Was I too harsh on teen daughter?

[MumofTeen22]

NC for this.

Backstory: teen DD (15) - a few months off turning 16 - is really, really lazy. I have to beg and bribe and nag to get her to help with the smallest of tasks at home. It's draining. All she wants to do it be out with her mates and asks for cash and lifts everywhere etc.

This whole week I've been off work sick with an awful tummy bug / virus. It's absolutely wiped me and youngest DC out (toddler who I am home looking after whilst trying to keep on top of household tasks etc). DH has been working long hours all week. I've had to hold onto kitchen counters at points to steady myself and try not to pass out whilst trying to get jobs done and look after my youngest, I've felt so ill with this bug. But I've had no choice but to keep going.

Teen DD has not offered much by the way of help despite seeing how unwell me and her younger sibling are. At a couple of points I begged her to help as I was really struggling and she did so, but very reluctantly.

Yesterday she announced "I'm out with my mates tomorrow, I'll get the bus to meet them" (bus to the nearest major city from where we live). I said that was fine so long as she didn't rely on lifts from me as I'm not well enough. She said nothing about Sunday and to be honest I was distracted with bathing the youngest so didn't ask what her plans were on Sunday.

So she went off out this morning before youngest DC and I got up. DH at work doing overtime as we need to money. So as per usual I'm just getting on with it all - housework and looking after youngest etc. But still struggling as not feeling great.

Teen messages me about holiday clothes purchases so I reply. I then say "by the way please don't make any plans for tomorrow as I'm going to need your help at home, I'm really behind with the housework this week as I've been ill and DH working again". She texts back: "I've got plans tomorrow with my boyfriend, it's been arranged for ages". I replied: "well you're not going, I need your help".

She then called me saying how it wasn't fair, this has been planned for ages etc. i just snapped at this point - probably a combination of feeling so rough and her selfish lazy attitude all the time. I would never have agreed to todays outing if I'd known she had plans Sunday - I'd have made it clear she needed to be around on at least one of the days to help out.

I said to her "Listen to me - you either get yourself home before 5pm today (this was at 2.50pm) and pull your weight and do some jobs, or you can forget about going out tomorrow and help me then instead. You've got just over 2 hours to get here. Your choice. But don't think I'm going to change my mind - one minute past 5 and you're not going. I'm serious."

Then i hung up.

By the way 2 hours is plenty of time on public transport to get home if she had started to make her way home straight away or within the next 10 mins.

So AIBU to have given her this ultimatum of making a choice: she either loses her day out tomorrow and helps out at home, or gets herself home at a reasonable time today and helps out, and keeps her outing tomorrow?

She's since messaged to say she's on route and it will be "just past 5" when she's home, followed by a "sorry".

Was I harsh??

@Hutchy16

i said that her comments about her daughter sound as if she doesn’t want her. And I asked her if this was the case.

This is my one and only reply to you because you are so beyond unacceptably offensive that I do not wish to engage with you beyond saying this:

OF FUCKING COURSE I LOVE AND "WANT" MY DAUGHTER!!! But her behaviour is pushing me to the brink of sanity and I've had enough of her selfishness, to the point that at the tail end of a shitty week of illness and looking after a sick toddler, I snapped and gave her an ultimatum - help me tomorrow or come home in 2 hours time. I didn't lock her in the cellar, I didn't hit her with a broom, I didn't ground her for a month or refuse to feed her, ffs.

I'm human with human emotions and my daughter pushed me to express them. Then I came on here for support because I felt so guilty about asserting a small boundary with her! Does that sound like a child I "don't like"?! Asserting a small boundary made me feel fucking horribly guilty. It's precisely because I love her so much that I felt this way.

So - your "analysis" I'm afraid is way off the mark and frankly, fucking shit, as well as offensive.

Take it elsewhere.

For me it’s the fact that you’ve changed the goalposts suddenly with no warning, you’ve been building resentment about her behaviour but never changed your behaviour to make that change happen. Lots of harsh posts on here but there is a definite sense of externalising any control about this. If you want things to change, you have to change what you’re doing.

I do agree with this, you seem so annoyed with her, yet have facilitated many of the behaviours that annoy you.

Ideally you would have phrased it differently and / or set up consistent expectations already - but it's not too late to do that. And what parent hasn't lost their shit at some point, especially when ill. We're not perfect.

