and at what time so my ds felt more at ease 😌

YANBU

I am absolutely positive that the casual and accepted ableism without our society is why you are getting the responses you are.

EVEN IF your sons needs were complex, you would not be unreasonable.

You are NOT trying to force your family to care for your Son (and from what I have gathered you would be correctly hesitant of this anyway given their non-interest in him). You are NOT trying to wrangle childcare for either child.
You are expressing very understandable and logical concern about Grandparents obviously and unashamedly favouring one child greatly over the other.

Both kids will notice, eventually. Which leave me completely agreeing that until they are both fully armed with the information and confidence needed to protect themselves emotionally, you get to do that for them by restricting access to toxic people.

And that's what it is, to completely ignore one child due to additional needs but favour the other. Toxic.

It sounds as if your kids have a good relationship, and it sounds as though your DD would be able to hear and understand an explanation of why she doesn't go on these holidays/stays once she's a bit older? I'm sure you're arming them both with age appropriate info about discrimination and both of them will witness a LOT of it given your families circumstances.

You have said your DD is not missing out on developmentally appropriate activities because of an incredibly high level of 121 care for your son. But can I say as someone who grew up with a sibling with needs so far eclipsing anything approaching normal, (DSis's disability was so extensive that any caregiver needed training really) - that despite the challenges this presented and the fact that yes, adjustments had to be made for us other kids at times so we could do things while Dsis did an alternative or was home or at school...
Not a single family member (who remained in our lives and wasn't themselves just a toxic sort) would have EVER opted out of my DSis life just because she was difficult to care for.

And if they had, we would have dropped them faster than a burning poker, without looking back or regretting it. DSis was a person, and despite being non-ambulatory, non-verbal, tube fed and with regular seizures, she was a real human child and our family pretending she didn't exist would have hurt ALL of us.

You sound like a good parent. Do not doubt yourself because of the responses you have had here.

If both of your children were neuro typical would they be treated in the same way? Because if this is the case it’s appalling. Having additional needs doesn’t mean that they should be left out. I feel for your son as he will realise he’s been treated differently to your daughter.
i don’t think there’s anything with inviting one child to do something, as long as the other child gets the same opportunity at some point too. I would have a chat with your parents. Not sure why you’re getting such a hard time, OP. It’s not unrealistic to expect family to treat your kids the same.