To not have made my son share

[Noshare]

At a soft play type place today and my son was playing with something, another little girl kept coming up and trying to take it off him (both about 2.5). I kept politely saying 'sorry sweetheart he's playing with this one' and giving her something else which she'd take away and play with for a bit and then come back.

My son can get a bit fixated on certain things so he was playing with this for about 15 mins.

Anyway, the little girls mum came up and asked my son if he would share it now and let her have a turn and I said 'hes playing with this at the moment but as soon as he's finished she can have a go with it'. She scoffed and said don't I teach my children to share. I replied that our definition of sharing obviously differs.

They were like blocks in different shapes but she wanted the specific block my son had even though she'd piled up the others which were practically the same if that makes sense?

If he was on a swing or something and it was the only one then I'd of course tell him to let someone else have a turn now after a certain time but I don't think sharing means just giving someone what they ask for when they ask for it if that makes sense? There were plenty of other things practically the same as this item her daughter could play with.

Was I being unreasonable and failing to teach my son to share by not making him just hand over what he was playing with the moment he was asked?!

Posted too soon.

Next thing you'll be quoting Sarah Ockwell-Smith.

I don't care what theory the next profiteering opportunistic comes up with. You absolutely shouldn't be leaving a two year old to do whatever they want to another, as long as there's no physical harm.

Harm isn't only physical.

And role modelling isn't always good enough. Children need active care, attention and guidance. You owe it to them.

I think there's a lot of lazy parenting going on, quite frankly.

@DontLookBackInAnger1 it’s great to disagree and discuss.

The low expectations comment is in response to @EveryFlightBeginsWithAFall who said their DGD would not do well independently and would be unable to navigate other children wanting to take toys. They have low expectations of their DGD in this setting - they do not expect that they would be able to achieve these things. They literally (well through sarcasm) said they that their expectation of what a 10 month old is capable of in this scenario was low.

Yeah I really don't think saying I don't think a 10 month old should be left in the under 2 ball pit of hell to nurture her independence means I have low expectations of her 🤣

CocoCactus I have absolutely no idea how you were brought up but we prefer to treat children as individuals in my family and not leaving toddlers and babies to it in soft play hasn't harmed any of us yet

@DontLookBackInAnger1

You absolutely shouldn't be leaving a two year old to do whatever they want to another, as long as there's no physical harm.

Harm isn't only physical.

And role modelling isn't always good enough. Children need active care, attention and guidance. You owe it to them.

I absolutely agree with all of this. As would all respectful parenting/Montessori/gentle parenting advocates. It sounds like you have misunderstood these approaches and have gotten them confused with ‘permissive parenting’ which is an atrocious approach. I would also add in firm boundaries to your list as absolutely essential

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I think there's a lot of lazy parenting going on, quite frankly.

Me too. Especially those who sleepwalk into parenting by unconsciously perpetuating harmful norms.

She's almost 10 months old! She only started crawling today. How on earth do you think she is going to stop other older toddlers taking toys off her

Honestly you sound like you've never met a baby now bever mind a toddler

I mean , I might be wrong , she might suddenly stand up , chase them down and take it back. Or have a full blown conversation with them about how she's playing with the toy and they can't have it but it's unlikely isn't it

I cannot understand some of the reply’s to this. If one child has 10 toys and another has 1 toy, why on Earth should that child have to give it up?? He’s 2.5 years old and having a lovely time. Why would you risk a temper tantrum? The other child should be taught she can’t have other Children’s things when she has plenty of her own.

I don’t think you are understanding what respectful parenting is advocating. I said ‘leave her to to it’, not ‘leave her’.

Being child-led and fostering independence is not about just leaving children and ignoring them. It’s about closely observing whilst giving them the freedom to figure out stuff for themselves. E.g not meddling when children take toys from eachother. A 2yo will not be damaged by another 2yo taking a block from them. It’s not some terrible tragic event, it’s a learning experience, which you can talk about with them, validate and acknowledge their emotions around it.