I would definitely sit down with her this week and have a chat about it. Explain the situation from your perspective and the impact of her not contributing. Listen to her perspective too. And ask what are HER suggestions on how to do things differently? It may surprise you.

Also whining is normal, but don't let whining mean she does nothing. The human brain doesn't fully develop until 25 so she's 10 years away from full empathy.

Maybe harsh, on the other hand, there was no way you could schedule being sick. And it rather sounds as if being harsh is the only way to get through to her that you are serious about needing help.

Christ I really don't understand all the grief the OP is getting. When I was 15 I travelled across Europe on my own...all this girl is being asked is to do some housework because her mother is recovering from illness and needs some help.

I know teenagers are selfish little bastards at times and it didn't even occur to her to offer to help, but realising that the world doesn't revolve around her will do her the world of good...as well as realising that Mum has feelings too and can be pushed too far.

Why are parents so wishy washy with bloody teenagers these days?
My now 26 & 33yr old sons had jobs to do right from the age of 3 - yes three.
They helped with little jobs like putting washing in their drawers or dirty in the washing basket and dusting which progressed to bigger jobs as they got older. By the time my youngest was 10 he could cook, clean, do the washing, weed the garden and he budgeted his allowance. By the time he was 12 he could easily have run my household singlehandedly, there were even times when I drove to the supermarket and he went in with a list he'd compiled and my debit card and came out with the week's groceries.
I will add that I'm disabled and a single parent so needed their help around the house because I wasn't always capable of doing it all myself.
They did these tasks workout complaint because they'd grown up doing them, we had lots of valuable/quality family time and activities and they had very good financial allowances.
Fast forward to now, they are both in good jobs, know exactly how to look after their homes and finances and regularly thank me for teaching them how to do these things as they have friends and colleagues who really don't have a clue because their parents mollycoddled them the way so many kids are these days.

So, my answer to any parent who says their kids refuse to help around the home is that you've brought it on yourselves, start teaching them early, reward them for doing their share of the household tasks and they'll thank you for it later.

sounds like my teen, lazy and entitled, will do whatever she please whenever she pleases but I ask for her to clean her room or stack the dishwasher and she turned around and said, "this isn't my house" I pay her phone bill, her TV subscription, music etc everything she refuses to get a part time job despite being part time at school and the overall attitude is ill only speak to you when it suits me or when I need things! you weren't harsh at all, dont listen to these comments, life lessons!!!!!

At her age we were definitely expected to help with household tasks, no IFS or buts. I can't believe all the responses here saying she's a child entitled to her own plans.

What dreadful parenting where children are not expected to contribute to the running of family life! What entitled selfish arseholes people seem to be happily raising!

If your child won't get a job there's obviously an issue. Sit down with your DD calmly and go through your household bills, show her what it would cost if she was to leave home.

Really break it down to her.

Wow, I can’t believe the responses saying OP was harsh and it’s unfair expectations etc- of a bloody 15yr old! She’s old enough to have a boyfriend, start work experience, driving lessons, go gallivanting around town on her own- helping her mum with a few chores is the basic minimum, even when her mum isn’t unwell!!

However, it shows an appalling upbringing if ‘doing nothing at all’ is the norm for her. Even my 8yr old son has more empathy- he knows I get dizzy in the mornings due to pregnancy so brings me a glass of water when he’s up, whenever he sees me a bit tired and sitting on sofa he offers to make me a cuppa, just the other day we were sorting out all the Lego in his room and I pulled a muscle- straight away he asked if I needed my shoulder massaging and wanted to take a break- that’s normal compassionate behaviour of a child seeing their parent in need, it really is not normal to be a selfish ungrateful teenager!

And it’s nothing to do with ‘wait till he’s a teen’ as I have many equally well mannered and courteous teenage nieces and nephews! This kind of behaviour seems particularly rife amongst British teens, as I’ve not witnessed this ‘teenage= self absorbed arse’ attitude anywhere in Europe or America, and definitely not in Asian or Middle Eastern cultures.

However, it shows an appalling upbringing if ‘doing nothing at all’ is the norm for her*

WTAF is wrong with people? "Appalling" upbringing? Do you maybe want to rethink the ridiculous hyperbole?

