Dad in women's loo .

[HappyDays40]

I have been to the loo in Mc Donald's and was mid flow when a dad walks in with his daughters aged about 4 and 6.He stands waiting while his daughters are using the toilet. I came out and said you are not supposed to be in here.
He said he had to take his daughters to the loo and I told him that he needed to either wait outside or take them the mens. He said they don't need to see that and I told him that he shouldn't be hanging round in women's toilets for any reason. His sense of entitlement gave me the rage so I told a member of staff. I can only imagine how triggering that could be for some women. Intrusive fucker.

So you're saying that to a woman who doesn't know a strange man, that he is not a threat?

A man clearly supervising his young daughters in a public toilet who holds a reasonable verbal discussion with a woman who challenges his presence is highly unlikely to be a physical threat to anyone at that point in time. Even more so as he was standing outside the cubicle while they used it.

I agree with you that's how it's different. But careful. Saying "In the same way that men can be a threat to women" will have you painted as absurd, paranoid, etc.

Alb0

You haven’t worded anything badly. Don’t worry. Unfortunately there is a set of women who are absolutely desperate to be ‘cool girls’ and will happily throw women under the bus to do it.
and then disingenuously suggest that women who are worried about male violence are paranoid despite the fact that 99% of sexual assaults are carried out by men and over 80% of acts of violence.

I know, but the problem is how do you know for other cases?

She very clearly did not say that, and it's quite worrying that you keep insisting that she did. What she denied, rightly, was your statement that "Any male is a potential risk to women". Self-evidently that is not true.

Say what you like, he is an extremely decent man. I would have had a VERY difficult time changing my son’s nappy on my lap whilst sitting on a toilet - he kicks like crazy and would probably launch himself onto the floor because he is bloody strong. The toilets are barely big enough to get through the door as an adult, let alone with a baby and change a nappy. But you’re right, he’s an arsehole, I’m a terrible mother. Cheers.

The problem is to other women, who enter after he has, they don't know for sure he does have children there. If we make an exception for this, where does it end?
It sounds harmless at first, but when you think about it, it's a slippery slope.

But in this thread that’s being discussed the man did actually have two daughters with him, if he was a lone male or all this self ID female nonsense I would be fully in agreement.

However it’s not and the abuse I’ve had for saying I would have no issue with a man doing this is absurd I’ve been called delusional, a handmaiden, uneducated etc by women who apparently support women!

In the eyes of ordinary women who don't know a strange man, in their eyes yes, any man is a potential threat. It's stranger danger 101.

To deny that any man in a woman's eyes can be a threat, IS to say that men are not a threat.

You are extremely unreasonable IMO

A child shouldn't be in a stinky mens loo with open urinals

@Alb0 but but but

It's about what OP asked, McDonalds with small children, very busy places McDonald's, if he had small children presumably even busier as half term or Saturday.

So it's about what OP asked, AIBU, yes she is.

Seems that the simplest answer is to take the urinals out of men’s toilets and replace them with cubicles, so there’s exactly the same provision for parents of either sex.

And I still haven’t seen an answer to explain why unaccompanied young girls in the female toilets should be confronted with strange men, or why they are not entitled to the safeguarding protection offered by single-sex spaces. Apparently we only consider the well being of children whose fathers are there; all the people on here going on about children v grown women- seem unable to consider safeguarding the children who are using the toilets on their own. They don’t know the motive/ family situation of strange men in the women’s toilets.

Jenhen89
i haven’t mentioned you as a mother but you seem determined to be some sort of victim here when it was you who happily announced that your partner violated women’s boundaries.

The problem is to other women, who enter after he has, they don't know for sure he does have children there. If we make an exception for this, where does it end?

In my head I would assume he was stood outside the cubicle with one child while the other peed then the children swapped. Cubicles aren't very big and it wouldn't make sense for them both to be in a locked cubicle while he stands outside of it.

Saying that, lots of people suggested he stood outside the toilets altogether but if he did that you'd have a poster saying she was uncomfortable with a man lurking outside the toilets and that she thought he might be waiting for a woman to be in there alone. I think id probably feel safer him obviously being in the toilets that not knowing his intentions while he lingers outside.

Then we have the answer right there to why men shouldn't be in women's spaces, don't we? Particularly around unaccompanied girls. At least girls in male facilities have the protection of a parent accompanying them.

Don’t forget cool girls @Prinnny. Amazing how some people’s feminism flies out of the window when people have the audacity to disagree with them.

Thank you. :) I have to admit I've been really shocked at some of these replies. A bit teary shocked. I was stating something that I thought 99% of people all knew. To be told men are not a threat, is quite shocking, as an ordinary woman and as a victim.

Welcome to the experience of those of us who aren’t transphobic and are happy to put ourselves as tolerant on mumsnet ! Maybe you should reflect a bit on your other attitudes..

Tearing other women down with the insult “handmaiden” if they hold a different viewpoint is such a bullshit thing to do and actually pretty ironic as it just makes the aggressive posters on here look like they fucking hate women, which is at odds with their purported stance.

it is a really interesting discussion - it’s a shame it’s turned into insults etc. I really disagree with men in women’s spaces but in this specific example it’s hard to see what other options he had. I do think it is somehow less appropriate to have girls in a men’s loo than boys in the ladies. I think because, as pointed out here, men are generally more intimidating and dangerous. I think 4-6 in a strange loo is very little and I understand why the father was in there. Equally it’s easy to see why women would be bothered by it. I don’t think I could blame a father for making this judgement call.

However it’s not and the abuse I’ve had for saying I would have no issue with a man doing this is absurd I’ve been called delusional, a handmaiden, uneducated etc by women who apparently support women

quite!

Based on the limited portion I've been able to read without spitting my tea out, this thread is utterly bonkers

More and more gender neutral toilets where I live and work so this will be an outdated view in a few years time.

Only when “disagreeing” is actually prioritising the demands and expectations of males to enter female only spaces.

My husband regularly takes our five year old daughter out for the day. I’ve just asked him if he’d take her to the women’s toilets. He was horrified by the idea “I know why I’d be there but the women might not. Plus I’d be furious if (daughters name) went to the toilet alone and there are was a bloke in there”

So, some men are able to see it from a perspective other than their own entitlement.

oh Come on, if he was openly taking a piss while accompanying his children you may have a small point , otherwise it’s not remotely the same.

Giraffesandbottoms

handmaidens are people who support males in subjugating women. Not allowing women to have safe spaces away from males and supporting males who breach boundaries is being a handmaiden. Supporting a male who has decided to go into a female only space Is very much being a handmaiden.