Husbands Burial Plot

[Bellysmackers]

My first husband died in 2004. It was a very tragic accident whilst we were living overseas and we were both in our late 20s. His family never really bothered with me much afterwards. Never visited me etc. I always felt like they resented me for being the one who survived. Fast forward 10 years later I came home to find a gift on my doorstep from them that just said 'sorry' on it. A bit too little too late for me. I text pleasantries etc from time to time, but we had little contact. Then suddenly out of the blue recently, one family member got in touch via text being friendly, asking how I was etc. I fell for it (like an idiot), thinking there was genuine care there. BUT- she followed it with asking if I would consider signing over the ownership of my husbands grave to them as it would mean a lot and they feel this is the right thing to do as his immediate family. I have literally never even heard of this and would never consider it anyway ( and told her so) but can anybody think why they would want this? Has anyone heard of this before? And AIBU to say no??

TheFlubQueen I think your post is closest to how I feel. I'm not a vindictive person, nor would I have any issue with internment. I think what upsets me most, is that even after all these years they still can't just be honest and respectful. They have always been underhand and manipulative and now I understandably have an element of paranoia where they are concerned 😟

The real issue is trust. If his family had maintained a cordial, respectful relationship then it would be much easier for OP to consider their request.

As they don't consider OP as the family of her husband, there is a risk that she could be erased from any mention on the headstone which would be incredibly hurtful.

Visiting a grave is not policed so OP's ownership is not a hinderence to that. Allowing their ashes to be interred if permissible by site rules would be a kind gesture, but I would not transfer ownership of what happens to be a valuable asset, both financially but more importantly an emotional asset to people that couldn't acknowledge the validity of my relationship and grief, and were untrustworthy.

This. Sounds like they've not been nice to you at all since their son's death, but as you've moved on I don't see being "tit for tat" would make anyone feel any better, including yourself. Yes, he married you but other than sex he'll have shard an intimate relationship with them fir far longer than your marriage, I can understand why they see themselves as immediate family.

OP I'm sorry for your loss.

Do people on here really think that if young widows remarry then their love for their first husband is somehow diminished?

I just really don't understand the train of thought.

Regarding the burial plot and its ownership I think you are being entirely reasonable not to hand over ownership. If they have been underhand in the past then it is quite possible that they will erase mention of you on the headstone. The fact that you have remarried is irrelevant to your love for your first husband. You shouldn't have to remain single for eternity after a tragic loss in order to 'earn' the right for the love of your first husband to be acknowledged.

Perhaps write to your SIL to explain your feelings and to say that it is not an objection to your PILs ashes being interned it's just that you are his wife and you feel that you would be being disloyal to your DH to hand the title over.

It is a difficult situation and I think some of the comments on here have been very unkind.

but that marriage is over- you marry until "death do us part"

I would say this is a difficult concept to process.

Anyhow, who knows what happens after death, etc? How do you know the OP would not rather 'be' with her first husband and not the second when in 'heaven' etc. It's not so simple and the OP doesn't sound ready to make any permanent decision ATM

The logic by some on here of “he was their person first/longer” absolutely baffles me.

When a child dies before a parent, the parent will always have been in the deceased’s life longer than the will spouse have…. But in the UK, the spouse trumps all other relationships, as it should.

When he made the choice to marry OP, he knowingly and legally superseded any relationship before, including the one he shared with his parents. By getting married he chose OP to be his new immediate family and enshrined that in Law. By getting married he overturned any Will that he may have had drawn up beforehand.
By getting married, he chose OP, the person he must have trusted the most to have his best interests at heart, to be the one to make any decision on behalf of himself and his estate…. should he be unable to.

If he didn’t want OP to act as a spouse with all the legal responsibilities and expectations that it entails then he wouldn’t have married her, she would have been a girlfriend… but never a spouse. His age and the length of the marriage are inconsequential to the legally binding role of a spouse.
Those were his wishes. Why should his wishes not matter now or not be honoured?

