To cut DD off?

[BrokenToy]

DD is 18 (just). She’s been living pretty much at her boyfriend’s house for months now.

She informed me the other week that she doesn’t live at home anymore and so we’d have to pay her to babysit/dog sit for our weekend away. Weekend away had been booked for over a year. We were left with no choice but to stump up cash (we were already paying for a takeaway for her and the BF) or lose hundreds of pounds of concert tickets/hotel.

She sent me a text on Saturday about needing new jeans. I didn’t respond. She then phoned me yesterday screaming down the phone that I’m abusive and neglectful and leaving her without clothes. Two weeks ago I gave her £50 to buy summer clothes for the holiday we are taking her on in July. She is constantly asking for small bits of cash here and there (tampons, printer credit for college, things like that that she knows we won’t say no to) and DH and I have just realised this adds up to £155 so far this month…

I’m done. I’m about ready to say fine, you’ve moved out, no more monthly bus pass, pocket money, clothes, takeaways. She works five hours a week and could work more. She smokes and drinks. She’s using us purely as a bank and only contacts us when she needs a top up. I also really really don’t want to take her on holiday but that’s a sunk cost and at least it’s AI so she won’t be asking for cash.

@40andlols yes it is annually

Op has stated they give £50 allowance. Bus pass is £70, phone contract £20 (paid by us)

So that’s £140 per month £1,680pa

If they don’t get any child benefit then their annual income must be £60k+

Gov states that contribution to students where parents are earning in this threshold should be £5,182pa might be closer to £6,000 now as another poster stated.

So they are short changing the daughter by £3,502 per annum at least and expecting another family to support her through her education.

I used to work in the care system and the tone
of exchanges between visiting parents and their DC in care was exactly the same - all about £20 for this or £40 for that. As an op describes it above, money becomes the only communication tool, in the absence of any understanding or emotional connection. It's terrible to see it play out. Parents would visit their children in care and accuse them of being 'spoilt brats' because they had new trainers or something bought through their clothing allowance. Money becomes weaponised , but the real underlying guilt and blame and emotional disturbance never gets addressed because it all becomes about confrontation over money..

Yes, it's annual.

So OP (who has a high HH income so ineligible for CB) should be giving her elder child approx £5182 p.a as a minimum to cover normal living expenses that arise from not being supported directly by parents in the family home.

And the total sum that the government think that a young person in education not living at home needs in order to live off is approx £10k p.a. Yet OP is complaining that her DD who is given just £600 per year plus a bus pass is asking for more money. Of course she bloody is! She's not being given enough money to cover basic living costs.

It's no wonder the DD feels hard done my. She is hard done by.

All the while OP talks about her lovely big house, going to concerts, holidays, meals out. Surely adequate supporting her children to the basic standards laid out by the government should be her priority, not these kinds of luxuries.

She’s at college not Uni.

We completely financially support her. I’m just not giving her cash throughout the month to spend on fags and booze. And for that I am abusive and neglectful in her eyes.

PP said I’ve cut DS off at Uni…what? No I haven’t. He just never asks for any money. We speak to him several times a week and he comes home in the holidays.

i would be completely and utterly devastated if my child basically moved out at this age. Healing whatever rift had caused this would be my priority not a tit for tat adding up of what my child takes versus what they give.

Hum. I have a 18 (19 shorty) year old. NEET due to mental health issues. Her brother is older and moved away. I give her £50 per month and perhaps £20 each week if she does a major clean or I am overseas. I pay for her driving lessons. She has my old company phone pay as you go. If she needs more she sells things on fleebay.
My daughter was very angry with me for not supporting her choices (college, uni, identity) We have had some very hard times so money is now spent wisely.
Personally I would hate to be 18 these days. There is huge expectation to be academic and if you are not you are deemed a lesser person.
I only got some peace of mind when I realised my daughter was lonely and unhappy. She wasn't my son (golden child) and she needed me. I am not her best mate but I am her champion. We have very direct conversations. She has a boyfriend who we have never met but she only sees him occasionally.
I would jolly up OP, she wants levi? £15 in a charity shop if she is slim. My daughters designer clothes are all secondhand and she likes it that way. Very fashionable.
Change your dialogue with her, say bank is a bit short etc. Offer a charity shop spree. My story got easier. My daughter is not ASD but most think she is. Who'd be an 18 year old? not me.

She sounds like an inlaw and one relative of mine. I’d cut contact now, it doesn’t get any better.

This thread is really annoying me because the OP is being given such a hard time. She's stuck between a rock and a hard place and you lot are being really horrible.

