Debating between these two countries. Which is better to bring children up in?

[Mixedfeelings89]

England or America. I am from England, Husband is American. We are not rich, nor poor therefore we would be living a average lifestyle. My only concern is which country will be better for the children? If we didn't have children I wouldn't really care which country either way. I just want the best for the children. Children are not yet school age, if that makes a difference.

Thanks in advance.

I lived in the US and had babies there - with midwives!
It's not true there aren't midwives. It's just a very different set up. I must admit, I loved the fact that as soon as I asked for an epidural, an anaesthetist appearead a minute later.

I loved the US, we lived in a blue state, low crime, excellent schools. For me, I still prefer the UK for many reasons overall. Personally I find the politcal direction of both UK and US terrifying but even more so in the US.

I think the thing that I find particularly scary in the US (and it impacts society as a whole) is the lack of a social safety net. You can hit rock bottom very quicly and you have to really be on the bare bones of your ass to be able to get welfare (and from that also medicaid depending on the state and the extent to which they have expanded it under obamacare). The way insurance is tied to your employment is totally messed up as a system (yes, it works when you have a good job but what if you don't? what if you want to go freelance? Your're screwed!)

My kids are US citizens having been born there so they may choose in the future to move there but for now I would say UK would be better (although actually we currently don't live in either 😀)

US=Gilead (with the exception of the west coast, Pacific North West, and parts of the north eastern corner)

UK=Not quite Gilead yet, but certainly heading for Panem and pretty much already at Oceania...

Bit of a rock and hard place decision really. I'm presuming Canada or New Zealand or the currently-still-safe bits of Europe are off the menu?

Well the fact that every time you wave your child to school you may never see again as they could get their heads blown off may just swing it for me.

Have a read through all the (very few) replies that are for America. They all gloss over it or don’t mention the whole kids getting shot in schools risk. How they can park that issue in their brains and not think about is daily is astonishing to me.
Maybe you become desensitised to it (not a good thing.)

Then throw in the whole erosion of women’s rights..Land of the free. Really?

You couldn’t pay me to live there.

None of those ‘benefits’ make up for the fact that since 2020 guns are the leading cause of death for children and teenagers in the US.

But it’s ok because they can’t get an alcoholic drink until they’re 21..they can buy a machine gun at 18 though.

We get our vaccinations for free too so no not a reason to live somewhere where school kids do ‘shooter drills’.

And not needing a passport?! I like my passport and I like Europe and travelling. So that’s not a benefit either.

And the education system is crap. Kids are often years behind. So no the schools aren’t better either. Can’t think of any benefits at all to be honest.

I've done both- but I would NEVER live in Florida, so I'd say England without a doubt.

I’ve lived in Florida and England. In Florida your children will be exposed to the most conservative politics, racism, and poverty imaginable. There’s a massive drug problem. Conversely, there are loads of conservative Christian churches. It has a certain beauty if you like the ocean. Stay in England.

That’s not quite right - you have to be “ordinarily resident”, but if you move back to the UK as a British citizen then you become ordinarily resident the moment you step off the plane.

You are right that if you haven’t actually moved back but are just visiting on holiday (ie if you still have your home and/or job overseas and fully intend to return there to live) then you are liable for an NHS bill.

@cushionpillow Spot on, 100%! 👏👏

This. The US is a different world, indeed.

Does it have to be the US? What about Canada? Does it have to be the UK/England? What about Ireland?

Depends if you have girls or boys doesn't it? If it's girls then you are basically make her grow up in a country where her rights are valued less than a gun!

Love your pov 🤦🏻‍♀️😂😬👌

The one good thing about being American is traveling abroad. I used to think Americans had a bad reputation abroad, but it is nothing compared to the Brits. It must be so embarrassing!

Even Americans are ashamed of Florida.

I'd love to hear more.

I would say America but it depends where? Somewhere forward thinking like california would be great.
But you will have healthcare costs etc
Uk is a grim pace idiolgically now. I left a few years ago I will not return

Why does it have to be either?

Why not look at your ideal lives and see where gives them the greater chances and opportunities

The UK isn't perfect by any means. But I would hate to bring a child up in the USA. The gun culture alone would put me off. But there are many other reasons too. Not least being the recent ruling about abortion.

The one good thing about being American is traveling abroad.

This is hilarious. Nice one.

Though I guess you don’t need to travel abroad to be embarrassed as an American currently. The whole world is looking at your country with horror for many reasons.

That’s not to say I’ve not been ashamed to be British before. Especially with regards to Brexit, Boris Johnson etc. It’s quite clear I’m not a lager lout so I’ve never felt any embarrassment due to that. But I’d take that over mass shootings that as such a regular occurrence you don’t even think they’re a problem. Everyone seems completely desensitised to it over there. We’ve seen people accuse us over here of being ‘hysterical’ about guns. I’d be a hell of a lot more than hysterical if children getting shot in school was a regular occurrence in this country. I wouldn’t just brush it under the carpet. Awful behaviour. Do something!! Don’t just accept it.

Loooool.

I have definitely had a better reception abroad when thought of as American rather than British lately. To the extent of being told "At least you're not British" in Thailand.

The position of the "loud American" on the worst-tourist-league-table seems to have been well overtaken by the "loud drunk Brit" trope.

Again - more brushing domestic issues under the carpet.

You’ve gone backwards about 60 years in terms of womens’ rights and children are at risk of getting their heads blown off every time they go to school. But at least you don’t get as drunk as the Brits abroad eh?! What a strange set of priorities…

I am American and am not ashamed of Florida.

I also don’t think appreciating one’s own country and culture means you have to look down on others and try to downgrade them.

I'm from the US, have lived in the UK 10+ years.

I miss my home, I miss family and friends and how welcoming small communities can be. That adults are willing to make new friends. That we can grow proper tomatoes and aubergines and other things that need long, hot summers. That I could afford a house with a huge garden on my modest salary. That the roads (in the areas my family live) aren't full of potholes, the parks have amazing stuff for kids and of course so many places are gorgeous (warm ocean to swim in!). I miss how well-funded universities are, they have incredible facilities.

Now I don't think I'd go back. I'm not sure gun control will ever happen. I couldn't bear for my daughter to grow up doing active shooter drills from primary school, and wondering where the next mass shooting will take place. I lived in a quiet, respectable neighborhood there and there were still random gunshots, or hollow-point bullets I'd find on the pavement when walking my dogs. That was 10+ years ago and it hasn't got any better.

I couldn't send my daughter to university there in good conscience, knowing she might not receive adequate healthcare if she got pregnant, because of religious zealotry. There's the feeling of helplessness over the electoral college and gerrymandering that deprive thousands of Americans from being represented by their government.

You can have a great life there if you have money. If you don't have good health insurance and have an accident or an unexpected illness, you're screwed.