OP, I am only in my 30’s, only been married a few years…. But if god-forbid anything happened to my husband even now, it would be a cold day in hell before I let anyone go against my dead husband’s wishes.

Your husband entrusted you to act for his best interests. Do what you will.

Maybe there is a compromise op. One where you don't dismiss their request but do tell them that you are not ready to make any big decisions yet.

It is a shame that they didn't support you when you needed them. You do describe them as manipulative and underhand, and maybe they are, but I also know that grief affects people differently and I have felt rage (misplaced, not fair), despair and utter abject hatred for pretty much everyone. I have retreated and didn't have capacity to support anyone else. You will always love and grieve for your first husband but presumably still find happiness in life and have things to look forward to. Maybe they do not. Saying that you are not ready to think about it yet is a halfway ground.

My husband died young, albeit not in his 20s. He was 47. We had no children, but fortunately I still have a good relationship with his parents, and we meet up every few months to catch up, and on his birthday to remember. His ashes are interred in the cemetery, and I own the plot. They’d not dream of asking for it, but likewise their are no circumstances on earth in which I’d relinquish that final link to him - he was my soulmate, and just because he’s died doesn’t mean I’ve stopped loving him. Yes, life has moved on…I haven’t remarried, but it’s conceivable I could, after all I might live another 50 years. But, my ashes will be interred with his, in a plot I chose because I knew he’d have loved it, with a gravestone saying what I know he’d like, and space for my name when the time comes. I’ll outlive his parents, much as the OP will outlive her PIL, so she should retain control…what happens when they die?

@Bellysmackers
I agree with @TheFlubQueen and other PPs who are more sensitive to the fact he was your husband, you are his widow and it was a tragic loss for you, one that changed your life forever.

You don't have to make irreversible decisions and I wouldn't.

You can feel for his parents in their loss of their son, the same way they ought feel for you. I suspect they hold some underlying grievance or blame towards you to ask to take over ownership of his grave and burial plot from his widow. It's really not on to suddenly contact you 10 years later and try by stealth to erase you as any part of "his immediate family". You were his most immediate family.

So, don't make a decision, don't engage. Let them contact you direct with details of what they were planning to do. I'd be tempted to contact the cemetery and state that no one is to make changes to your late husbands headstone, grave or burial plot except you as the legal owner of your Kate husbands resting place, and to ask that it is flagged on their files.

Then you have all the time in the world to consider and oversee any detailed genuine requests that you can choose if are appropriate/ what your darling Late husband would have wanted.

There's no hurry for this as you presently have insufficient information to even know what any decision might result in.

Oh OP, I'm so sorry, what a terrible loss for everyone.

I guess it's worth asking yourself some questions.

How would you feel if you handed the grave over to them and they removed any mention of you from the headstone? Or made other changes to it? Or had the parents' ashes buried there?

I think you'd have to be prepared for any of these to happen, even if you tried to get a "no changes to the headstone" agreement.

Do you think handing over the gravesite and washing your hands of his family might actually bring you some peace? Or would losing the gravesite be an additional loss that you can't face?

Best wishes, I'm so sorry you have to deal with this

I just want to say also OP I really feel for you that his parents and siblings quickly took many of his personal possessions whilst you were grieving without asking. They were legally yours and it is underhand to have done so, as they didn't know what was precious to you. People should come together in grief not run their hands and "get in their quick"

When my sister died (she was single/ no DP even) it was shocking the difference in behaviours from our many different cousins. There were so many cousins whom she was close to that asked us if they could have some items that were practical pr sentimental and would be used with love by them for years afterwards.

There was one distant cousin who turned up with A VAN!! Wanting to empty out my sisters house of anything she could sell.

She was stopped and asked to leave after a while because she went through my sisters house (barely weeks after dsis had died) loudly valuing things in money terms complaining that "the good stuff" had gone... err actually had been put aside for her NOK and people she would have wanted to have those items and appreciated them. That grabby cousin tried removing stickers (saying for x person) and sneaking items out of the house...

