AIBU to start tough love with DC5 re food

[Twocrabs20]

So, I have a DC, 5 years old.

On advice from various professionals, I did baby led weaning, I have offered healthy food at meals, and while they eat some food:

• many types of fruit


• some protein such as eggs, pork sausage and bolognaise sauce - they won’t however eat fish or any seafood products or chicken; and


• a range of carbs.

They simply won’t eat any vegetables and are extremely fussy, which is starting to impact the eating habits of their younger sibling - who does enjoy a wide range of foods.

I feel like I have reached a point of something has to change; and NOW, that this habit / power game of refusing perfectly pleasant child friendly meals has got to stop. My DC is overweight for their age (not massively, but enough), and they can’t be getting the nutrients they need to be their best self. And I feel like I’m failing DC.

None of the suggestions by the various dieticians / nurses / paediatric consultants as to how to get them into eating vegetables has worked. I have tried every suggestion under the sun, including: I have grown stacks of vegetables they will pick but won’t eat; DC will cook vegetables with me and not eat the vegetables; and DC won’t ‘taste’ any of the vegetables even in small portions.

We have continued scenes of DC having tantrums that they don’t want any vegetables on their plate, even though I explain the vegetable has to remain on their plate, even if they don’t eat it. But I encourage DC to taste it, but not to take it off.

AIBU to now start some ‘tough love’ in now forcing DC to eat some vegetables or some part of our family meals which is beyond carbs and pork / bolognaise.

I dread doing this, and I don’t even know how to do tough love with eating - save for perhaps having a stand off with DC that you can’t leave the table unless you eat / taste said vegetable or re-serving any uneaten meal at the next meal, so they can’t wait for something better to come along. However my sense is the whole ‘they’ll come round to eating vegetables eventually’ simply isn’t going to happen; unless I take some significant action now.

My DC is increasingly becoming more overweight, and I think their poor diet will have impacts with their socialisation at school, ability to learn, and be the best version of themselves.

If anyone has got to the point of ‘tough love’ re food, what did you do, and were you successful in changing your child’s habit?

www.jamieoliver.com/recipes/pasta-recipes/seven-veg-tomato-sauce/ Definitely read the hack at the bottom about roasting the veg it's much easier. Bag it up in small quantities and freeze. Slowly substitute your tinned tomato in your Bolognese?

Id also agree with reducing portion size of carbs and snacks other than fruit/veg and keep offering veg

also if he has a texture thing over soup perhaps try raw veg or al denta incase it's a mushy texture issue.

www.hollandandbarrett.com/shop/product/nutrigen-vitamixin-sprinkles-60033521?gbraid=0AAAAAD96OoJtJmfcHV4b2p70aB7Ak5YhL&skuid=033521&utm_campaign=shopping&utm_medium=cpc&utm_source=google&&gbraid=0AAAAAD96OoJtJmfcHV4b2p70aB7Ak5YhL&gclid=Cj0KCQjwzLCVBhD3ARIsAPKYTcTBjnbV_9-QFCiwIVqPqBnfpQ-IFYdBEd2MMyPDQCSDQ26Z076KNNwaAnEKEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
these are amazing- no taste and really easy to hide in any soft food or drink - no gritty texture.

I was “forced” to eat food by a teacher at school I clearly remember vomiting cabbage back onto the plate and still being made to eat it. It took me years to get over it and I rarely if ever eat green vegetables/carrots/mash/roast potatoes just looking at cabbage makes my stomach turn. I’m now middle aged and am exceedingly healthy. On weaning knowing that being a fussy eater causes issues I encouraged both my DC’s to eat a varied diet is farting then a bit of everything but my older DC never wanted to eat vegetables, I never made anything of it just served him food he liked, in contrast my younger DC would literally eat anything. As children my older DC never had a days illness my younger son multiple admissions to hospital for chest related conditions. As adults my older DC is still not mad on vegetable he’ll eat some my younger DC will eat anything probably averaging 10 portions of veg/pulses etc a day he has far more colds/throat problems than the older one.
OP just leave him if you “force” him you are likely to scar him for life.
I have this theory that we don’t all taste/smell things the same way I loathe peas even the smell of them cooking turns my stomach (pre incidence of being forced to eat veg at school) my older son was once telling me the same thing in contrast my younger son thinks cooking peas smell divine.

YABU to force your child to eat anything that they don't want to eat. I was forced by my father, and by my primary school teacher, to eat things that I didn't like and was left with lasting issues. They forced me to eat foods that I couldn't stand the smell or the taste of, like salad and vegetables, fatty meat, mincemeat, liver, to the point that I had to wash down things like cold cabbage with water while gagging.