To me, an "appalling" upbringing is one with abuse or neglect. One where there is no love for the child.

Perhaps "an upbringing where mum has for whatever reason been a pushover far too often and not asserted boundaries"?

I can tell you this - in my day job I work with people who are the product of an "appalling upbringing" and it looks nothing like my daughter's - it's the polar opposite in fact!

I'm done with this thread

Thanks again to the posters who have shown support, and all those who managed to express their views without being downright offensive.

That's what I meant by you saying she wants to get rid. The context of your comments is clear. You also asked her if she saw her daughter as a leftover from a "previously failed relationship", which was also horrid, because you have no idea why that relationship ended, it could've been down to abuse. There's definitely someone coming across as unpleasant, and it's not OP.

Thank you for this @Youaremysunshine14

Exactly- that poster has no clue about what happened in my previous "failed" relationship. It's absolutely disgusting and it's made me seriously re think being on this site. It's a toxic environment and I can't believe some of the nastiness MNHQ allow to stand towards a person. I'm very disappointed with them and I think it's the push I need to leave this site for good (been on here a long time under a different name).

For anyone in doubt - here's an example of how to express a viewpoint that you don't necessarily agree with someone's approach, without being a total arsehole.

Thanks @jacks11 for this balanced post, which is helpful, challenges my thinking, and yet is sensitively delivered.

I wish there were more posters like this on here (and others I have mentioned).

Many of you seem to have remarkably low standards for how your children behave.

Ideally you would have phrased it differently and / or set up consistent expectations already - but it's not too late to do that. And what parent hasn't lost their shit at some point, especially when ill. We're not perfect.

Thank you @Tigofigo.

Thanks @EarringsandLipstick

The very idea that my daughter would be "heartbroken" to discover that, after asserting a small boundary with her as her parent which is something I'm clearly not great with in general, I felt such guilt about being too harsh that I made an anonymous thread on a parenting site to ask if I was indeed too harsh on her.

"Heartbroken" to discover her mum struggles so much with the harsher / stricter end of parenting that she doubts herself when she does it

I mean, I could understand "heartbroken" if my thread said "AIBU to consider giving my daughter away because I really can't stand the sight of her?" Yeah. That's "heartbroken" territory.

Jesus, the lack of critical thinking ability and emotional intelligence is just astounding.

So why wasn't he doing anything to help in the week beforehand given you've been ill for a week?

Plus to be blunt life goes on, shifts or not, why can't he like many people have to, do something when he's finished?

I don't disagree with her helping around the home. But I do think that it's unreasonable of you to cancel her plans effectively for tomorrow and her to curtail her day. Majorly unreasonable and a piss take tbh.

You're the parent and as harsh as it is, she's the child and not responsible for your housework and child you've had with the new partner.

She may well not pull her weight, but you've also not instigated anything before now. So why would she be?

You're not well. It's hardly the end of the world if the hoovering is delayed! And there's still another adult that could be doing it!

I think you are being completely reasonable. I wouldn't expect her to do all the work, but helping out when you are poorly is a decent thing to do and she needs to learn that.
If she pulls her weight tonight then she can have her day with her bf tomorrow.

@ChoiceMummy

I'll assume you haven't read all my posts with regard to how much my DH does. Can I suggest you do so, please? I haven't got the energy to repeat (again) what he does around his working hours.

OP, please ignore all the posters that have said you have been harsh. You have absolutely done the right thing. A 16 year old should have chores that they do daily especially when you have been so ill. I am not surprised a lot of teenagers are so badly behaved with all the post I am reading here

I completely agree. Seems alot of people let their kids walk all over them and expect no responsibility. Very strange.

Then if he's so angelic, there was no reason for this to unfold at all was there?

I don't disagree with children helping the household.

It's the manner in which this was done that was unreasonable.

And the issue here is that the op has no instilled this behaviour and expectation for the daughter to be involved with household tasks to date and you cannot suddenly expect a 16yo to be a mind reader and know today's the day she'll unreasonably go off on one!

And as I said before, there are two adults, the partner has only just started the overtime so had 5 days beforehand he could have been assisting in his home as an equal adult.

I have two main questions:

1. why you posted here @MumofTeen22 since you obviously have no doubt you were right
2. why you’re being such a martyr to the housework when you’re ill.