This is not ok, is it? DH and DD.

[Thistledew]

DD is two years and two months.

For some reason she is going through a phase of resisting going to sleep. We do bathtime, story and then I close her blinds, put on some soothing music and her sparkly lamp and usually stroke her hair until she falls asleep.

Except for the last week or so she has been resisting sleep and at the point where normally she would be about to drop off she will sit up, play with her cuddly toys, ask for a breadstick, demand another story etc. Bedtime should be between 7.30 and 8pm, but we have been lucky to get her asleep by 9pm recently.

Today seemed particularly bad. It was passed 9pm and she was still not settling to sleep. As she kept trying to get me to play with her toys with her (and as I was getting frustrated) I said to her that I would not sit in the room with her but would wait outside until she was ready to go to sleep. She kept trying to follow me out so I was telling her to get back in bed and that it was sleeping time.

DH noticed me struggling and offered to take over. Unfortunately, DD only wanted me, and got upset and was trying to get past him and get out of the room. DH’s response (which I saw on the baby monitor) was to repeatedly push or drop her back into the bed, or to grab her legs and move them back into the bed as she tried to get out.

I could tell things were getting more and more fraught so I went back in. I picked up DD and she was shaking, but after a very quick cuddle she indicated she wanted to get back into her bed and then after one further very short story she was asleep.

I said to DH that I did not think it was helpful for him to manhandle her like that. She was getting more upset and it was not helping her to settle to sleep. It looked more like an attempt at discipline than helping her to go to bed. His response was that he had no other options and that he wouldn’t help at all in the future if his efforts were not good enough.

I replied that if he really couldn’t think of any other way than manhandling DD then yes, it would be better that he didn’t get involved.

AIBU that his treatment of DD was not appropriate? From listening to her she sounded cross rather than frightened, but it still clearly was not helping her calm down and settle for sleep.

Exactly. Fgs manhandling are you serious? She was doing this because she knows you pander to her. I have done this to my son, firmly put him back into bed when he was doing this and it worked. I guess I was manhandling him 🙄

Would I handle a non-sleeping toddler in the same way as your DH? No.

Would I sit and stroke their hair til they fell asleep? Also no.

I would say that neither of you have gotten this quite right.

Children need clear boundaries and you don't seem to have any at all. The language you've used in this post is really dramatic and I think you're being a bit precious. When you say your DH "pushed" your DD I presume you mean she went to get up out of bed and he firmly pushed her back down again. And then you said he "dropped" her on the bed horizontally from "nearly a foot". I don't think that's conducive to getting relaxed for sleep but it's really not going to do her any harm at all. And there's really nothing wrong whatsoever with him swinging her legs back into the bed when she's trying to get out.

And after she's thrown a massive tantrum because you're out of the room and your DH is being firm, what happens? You go in and undermine your DH by reading her another story.

I'm very much in the gentle parenting camp. But you need to be clear, consistent and sometimes firm. You are creating a rod for your own back with your sleep routine and you're not actually helping your DD either. She needs to learn how to self-soothe rather than only being able to sleep if you stroke her hair until she nods off.

You and DH need to agree how to tackle this going forward and then both adopt the same approach. Preferably one that doesn't involve you sitting in her room half the night until she decides she's prepared to attempt sleep.

You and your dh need to sit down as adults and decide how you will do the sleep routine going forward so you are consistent

he sound like he got frustrated but only you know what his true character is and whether he’s a risk to your dc

but tbh it sounds like your dc has learnt how to get more attention from you and is playing up rather then settling to sleep

It sounds like the shaking with fear is the MN shaking with rage.

The problem is OP, you need a better bedtime routine. Of course he's going to put her back in bed, of course your toddler doesn't like it. What your toddler wants is to be allowed to run about messing around past her bedtime like you let her.
He is actually parenting. Mumsnet rarely sides with the man/dad, YABU.

Stop being a drama llama and learn how to parent together as a team. That might involve you listening to his opinions now again!
And stop lying there stroking her to sleep, she needs to be able to go to sleep by herself.

You do a great disservice to children who are actually abused.

a 2 yo getting out back to bed is not abuse
FFS

Say what?

shes said herself their DD wasn't upset, just cross. She said DH hadn't & wouldn't hurt the kids. FFS. He was putting her back to bed & not pandering to more stories, more fuss, more hair stroking.

Every time you pick your child up you're using physical force of some sort, particularly if you are doing so to stop them doing something they want to do. Sleep trainers advise that you should keep putting a child who tries to get up back into bed. It's not abusive.

No, it isn't OP's own language. She specifically says her child was cross rather than frightened.

Because this is a toddler demanding it from the adult who is already giving her their sole attention, as an alternative to going to sleep. And she needs her sleep.

If your DD is trying to get up to play with her toys, you need to get them out of the room. You also need to make it clear before she goes to bed that there are going to be no more drinks or snacks, and stick to it. Also get into a routine where she has one or two stories/20 minutes' reading maximum and after that she goes to sleep, i.e. she is clear that you are not going to be pushed into reading any more.

What he did didn't work. What you are doing isn't working either. You need to work together on a new plan and then split nights as evenly as possible so you are both consistent.

Ridiculous that people are suggesting his behaviour was abusive because the DD was cross! My toddlers' favourite game is being gently dropped or lightly tossed onto a bed or sofa! I have frequently held a small child down to administer medicine or even finish changing a nappy.

Yep, I agree with this too. I've manhandled my dc's back into bed many times.

2 is a baby more than anything else. I'd be horrified if either of us treated any of our children like that, it's totally disrespectful. Ours are 11, 10 and nearly 5 and being pushed around is not something we model as being appropriate behaviour.

If she’s still napping in the day then it’s time to drop the nap!

As you can see many posters have done the same as your dh including myself. It's a man so he must be abusive on here. op you are the one creating the issue here with all the faffinv around and pandering to bedtime antics.

No. She specifically says to place hem in the bed but not at the mot to make then lay down or you will end up wrestling with them!

rapid return means letting them get fully out of bed and placing them back as soon as they attempt to leave them room.

Yes I agree with this. Often the parents with children who won't settle do pander to them too much. Maybe he shouldn't have pushed her down but was it particularly hard? When our son won't settle (also 2), as long as he's safe etc we will leave him to cry for a bit. 9pm and still reading stories is far too late.

Did you put them back on/into the bed or did you drop/push them onto the bed because there is a difference?

Im surprised how many MNers are happy with this tbh.

I come from a generation who was chased around and smacked etc but I don’t ever remember being pushed or chucked at my bed. Probably because being treated like s**t at bedtime isn’t conducive to sleep.

Shes probably becoming too old for patting to sleep but there is a medium between the two approaches surely? Try tucking in and reading another story. Or an audio book. Or singing in a very quiet voice. Lots of things to try.

The answer is somewhere in the middle

This. The cheapening of the term 'abuse' is really bad on this site and not at all helpful when it comes to giving useful advice

There’s nothing wrong with lifting a child and putting it on or in its bed but that’s not what the op is complaining about. Her DH was pushing etc the child enough to cause additional distress. At the least it’s a crap technique and it didn’t work.

This for me too

God I’d cut him some huge slack. Your parenting and relationship will be better if you support and empathise with each other when, inevitably, you lose your shit over something to do with the kids.