I had nearly the same think with my dd too. She got in a strop when I got pregnant ( she was 19 at the time) and called me some awful names and I was shattered by it. She constantly demanded money whilst she lived with her boyfriend and used to come to the house when I was at work and take shampoo, toilet roll, makeup and any food she fancied. I changed the locks to try to put a stop to that.

Fast forward to now and she's 35 married with a ds. I told her at the time she could come back anytime, but not to take the piss and she did eventually. Honestly, it was sheer hell when this was going on and she's embarrassed now about how she behaved!

Hang in there OP, it will get better! You're doing the right thing by having boundaries, tell her she's always got a home with you but you're no mug.

Good life lesson for her

Could she be so desperate for cash and getting so upset when not given because she has some kind of addiction OP?

But she lives rent free with another family? You don’t completely financially support her?

she has a job and they put a roof over her head and feed her?

you pay her pocket money, cover travel and her mobile phone. You pay towards her living expensive but you don’t completely support her. She does some herself and her boyfriends parents do some.

Regardless of her being being at college rather than uni, living costs are still the same!

How do you "completely financially support" her? You don't pay anything for board/utilities/food. You give her a bus pass and £50 a month. And then you begrudge her asking for money for clothes! And you use money to control her, rather than giving her a reasonable monthly sum for living expenses and allowing her to make her own choices. If she spends it all on fags and booze, she'll learn the hard way.

Do you give your DS the £5k pa + as per the governments expected parental contribution? If not, you're keeping him short too.

Why do you not think that its your responsibility to support your children through education like everybody else does?

I think you should stop giving her money, but let her know her home is open to her when she is ready. But have some rules, it’s a home not a hotel so she needs to treat it as such. She is welcome to participate in family activities such as meals out when she participates in other parts of family life like conversation.
Give clear boundaries and tell her she can choose but you will no longer be taken advantage of. If she screams and shouts walk always or hang up and say your won’t participate whilst she is acting like that.

I think you need to stop making money a way of controlling the relationship, on either side. Just pick a monthly amount your prepared to give her (make sure it’s reasonable, cost of living is high right now!) then leave it up her how she spends it. By saying ‘we pay for this and that but don’t want to subsidise these’ you’re maintaining the control and deciding what you think is ‘essential’ rather than letting her do it herself. She’s an adult, she gets to decide what she thinks it worth spending money on.

Pick an amount, set up a standing order, that’s it. She can only ask for more in (genuine!) emergency situations.

@BrokenToy having been to college and Uni I can tell you the fees for me were still 50% of that at Uni and the living costs identical.

@BrokenToy having been to college and Uni I can tell you the fees for me were still 50% of that at Uni and the living costs identical.

I agree with this. But it needs to be a realistic monthly amount - maybe £500/m directly to DD and £300/m to boyfriends parents for lodgings, food, utilities (or adjust the split depending on how much they provide). And DD pays for bus pass/college supplies/college lunches/phone contract etc out of this. Just one overall monthly sum, and she has to manage it. Then neither of you are attempting to control the other by money.

Then you can start trying to build an adult to (young) adult relationship.

Jesus. I’m not sure why people are piling on to you. Your daughter is taking the piss. She’s abusive and you need to stop giving her money. You’ve done all you can. she doesn’t respect you. She doesn’t respect your home. She doesn’t respect what you do for her. Giving her money is just perpetuating the issue. She needs a consequence to her behaviour and she’s telling you what it needs to be. Stop the money.
I have ADHD and definite autistic traits (never been tested for autism). I was completely off the rails at 18 - drugs, drink, suicidal. I still held down a full time job and supported myself financially. Because I knew my parents weren’t going to fund my lifestyle. One thing that I always knew, even though I didn’t appreciate it at the time, was I had a home to go to when I really fucked up. But I knew how I had to behave if I went there and wanted support. Not that I wanted to be anywhere near my family. I was also violent in the family home too. Now they are they most important thing to me. That turned around in my 20s.
I have family members who never had to face any consequences for their behaviour. Everything was explained away. There was always money available so they never had to be independent. They are still fucked up now. I am professionally trained at masters level with 3 children about to purchase my second home. I’m sharing this because having to be financially independent was an important factor in me getting my act together. There is no reason for your DD to be receiving any money at her age whilst she is abusing you. She’s an adult. I started 11 years of education and training at 21 and I funded every penny myself. The fact she is at college is not a reason to be giving her money. Do not be held to ransom over the fact you want her to receive an education. If she’s going to continue education she will with or without your money.
I think she needs a shock. Her behaviour is absolutely appalling. She can’t go into the real world behaving this way. I would be tempted to completely cut her off.
If you have things you want to continue providing, like bus pass and allowance, do. But put a boundary in of no more extras. Take the emotion out of it. Don’t do it in anger. Explain it clearly, if there are conditions attached to the things you will provide make them clear and fair. But no extras. Even if she turns into golden child overnight - there is no more money. That’s what I would do.

