Having children isn't viewed as an achievement, the same way having a successful career is

[gagablacksheep]

Just wondering what people's thoughts are on this.

Having children is the hardest thing I've ever done, yet, I feel like, as the majority of people have children- it's nothing ' special ' that you get any kind of pat on the back for, in the same way you would - if, say you had a very successful career.

The kind of social standing that comes with being very successful career wise, just isn't the same, as being a mum. Most people can be ' a mum ', but most people can't have very successful careers.

Is it just me, or is being a mum just a bog standard thing, that seems a bit 'thankless' in the eyes of society ? Sorry if I've not explained my feeling and thoughts very well.

@ForestFae

Despite me not doing any of those things, you keep justifying anyway

Seems like it's a you issue

Should probably be more confident in your choices

I’m very confident in my choices, thanks.

I don't see Brits embracing the multi-generational home (and I grew up in one)... We are an individualistic society...it's the main reason why we even have this thread in the first place.. Brits see themselves as individuals first and foremost rather than in terms of their relationships in the family network....

I was saying to someone else earlier, I think the culture in the Uk regarding children and family life is really cold and horrid.

@ForestFae

You fly off the handle an awful lot for someone who's confident

And you’re very obsessed with SAHMs and our choices for someone who doesn’t feel guilty about their own.

By the way, what do you think I lack confidence about? My kids have everything they could ever want or need, I bought a rural home when I was 25, i have a wonderful loving husband I can do whatever I want because I’m not bound by the shackles of work. Yes I’m so upset by this, pass the Kleenex, it’s such a tragedy. 😂

@ForestFae

Again, why would me pointing out a fact make me guilty? Guilty about what?

Your opinions aren’t facts, but you’re arrogant enough to be unable to differentiate. The way you raised your kids

@ForestFae

It is a fact that all sahp need some kind of external help. Thats not an opinion.

Why would I feel guilty about how we raise our kids?

You’re redefining help to push an agenda. You tell me, you’re the one with an axe to grind!

@ForestFae

I'm not redefining help

Schools and extra curricular groups and clubs all definitely help. I believe the wider community also helps.

I dont have an axe to grind. I'm discussing the points raised during the thread, lots of which I disagree with, just like you.

(Except I'm not having wee temper tantrums and being personal)

So if you're confident despite getting annoyed, why would I be guilty ?

You are. That is not what’s meant when people talk about “help raising kids”.

Its odd, because you seem to praise any comments that are pro career yet demand in depth essays from SAHMs. Almost like you’re trying to convince yourself.

@ForestFae

Its what I mean. Its what people mean when they say it takes a village

Nah, I just think the sahms are chatting shit. They're the ones that sound like they're trying to convince themselves. I've not asked anyone for an essay.

I dont need convincing that having a career is a great thing

Exactly this!
It’s a shame OP couldn’t even answer the simple question of why should anyone be thanking her and who?
I mean all we know OP’s kids is going to grow-up killer or rapist etc, why should anyone be thanking for that.
OP really just wants to make herself a victim of her own choices.

I think what the poster is trying to say is that society doesn’t VALUE the role of motherhood or acknowledge that it is indeed a specialist career in order to raise happy confident hardworking compassionate honest etc children or that indeed it is a 24/7 career which often encompasses other aspects of career ie financial ,management etc & these days often alongside a further job/career whilst juggling a third”career” of being a good wife !
and we blame men for devaluing our role in society 🙄.

TopGub - You are on every thread about SAHMs, going on and on about 'the SAHMs' as if they are a side in a war against you. You are clearly very triggered by their very existence. You have also talked openly about the fact you are not NT. However, in this thread, you must be just having a laugh, surely?

Of course everyone interacts with society - libraries, shops, buses, doctors, neighbours, schools, randoms in the street, friends, family members, cinemas, leisure centres, supermarkets, restaurants, hairdressers, dentists - you name it.

What SAHM has ever claimed to not have intersections with the above? This is so ridiculous.

But when parents are talking about 'childcare' they are referring to -

A nursery setting
A nanny / childminder
An arrangement with a family member

Or - they might not use any of the above. Because they are SAH, or two parents who organise their work so they don't need to.

I can't believe I'm even having to explain this.

@catculture

I am not on every thread about sahms. This thread isn't even about sahms. I am not triggered by their existence. I just disagree with a lot of what some of them say.

And I most certainly have not openly spoken about the fact that I am not NT, I'm not sure who you are thinking about but its not me. (Is that supposed to be an insult BTW?)

You didn't say childcare. You said any external help. Youre having to explain what you meant because your post was unclear. Thats your issue, not mine.

And you still haven't explained why this mythical idea of not using external help or even not using childcare is even relevant to the thread

You dont need to be a sahp to be a good parent. The vast majority of parents work and parent, a fact some sahm are clearly 'triggered' by.

That poster is disingenuous and doing it deliberately imo. They’re a sea lion.

Nobody has said you need to be a SAHM to be a good parent. Nobody has said this TopGub.

You seem to equate being a SAHM with 'thinking going to work is bad.' This is NOT true. You are projecting that.

Most women are just SAHMs because they want to be and they can be. There's no more to it than that and it's no reflection on anyone else.

@ForestFae

🙄

Unfortunately I don't have a snappy phrase to describe someone who can't cope with being disagreed with or counter points made.

It’s not about disagreement, it’s about you twisting words, asking bad faith questions, taking your opinion as fact and acting like anyone who sees things differently is wrong.

@catculture

Now who is being disingenuous?

Lots of sahm are sahm because they dont have choice. They can't afford to work.

Some think its better for their family.

And some absolutely do think that mums specifically (never dads) shouldn't work. That not working is better. That working is damaging even

When someone posts on a thread about the value of work v the value of parenting that sahms do it without external help, it really isn't much of leap a to see that as a dig at wp.

@ForestFae

What words have I twisted? What bad faith questions have I asked?

Are you not also very confident in your opinions? You said you were? Are you know saying you think you might be wrong?

Do you think I'm wrong? You told me I must feel guilty more than once

When someone posts on a thread about the value of work v the value of parenting that sahms do it without external help, it really isn't much of leap a to see that as a dig at wp.

Thats your own insecurity talking, no one else. If I say I value the role of a SAHM and I see it as preferable to work, that’s not an attack on you. That’s me talking bout my values