As an adult, I now only eat carrots and peas and no salad stuff whatsoever. I eat some fruit and I eat potatoes.

If they had left me alone, I may have grown to like some of it, but being forced to it it until I was 11, left me with lasting damage. I was in heaven when I started secondary school and could choose my own lunch and started to stand up to my father at home (albeit I was still shouted at for not eating the food, he couldn't physically force me at that point).

I think for me it was very much a sensory issue, I couldn't stand the texture, smell, taste of so many foods. My childhood was miserable thanks to adults forcing me to eat this stuff and to clear my plate of it.

What worked for my DD to get her eating veg, was eating school dinners. She eats all sorts of veg that I don't eat, because she ate it at school with her friends. But if they had forced her to eat anything, I would have put her onto packed lunch.

There is NO WAY that I will do to my child what was done to me. Please don't do that to your child.

i have a teenager with ARFID (avoidant restrictive food intake disorder) he has never voluntarily eaten ANY fruit or veg in his life, his diet is almost entirely meat/carb/sugar based and he isn't fat... infact he's skinny. The only veg i can get in him is what i can hide in bolognese sauces, the tomato sauce on his cheese pizza, and the bit of fruit in the fruited bread he eats daily. I have managed to get him to take vitamins in pill form as 'medicine' (as he's got older i've managed to explain its necessary because of his restricted diet, but when he was little it was medication)

Your issue where his weight is concerned is you're feeding him too much, its not about whats in it.

Force feeding and making a song and dance about meal time is the absolute worse thing you can do with a picky/fussy eater, whether its normal developmental pickyness, or the start of a more serious issue/eating disorder like ARFID.

Stressing them out will make them more resistant to eating, it'll make you all miserable, and will traumatise them and give them an even worse relationship with food.

You need to just feed what he will eat, in correct portion sizes and remove the stress from meal times from all of you.. he is likely to do better with food as he gets older if this isn't ARFID or a sensory related issue.

save for perhaps having a stand off with DC that you can’t leave the table unless you eat / taste said vegetable or re-serving any uneaten meal at the next meal

My mum did this... The hill she decided to die on was a steak and kidney pie (which seems a weird one as I can't imagine many 5 year old would have eaten it without complaint). She served it breakfast, lunch & dinner for 3 days. I didn't to eat for 3 days and went hungry instead. Did it make me eat the steak & kidney pie? No.
Did it make me eat other things without complaint? No.
Did this help her in any way to make me less fussy? No.

Yes, YABVU

My 6yo son has food aversions and sensory issues, which I suspect yours does too, as young children don't persistently engage in "power games" with an adult when it brings them nothing but their parents ire. To force him to eat that would be like forcing you to eat food scrounged from the bottom of a bin, or a dead spider. It wouldn't kill you, but it would be unreasonable, distressing, cruel and certainly something that would affect you emotionally. It doesn't matter that you know it as healthy food. His brain knows it as horrible, and even if you make him have it, it will still be horrible, but so will you

Is she definitely overweight? If so, adding in some vegetables won't change that.

A PP asked if those lunchboxes were for between breakfast and teatime/supper. Are they? If so, way too much.

I suspect it's because it's a little girl, and OP knows that what she's doing is looking for justifications to control her eating. I question the idea of children going on diets of any kind. They are still growing and changing. I was listening to a podcast recently with a woman saying her mum put her on a diet when she was 11 because her body shape was changing due to puberty - she was putting on weight because she was growing! It caused her lots of issues, including obesity and a binge eating disorder in later life.

"tough love" will set your child up for a lifetime of disordered eating.

Little Anecdote: my Brother wouldn't eat anything except peanut butter sandwiches, mashed potato, corn and chicken nuggets for years. He wouldn't eat sauce. His food couldn't touch. No known sensory issues etc. My mom just gave him what he liked to eat and always offered him what we were having. Eventually as he grew up be wanted to try things. Now as a grown man he eats everything - everything! More adventurous than me and I was the one who loved brocolli and sprouts as a toddler!

My own 4yo is quite fussy though he will eat some raw veggies. I used to serve him exactly what we were eating and tell him that was the only option for dinner but we started getting into food battles and 'how many bites?' Lots of tears etc. Now I give him what we're eating but adapted a bit - sauce on the side, raw veggies instead of cooked. And I try not to discuss what he's eating and how much. It's taken a lot of the stress out of it. We all enjoy meals more and I think that's crucial - making meals unpleasant will not improve eating habits.

I also agree that starting small is good. One bite can be celebrated. Everytime he takes a bite of something he doesn't like he's one step closer to developing a taste for it in future.