OP- a few people have commented on your time and I wanted to offer some support. My ds was very difficult when 17/18 and I tried to keep all talk about him factual because I was so emotional about it -sad, angry, worried.... and it was my burden to carry. Being factual (emotionless) was my way to cope.

It is a strange situation which you have no control over because of her age and bf's family enabling her and in an ideal situation she'd live at home at see her bf like a normal 17/18yo.

Yes, exactly that.

OP, you could look at it as a useful communication ('all behaviour is communication') and use that as a starting point to try and open real dialogue with your daughter.

Gov states that contribution to students where parents are earning in this threshold should be £5,182pa might be closer to £6,000 now as another poster stated.

That figure is for children going to university so actually nothing to do with this thread. OP is providing a home, all utilities paid, all food paid, clothes and toiletries included. OP is providing everything her DD needs.

If her DD choses to reject that, then that is her choice. It is not then OP's responsibility to give her the equivalent in cash. In fact, giving money when abusively demanded would be failing the child.

I cant believe the way some posters are treating OP.
I moved out at 16 - they were my dads rules at the time. Leave school, get a job and move out. Both my sister and I did this successfully. I know times have changed in the past 20 years but this girl is 18, choosing where to live and not living within her means. She needs to be taught real life, choices and consequences and budgeting! Parents aren't cash cows. I wouldn't be able to support my son in this way and I wouldn't for the pure fact that he has a home with me. She has a home in their house, her family home. It's her choice to not live there.
She has a job and could work more but again chooses not to. She is choosing a lifestyle of drinking and cigarettes and lying over what she wants money for.
Personally I would withdraw all that I couldn't buy for her within reason, ie bus pass/phone rental.

He just never asks for any money

Your son doesn't ask for money, not because he doesn't need it (he clearly does his shoes are falling apart) He has learnt not to ask. Look at what you are prepared to do to dd, cut her out of your life because you feel she has asked too much, he is probably afraid you will do the same.

Op, I mean this so kindly I think you need to book some counselling and process your abusive relationship and process what has happened since. Sometimes we are so busy surviving abuse that we never really find the care and the time to really see what is has done to us. Or how it has affected us. There might be a link between the loss of feeling towards your dd and what happened with their father. Loving someone makes you vulnerable, maybe you didn't want to feel that vulnerability again.

Op, some things stand out to me from your posts -

1. You did is 18, and your dh who is not dd's dad came to your life 16 years go. So by 2 year of age, DD had already experienced, unloving father (abusive to you), her parents separation and a new man coming to her mother's life.

1. Your dd likes your dh but hates you.

1. Your dd bullied kids in her school, had complaints from teacher, fought with her 2 brothers but she is a lovely person with her BF and his family.

What I don't understand is how a bad tempered peron has not acted out to her BF and his parents. She has lived with / known them for atleast a year.

Maybe she didn't get the support she needed during the time of your separation. Maybe your older son is one of the rare sweet, resilient kid and you used to compare dd to ds for acting out. This could have led to her acting out in school. Your current dh might be an affectionate person, and so might be the case of bf and his family. Or why else she is lovely to them?

Some posters are giving their own examples of being self reliant at the age of 19., But there is no automatic switch on at the age of 18, which makes a kid adult.

It's the experiences upto that age which prepares them for an outside world.
Plus, your dd seems to have ASD in your opinion, so this all these upheavals in her life and an emotionally not available mother has impacted her. Maybe you had too much on your plate to meet her emotional needs. You were abused by her father, separated from him, entered a new relationship while taking care two very young kids. Then 6 years later you had another kid. This is not to judge you, you had a tough circumstances too but from perspective of DD she experienced all this by the age of 8. Of course I can be wrong.

But all in all, it's not easy for either you or dd. It's very unfair of poster to call her sly and manipulative. It also seems you are not able to understand where she is coming from as you are just blaming her for behaviour, not wanting to know the reasons behind.

I know it's hard but you should rise above and do what it takes to help DD with her issues and build a relationship between you both. Forget how good other children are. That's not helping your DD.

I’m with you @BrokenToy
My 20 yo dd nearly broke me. I would keep calm and fair, continue with her allowance etc, but no more money.
I hope she comes round in the end. In the meantime try and focus on other things. I know how hard this is. Patience is key here, don’t say or do anything irreparable. Best to say nothing.
Chances are she will need you before you need her.