@CocoCactus and if the child who loses the toy lashes out, is that ok too - a learning experience for the child who takes it maybe?

@EveryFlightBeginsWithAFall

She's almost 10 months old! She only started crawling today. How on earth do you think she is going to stop other older toddlers taking toys off her

How on earth will she learn how to respectfully and politely stop older children taking toys off her if you interfere in every interaction?

I mean , I might be wrong , she might suddenly stand up , chase them down and take it back. Or have a full blown conversation with them about how she's playing with the toy and they can't have it but it's unlikely isn't it

If you allow her socialization to be uninterrupted she will experiment with these kinds of ideas. Should she let go and allow the other child to take the toys away? What happens if she holds on tightly to it? If she does ‘share’ or offer something to another child, how does that child react? It doesn’t matter about the toys, play and learning is about the social interactions. Maybe she’ll be upset she lost the toy - you can acknowledge that and help her feel validated. She will find another toy to play with. More lessons.

When you force children to share before they can truly understand what that means, the result is to make “share” a bad word in their minds. Children share naturally, much later, when they begin to feel empathy, which they learn through modelling.

It depends what you mean by lash out? If it is aggressive then they’re signalling that they need your help in that moment controlling their impulses and keeping everyone safe.

Emotional outbursts and meltdowns are really important for development, but how beneficial they are depends on how they are dealt with.

And yes witnessing the impact of snatching toys is definitely a learning experience for the snatcher. Much more effective than an adult using words to tell them it is wrong.

Are you being serious? She'll learn when she's older than getting on for 10 months.

Right now the only thing she'd be learning is oh look, that bigger person just took my toys off me and I can't move to get it back

Especially as it sounds like you with your respectful parenting wouldn't bother stepping in and telling your toddler not to take toys off babies

Children shouldn't be forced to share yet it sounds like you think it's OK to force smaller babies and toddlers to share because they can't stop bigger kids taking their toys. Bonkers

I think it was fine, she had all the others, sounds like she would have been annoyed if he had taken one from her pile. Your son is entitled to his fun as well, it's a soft play setting and it wasn't the only block.

I don't see how anyone can think you were BU!
I wouldn't have given her it either, or I would have asked her to swap.
And if I was her mother I would have told her to leave your son alone because she has plenty.

@EveryFlightBeginsWithAFall

Are you being serious? She'll learn when she's older than getting on for 10 months.

Do you think she’s not learning stuff right now? 10 months is one of the most pivotal ages for socialisation.

Right now the only thing she'd be learning is oh look, that bigger person just took my toys off me and I can't move to get it back

A valuable lesson. By cosseting a child you are preventing them from experiencing mild discomfort which sets them up with an inability to handle failure.

Especially as it sounds like you with your respectful parenting wouldn't bother stepping in and telling your toddler not to take toys off babies

I absolutely would. Respectful parenting involves firm boundaries - if a toddler is snatching from babies then they are testing boundaries and they need to feel reassured that you are consistently holding those, in order for them to feel safe. But if my baby is being snatched from I’m not going to assert boundaries over someone else’s child, I’ll just let my baby learn from that interaction.

Children shouldn't be forced to share yet it sounds like you think it's OK to force smaller babies and toddlers to share because they can't stop bigger kids taking their toys. Bonkers

The bigger child is forcing the sharing, not the adult. You can’t control children’s interactions with eachother, you can only model and guide.

What does an adult intervening teach them? That they must depend on you? How about in a few years time when you’re not around? The lessons learned at 10 months will still be instilled when they are 3 years old.

Maybe you should have made this clear in your OP and you wouldn't have to keep repeating yourself. No, she didn't need the block and you didn't need to hand it over.
15 mins is amazing for a 2.5 Yr old to be absorbed in a task and I would not make my child hand over one block if another child already had all the rest in the play area.

