To find this overt racism totally shocking in 2022

[DownToTheSeaAgain]

With the extended in-laws yesterday. Had a conversation about society and the role of state vs individual. All good and better than the usual run of the mill smalltalk. However in the middle of it SIL made a comment so outrageous and racist that shocked all of us in the room.

She kept on repeating it. This is an educated woman in her late 50s.

For full disclosure no one was drinking.

My AIBU is that I can't let it go. Is that normal?I woke up this morning feeling quite unsettled. I can't now see her as anything other than a racist bigot.

I can't go low contact as one of her adult DC lives with my family so for the sake of the DC (who is great) I have to suck it up.

Coping strategies?

The reality is, not everyone likes everyone else! It would be weird if they did. As a society, it’s time we grew up and accepted this.

The world isn’t divided into goodies and baddies. Pretty much everyone holds some unpleasant view or other, often up mixed with humane and liberals ones. For example, I’ve heard people rant about racism one minute then defend date rape the next. My African neighbour, a fundamentalist Christian, took part in the BLM protests. But she will also tell you that homosexuality and abortion are ‘sins’ and ought to be illegal. I know a sanctimonious socialist, who always bangs on about poverty and inequality, yet makes disgusting jokes about eating animals (‘whenever I see a baby lamb my mouth waters’, etc). As a vegan I find that pretty ‘offensive’.

My point is, before getting on your high horse and indulging in that warm, tingly feeling of moral superiority, take a look at your own life and your own views.

I completely agree with this.

My parents are both racist, and I hate it.

I robustly challenge them and tell them how horribly offensive and disgusting it is, as do my brothers.

They continue to spout racist shit, and I continue to challenge. Alf Garnet and wife at their finest and I really dislike them for it.

Well, your examples are clearly examples of awful behaviour. Without knowing what was said here, we can't comment. As someone who is also not white, I do come across a lot of white people getting offended at inoffensive things, which winds me up, because not only are they inoffensive, they get so strung up on the stuff that isn't stuff, that they let the real racism slide by like it's acceptable.

People need to be speaking up against actual racism, such as the examples you've described. I'm really sorry that couple let you down so badly - sometimes it's not witnessing racism from strangers that's so upsetting, it's when our friends and acquaintances show themselves for who they are, and it's not who we hoped.

Anyway, back to to the OP. Is SIL the daughter of MIL? In which case, if they're both racists, it's hardly surprising?

You say you can't go NC because of SIL's DC, but also that SIL's DC is an adult. If that's the case, why do you need to speak to SIL? Surely as long as the DC is talking to the mother, you don't have to?

And if you can't go NC, can't you go low contact?

I think if you've indulged your MIL though thus far, it's going to look odd at you suddenly coming down against your SIL. You should really be treating all racist views the same, not hand out free passes because of who's saying them.

What utter shite!
You Racist apologist.

It is not ok to say horrible things about someone purely because of their skin colour!

Sure you can dislike any person because of something they’ve done irrespective of their colour, but that’s not what’s being discussed here.

Your post is a pile of crap, honestly.

@Kris02
People calling out and standing up against racism and bigotry is how society has become more civilised.

A very fair point. It is right to challenge racism, however we may hold some other potentially offensive views that we should be prepared to be challenged on ourselves.

You being offended is your problem. And being a vegan is completely different to someone being on the receiving end of someone else spouting discriminatory language, and potentially inciting hate based on certain physical traits.

Don’t be so bloody ridiculous.

Jesus, this thread is depressing.

You can’t change what’s in their heads but you could make it very clear that it’s not acceptable for them make racist comments in your presence and then either leave or ask them to leave if they do it again.

It sounds like you’ve brushed it off for years with your MIL. It’s still happening and your SIL has joined in. Instead of ‘coping strategies’ why not treat it as the serious issue it is? If she were screaming obscenities or shitting on your carpet would you ask for ‘coping strategies’ or would you draw a line?

She’s family and you’ve said you can’t go low contact so keep seeing her and inviting her round but every time she crosses that line, walk away or ask her to leave.