Another thing is that I have cut down on his snacking and moved his dinner a bit earlier. He has one snack at 3pm and sometimes another piece of fruit. Usually he's really hungry for dinner and sometimes forgets to complain and just eats it!

OP - I get it. It won't work but I know how tough it is

I have 3 fussy children and I have had enough of it as well. I have started refusing to give them snacks. So dd8, dd5 and dd3 will have breakfast (cereal and toast) and then if they are hungry at 10 I will offer fruit. If they are hungry they will eat it and if not then that's fine. I have had to put up with whinging but they are getting used to fruit or nothing.
For lunch and dinner I make them what I'm going to make them. So sandwiches, fruit and crisps for lunch and whatever I am cooking for dinner. I try and make sure the flavours are not too adventurous so spag Bol or shepherds pie or chicken in white sauce etc. including veg. Then if they want to eat it great, if they don't then that's fine too but nothing else is offered. If they want anything sweet (yoghurt, chocolate bar, lolly) then they have to have eaten at least half of what is on their plate.

They are getting better at eating but not amazing. But I'm not cooking silly numbers of different dinners nor are we snacking in the afternoon so they are trying more things. We also eat quite early - 4 or 5 to try and catch the after school hunger!

I had eating issues as a child. What helped was getting older. I always ate absolutely loads of fruit but hardly any veg. I like basically all veg now. My parents used to be frantic and would bribe, cajole, plead and attempt to force. I just got thinner, and more stuck in my ways.

I would cut portions, serve a wide variety of fruit and lay off talking about food with your DC. My three are all slim, but good eaters because I took an extremely laid back approach and acted like I couldn't care less what they ate. They didn't fill up on crap because I didn't buy it.

NRTFT but from what I’ve read they sound like my oldest, now 10, she absolutely refused fruit and veg, would gag at it, this had a knock on effect with my 8yo copying her. My youngest however loves fruit and veg. Only one eats yogurts or drinks smoothies too.

I would not force it. They get to an age where you can negotiate with them and in my case they will at least try. My 8yo has suddenly started to eat peas, my 10yo will eat an odd roasted carrot & pick at lettuce. They have gotten better, some of it is due to their friends, they will ask to try something their friend likes. Usually it dosnt work but they do try.

Things I’ve done to disguise veg, blend as much into spag boll, shepards pie or general mince dishes, meatballs, burgers, tacos, lasagna etc as possible, capsicum is great as it’s full of vitamin c. Tinned carrots blend better than fresh and less noticeable I use to blend veg and mix it in with pizza sauce to put on home made pizzas. As they have gotten older I don’t blend it as fine so they do have it with bigger bits of veg now.

mine refused things like spag boll for ages due to the tomatoes so I’d just make it with beef skock. I’ve now built them up to eating it if I really blend the tomatoes so their is no lumps (I don’t like jar sauces).

If they won’t eat gummie vitamins you can buy liquid ones to hide in drinks.

I would follow the advice and make it a non issue - serve at the table and they get to choose what they want from the meal you've made - you eat the veg / salad as usual - you can add table sauces and dressings and just keep going for 6/9 months - no fuss - and then see how things are - if you've managed to get them to have a small amount of something or not! If not then back to the drawing board

I would keep meals simple for now - pasta Bol and a salad, it will be dull for a few months but hopefully with the non issue and with them being safe on knowing that at each meal there will be something they like then the control or whatever is motivating them will go and mealtimes will be relaxed - maybe they won't eat lots but it will be normal to have some veg - good luck - I think a. Lot of us have been there .....

I did this kind of thing - well I didn't reserve meals but I insisted on them trying stuff, and hey guess what it worked. I just used to say I'm not putting the tele on after dinner til you try 3 bites. Or if you want dessert you need to try 3 bites. Half the time it's a control thing and actually you are their parent not their friend and part of being a parent is occasionally imposing some consequences on their choices. No you can't make them eat it but they don't get to watch TV if they don't! My Lo's eat a really varied diet and genuinely love their food now, the 'tough love' did not put them off eating it ever again as some on here claim it will!

I had a child that would happily eat veg when weening but developed an aversion to everything bar broccoli so we had several years of whizzing up a tomato and veg mix before adding to minced beef for bolognaise which she was fine with. Choose your fruit for the lower sugar fruits, will she eat yoghurt? Try her with full fat plain yog and berry type fruit - far more satisfying than low fat sugary fruit jobs. I would continue with a central plate for her to try things at her pace. Please do not go down the force it route esp if there are other issues at play. You may need some outside help as often they will respond better to other adults (ie not parents/guardians) in terms of being compliant and just putting it in their mouth which is where things should be starting.