It caused such upset to us in our grief. If dsis had been married it would have been for her DH (& we would have discussed with a long term DP) to decide on what she would have wanted certain people to have. I didn't want anything except her laptop (for the photos stored on it), tea caddy & printed photos of my Dsis and DCs that were no good to anyone else. That cousin for eg wanted the frames my Dsis with my DCs photos were framed in... because "she could reuse them"

@Tiani4 We had one of these vulture types when DFIL died... I guess you really see some people's true colours after a bereavement.

They are grieving too, and their behaviour may well be a reflection of this. They are parents who have lost their child - the worst loss there is, I think.

What happens with the grave is your decision, of course, but don't follow the people who are being critical about their 'meanness' and 'bad behaviour.'

I lost my husband of 40 years just over two years ago, and the grief is dreadful. I can't imagine how I would feel if I lost my child.

I would give them the same consideration they have given you over the years and completely ignore them.

I get it and I know just how much emotional upheaval such people can cause. But I would look at this a little bit differently. I'd sell them the plot, it does have monetary value, even if for just interring ashes.

I'd be snarky enough to explain how I felt, how much their attitude towards you at the time and in the intervening years hurt but couldn't dent the love you had for their son.

Then I would tell them that for a payment of X, that being the cost you have incurred for the plot, his burial and any other costs, you would be willy, not happy but willing, to sign the plot over to them, again at their cost.

None of that would change your memories of him. But it would end even the most slender of connections to seemingly self absorbed, unpleasant individuals.

This might be very hard to you, but you have rebuilt your life, and although you of course still think of your husband, you were able to find a meaningful person to share your life with, in a way taking the role their son previously had. I am sure this was not the case with them. I think there is no sharper, harder, most difficult pain then loosing a child. They might have been very nasty before, but as a pp has said, people can do odd things when going through extreme pain. I would be forgiving and ask them upfront what they want if it is indeed the ashes to be buried with their son, but you also wish your ashes to be laid there, explain so. As you will probably have other plans with your now husband, this might not be the case, and then I would definitely allow them for their last wish. I would not be able to bear my conscience if I denied them that not having plans to be laid there with my passed husband.

It's 😞 so sad. "Have some heart and respect" is all I could think... she's not money she's was phenomenal.

People should come together in grief and think about the person who died and all who loved them.

I rated your earlier post to OP. As it explained so well what I and many other PPs were thinking (against a bit of a separate avalanche of "you had a short marriage, his parents knew him longer " 😢😢 insensitive comments) from those that maybe haven't been widowed nor lost someone they loved tragically . Grief includes shock and anger at the start even misplaced anger but the latter subsides..

I knew my Dsis better than anyone and loved her the most, but if she'd had a husband even if only few years (& we don't know if OP was married 5-10 years) + all the falling in love years beforehand, then ofc her DH would trump us as she would have chosen him. My Dsis chose her friends too. We respected all of them and still talk years later - they're all fb friends with me and my parents , even my sisters oldest school friend!

I wanted to be closer to anyone in my sisters life, not ignore them and cast them out, which is what OPs in laws did to his wife. It was a time to pull everyone in close, not disappear and erase.

Sorry my end of brackets in my third paragraph was wrongly positioned!

So that's why I think shouldn't make or be rushed into any long term decisions. Not without knowing and not from anyone in his birth family trying to erase her with their "we are his only immediate family" comments.

Mu SIL mentioned in her messages that I had only had him for a brief time. She implied in a subtle yet to me, sledgehammer way, that they had known him all their lives and therefore had more right to own the plot. My husbands family were wealthy. I was not. It's not particularly relevant, but I paid for the funeral myself and all associated costs as I rightly felt I should. They never offered to help me financially. I then had to move back into our home which had been rented out whilst we lived abroad for his job. The house had been trashed and no rent paid for months :-( I'm proud of myself that O secured a job, bought a car and got back on my feet. I worked through my emotions and grief with no help whatsoever from these people, who I never believed would abandon me. Now they want something from me 17 years later....you can imagine how I feel.