I assume your son is an only child? otherwise he would probably already know about sharing. The thing is, teaching children to share is something we do before there is a situation requiring the sharing. My kids were all taught that when they were out, playschool, events, parties....that the toys were not theirs and they were allowed to play with them, but not exclusively. They understood that they got five minutes then had to share. Im doing the same with my grandchildren...at present the three year old is having problems sharing and will often have a full blown meltdown when a toy is removed for the use of another. But when he offers the toy...he is praised sky high...eventually he will get it.

What does an adult intervening teach them? That they must depend on you? How about in a few years time when you’re not around? The lessons learned at 10 months will still be instilled when they are 3 years old.

It teaches them that it isn't okay to take from someone smaller just because your own mum isn't there. It teaches whatever it is a child gets from playing for 15+ minutes with a toy they don't normally have access to. It models how to say "no" in that situation.

I'm not saying there isn't plenty to learn from not having a parent step in, but there's also plenty there when they do and most kids are probably best off with a bit of both.

I don’t think ywbu at all. If anything the little girl and her mother were. She had all the blocks apart from the one your son had. Now I would call that greedy and if it were my child would point out that they had lots of blocks and to leave your son alone to play with the one block he was quite happy with.
When my child was small I had a friend whose child was the same age and who constantly wanted whatever my child had. To the extent that they could have the exact same toy/book and her child would still want to swap toys. She would always facilitate and give them 5mins turns. Our days out were a constant round of wingeing over whose turn it was and it drove me to distraction! Conversely another friend with a similar aged child was happy for the kids to sort it out between themselves which in my experience worked a darn sight better with only occasional intervention required.
Obviously when it came to equipment at the park etc I always encouraged turn taking.

You haven't considered the full consequences of this approach. You are actually teaching the child that authority figures will not help you even when you are defenceless, that's a really awful message. Until they can engage and speak, little children do sometimes need their adult to advocate for them.

At 10 months, realistically her only defence will be biting, so you'll get a biter pretty quickly and that's tricky to train out. Are you going to let the bigger kids carry her off into other bits of soft play too? They will if nobody intervenes, kids love to play with babies. Lovely, but needs monitoring or it can become unsafe quickly. Part of your job is actually to protect your child.

@MRex well said.

@NumberTheory This is not modelling. Modelling would be when someone tries to take something you are using and you politely say ‘You want this, but I’m using it right now, you can have it when I’m finished’.

But yes I absolutely agree with you, children need a bit of both, guidance and the chance to figure out stuff for themselves. This is what I have been saying throughout.

Most people in this thread seem to have their wires crossed and have confused ‘respectful parenting’ with ‘permissive parenting’

@MRex yes little children often need advocates, but not for every tiny squabble, if someone’s being rough or repeatedly taking away every toy they play with, of course an adult should step in to guide them. A one off incident when someone tries to take a toy from is not going to harm them, it is a lesson in social interaction. A 10 month old is not defenceless. Many times I see an older baby cling to a toy and screech at the snatcher and the snatcher backs down, they have learned how to stand their ground.

If the snatching is too rough or habitual then yes a parent needs to step in. It depends on the context, but all children need some opportunity to practice these interactions under close supervision. It’s a nuanced approaches.

You are teaching them that an adult will step in if someone is too rough with them. By stepping in to the most minor disagreement about who can play with this toy you’re teaching them that petty squabbles are a big deal. They are missing out on the chance to foster resilience and figure out together how to solve this stuff. They will be really peed off when they get to school and no adults steps in to adjudicate minor squabbles on their behalf.

Great example. Kids are far more receptive to a self-generated vision of fairness compared with some arbitrary adult version of justice imposed on them. Whining is a result of children not possessing the emotional resources to handle that particular situation. They do not have the resources because they were never given the chance to learn them for themselves, so now they’re totally dependent on adults. Sounds like hell.

Neither of you are wrong. You are both trying to teach your kids the best way. Just as much as sharing the little girl has to learn she can’t always have what she wants.

The thing with situations like this is that two toddlers wanting the same toy often results in two parents arguing over it.
How do the toddlers interpret this? Seeing their mums arguing over them wanting the same toy?