I do get the frustration though - she is now at 16 getting more adventurous although still baulks at lots of veg - but will happily make from scratch pasta sauce with fresh toms, onion and garlic even though she wouldn't touch a fresh tom in a salad - she will eat cucumber and lettuce, carrot sticks raw and pepper raw - just not cooked!!

Just seen the lunch boxes, that is quite a lot of food.
I remember seeing on Mumsnet re the 5 items in a lunchbox idea. So a sandwich/wrap. A portion of fruit or veg, which I know is difficult for you but honestly, I’d stop with the choice and just include 1 option.
Then a portion of dairy/dairy alternative, so yogurt/cheese cubes.
A small portion of day, popcorn or a chopped up slice of ham/few crackers.
Then a drink.
Honestly it’s plenty, and if your child is anything like a lot of 5 yr olds it’s all they have time to eat at school.

Ugh at the idea of 'doing it for attention'...

That phrase triggers a conditioned emotional response in me...

If someone, a child, an animal, anyone.. is 'doing something for attention' then either..

They're not getting enough attention.

or

The attention they're getting is not right sort/quality etc.

Either way, something is wrong.

Children do not sit and ponder ways to get parental attention, children NEED attention, if they're forced to seek it in maladaptive ways, there is a problem and almost certainly it is the parent with whom the problem lies.

But most children with serious food issues absolutely do not want that attention, in fact the attention they're getting is a huge part of the problem.

I can recall how bad that felt, that everyone was looking at me as I cried and gagged over food. That I felt so hungry it HURT but I couldn't put a certain sort of food in my mouth without retching loudly.

And if I did miraculously try something, the so called praise.. the sarcastic, patronising 'see it WASNT THAT BAD'... 'see you WERE JUST BEING SILLY'.. undermining how I felt, minimising my distress... that was frankly worse than the 'eat it or you'll get a slap' type shit.

There are crunchy, orange-flavoured vitamins too from a big brand, which go down very well in our house. Might be worth trying. I do agree with most of the people posting replies: a tough approach could create more issues now or later. It could also be deeply stressful for you! This all sounds difficult enough. One of my children has been very fussy pretty much since birth and it all goes back to genuine digestive problems, which have revealed themselves slowly and painfully. I think I beat myself up a lot in the early days and felt like I was a bad mother for not providing good enough food. I wanted to be the mother giving her child homemade beetroot hummus, not the one feeling relieved that said child had managed to at least eat some quavers for Christmas dinner! As soon as I relaxed a bit, things did actually get easier. Best of luck!

Your kid isn't overweight because he doesn't eat his veggies. He is overweight because he is overeating. And overeating on the unhealthy stuff. Which you give him, as he doesn't eat "anything else".

In my country there aren't any fussy eaters. Simply because parents wouldn't be able to afford to give them "special dinners". So kids eat what they are given. And if they dont want jt? That's fine. But you aren't getting anything else,that's for sure.
!and that is not 'tough love'. That's reality. And I definitely believe that fussy eaters aren't born. They are created! By moms mostly.

Give your kid his dinner for lunch. If he doesn't want to eat it? Fine. He can eat it for dinner. If he refused again,then go to bed on an empty stomach . (He is overweight hell be fine) next morning some healthy breakfast and give him (a different!) Dinner for lunch again
And tell him if he doesnt eat it he can eat it for dinner.

This wont last long before the kid will give in. As before this time he knew you were a pushover and you let him get off the hook. Dont let yourkids become fatter and unhealthier.youll create huge problems for him on the long run. You need to do better.

Can you do a reward system? Star on the chart for licking a veggie etc., work towards a special treat. Then up the game with a nibble etc etc.

Just anecdotal but… My DB was a really fussy eater at that age, and no one forced him to eat, but my mother couldn’t afford to waste food or offer alternatives. So it was eat what everyone else is having or go hungry. Mealtimes were slow and he usually left a lot on his plate. He was thin until he was around 20, then he started to bulk out and eat more like regular people as it was affecting his love life! He’s now in his 50s, eats pretty normally and enjoys good health. I don’t know if that helps or not but I hope you manage to find a solution.

There's a book called Deceptively Delicious, which has brownies made with beetroot, and lots of other recipes with a LOAD of hidden veg. Maybe worth borrowing from the library or buying on eBay or Amazon.
As others have said, it's not the lack of veg causing the obesity, it's the carbs.

Do not do tough love. Make a meal, and if they leave the vegetables, don't give anything else. They will soon become hungry and will be open to trying it.

If they refuse multivitamins, there's a new Robinsons (I think) cordial with added multi vitamins. Not ideal but better than nothing.