My experience among the racists /xenophobes/ religious bigots I've encountered, is that they were all very conventional people hooked on social status (theirs). Which leaves them dreadfully vulnerable to social embarassment. And it doesn't take much to let them experience being on the receiving end.

I don't flatter myself that I ever changed their mindsets. But nobody who made a racist/xenophobic remark to me, has ever done it twice.

From that I conclude they re-considered their behaviour . It's a start.

Isn't it just? With regard to the post you quote I will point out that being a vegan is a choice, being of a different ethnicity, having skin of a different tone, being gay, disabled etc? those are not choices.

Can you honestly not see the lack of equivalence between racism and making a joke about eating meat?

Incredible.

I think the OP meant that a person of that age should be mature enough to know better. You seem to have read this as the oposite to what was intended.

It’s jaw-droppingly insane that this comparison has been made.

I wonder how many people on here know what equality act is, or why we even need it.

Doesn’t sound like it tbh.

Not sure what you mean by coping with it? Call her out on it and ask her not to air her racist views around you then leave it at that? If she persists then she is even more vile than would first appear and you can justifiably go NC and let her kid figure out the logistics living with you while racist mum is banned from the house!

So your mil is racist but youre shocked your sil is?

just cope how you cope with your mil-you dont have to let anyone in your home you dont want inculding sil even if her child is staying with you

Just to say thank you all for helping me put this all into perspective.

I think you’ve done everything you can do at this point. You confronted her at the time and challenged what she said. You cannot force anyone to change their views sadly but I think the only option going forward (for her DC’s sake) is to be surface level polite and avoid those kind of conversations with her. If it does come up again, I agree with previous PP’s that you must challenge it but also, sympathies because I have similar family members and it’s exhausting dealing with them.

The very fact that you joke and ignore your MIL when she makes racist statements has enabled your SIL to do the same. I don't understand why it is ok from your MIL but horrifying from your SIL.

My FIL repeatedly made racist comments recently. I told him he couldn't say what he had said. He repeated it to a waitress and said, looking at me, "but you can't say that these days, can you".

He likes to shock and wind people up. I won't stand for racist comments.

I don't laugh or ignore. He's in his 80s but still capable of not being racist. I suspect your family member is too.

You're no better than your MIL or SIL, you joke and laugh....you bloody join in.

I don’t understand why people keep asking the OP to repeat the racist language? Why can’t people understand that this is offensive in itself? I could be wrong but I expect it’s mostly white Mumsnetters asking for the language to be repeated so that they can stand around judging what is and is not racist? Repeating racist language is a micro aggression, particularly if you are repeating it for the judgement of a white audience.

And @Kris02 , you should be ashamed of yourself. What a ridiculous and reductive post.

Honestly op you can’t fight her. You can accept that you disagree with her and think she is very wrong to say what she says. The reality is a lot of people are bigoted. You can reassess your view of her and if she says it again say that you find it offensive and would rather she not say it (and it’s definitely inappropriate if children are present).

Personally I don't make it about me and how I will cope when people say racist or other offensive things. I just go completely silent and refuse to engage any further with them. You know what she thinks now so you know how far to engage with her in the future.

However I am speaking of the old definition of racism, not the one where if someone says you're racist you just have to accept it and shut up with shame because to deny it or even attempt to understand the supposed racism is racist too.

I think that it's the coping strategies comment that got people riled up OP.

You may very well need coping strategies if you are black and are forced to spend time with someone spouting racist bile, but if you are white, as I assume you are, it's really not helpful to need to get the smelling salts out when confronted with this sort of thing. That doesn't help anybody.

You just have to repeatedly challenge, and maybe leave the room. I would not put up with anything said in the earshot of my DC when they were young, we left the room. It soon stopped when we were there, although I am sure that there was plenty out of our earshot.

Now we are all old and mature enough to just make our disapproval quite unmistakably clear. If you have to spend time with family members it really is all you can do.

Maybe the white couple aren't confrontational or even brave enough to say anything, silence doesn't mean agreement.