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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Permanent exclusion-how do I find a new school that will take an excluded child?

635 replies

Alwaystoblame · 27/05/2022 14:10

Posting for traffic.
How do I go about finding my Dd a new school if she's been permanently excluded? How likely are good schools to take her on in year 10 with an appalling attendance and behaviour record? She's very bright and doing very well academically when are bothers to go to class and do the homework. Attendance in in the 60s for this year. Even when she dies go in she is late and/or truants classes.
I have 2 previous threads about the issues she's having but I wanted to ask specifically about new schools without getting detailed.

OP posts:
Original poster
Alwaystoblame · 09/09/2022 10:33

There's a meeting in school next week for her readmission.

OP posts:
Johnnysgirl · 09/09/2022 10:55

Alwaystoblame · 08/09/2022 22:39

School said she didn't fit the criteria for a PRU. I thought that would be ideal for her and give her the support she needs.

@Johnnysgirl should everyone just give up on her? She's still a child and needs help. Her behaviour is totally unacceptable and she needs professional input to manage her behaviour and her emotions.

Sure. As long as the victims of her vile behaviour are offered similar support, she seems to have the starring role in all this. Typically.

Dillydollydingdong · 09/09/2022 11:24

Maybe boarding school? There are some subsidized/funded ones around. Otherwise it looks like you'll have to homeschool her.

Mariposista · 09/09/2022 11:40

Would a residential youth rehabilitation programme be an option? Almost like youth detention centre but she would be entering voluntarily. She needs intense therapy and behavior management to be able to function in the community, or sadly if she keeps going it may be real prison one day…
so sorry OP, you sound desperate.

Minfilia · 09/09/2022 12:14

I’ve read this all the way through and I just think… what a shame she won’t engage with MH professionals. She really needs it as she is clearly a very messed up little girl who is probably scared and acting out.

My DD16 is under CAMHS and since having weekly therapy her school attendance has improved dramatically. She also hasn’t missed any lessons since school went back 10 days ago which is a big thing for us, even at her “best” she was still skipping the odd lesson she didn’t want to go to.

I totally get the frustration of seeing a disengaged child who was previously bright, academic and engaged (although my DD hasn’t shown any violence, just passiveness).

She really, really needs that therapy. But you can’t force her and im not sure what has to happen for her to wake up.

LolaLouise · 09/09/2022 12:27

@Alwaystoblame My now 20 year old son was very similar in highschool, multiple aggressive incidents in school, bullying incidents, suspensions, threatened with perm exclusion, high abscenes and potential PRU referral. He wouldn't engage with CAHMs or any MH services even after a hospital admission and the Mh team came to him and spoke at length about his MH and what can be offered moving forward he refused to engage. His behaviour at home was as bad with his siblings, he wouldn't be aggressive but he was abusive, he would steal off me and my other children, smash up my house when he didn't get his own way etc. He was however diagnosed ASD, but mainstream schooling. I was at my wits end, and for the safety of my other children considered placing him in foster care at 15.

I have little advice on the schooling, but I will say, he's now 20, he has a good job within the NHS, he has a steady relationship, he functions well. School was not an environment suitable to his needs, but his time at college passed without incident, his attendance was good and he passed his courses with decent grades. I know previously you have said that you feel she needs the structure and support of school, but this may not be the case, the freedom and adultness of college can sometimes be the positive structure that's needed to make improvements.

I hope you are ok, I understand how hard this situation is, but there can be light at the end of the tunnel x

justasking111 · 09/09/2022 12:38

All my sons had friends who thrived in our local college after awful behaviour. One is a gardener, one an electrician, one a gas engineer, one a plasterer. The girls, they went into beauty as in hair, nails, etc my sons partner is now good friends with her beautician who was the worst bully at school.

I'm so glad we have a local college that teach vocational courses

justasking111 · 09/09/2022 12:40

Sorry I forgot hospitality there's a few who went on to be chefs

oakleaffy · 09/09/2022 12:51

rainbowmilk · 08/09/2022 22:44

I hope that the victims of her violent behaviour are also receiving support for what they went through, especially given that she’s now coming back to their school - but having been in the education system I highly doubt it.

Violence is completely unacceptable, anywhere.
I do agree, It’s the innocent pupils who are hurt psychologically and physically by these violent ones that deserve protection.

Jedsnewstar · 09/09/2022 14:09

Let her live with her dad and let him deal with it all.

Lightuptheroom · 09/09/2022 14:27

@Alwaystoblame it's worth asking school about the availability of a college placement. She has to be on a school roll to access this (basically because the school pays for the place) and theres a shortage of such places, but definitely worth asking the question.

Original poster
Alwaystoblame · 15/09/2022 17:58

We had a meeting yesterday and she starts back at the original school tomorrow. They are not prepared to tolerate anything other than very good behaviour from her and she's returning on a behaviour plan. Any repeat and she's out on her ear. She's attending her camhs appointments with me now and things are more positive. I know things can change very quickly but for now I remain hopeful. She's seeing more of me and in touch most days and is getting on better with her siblings in her limited contact with them. I am only seeing her if there are witnesses and she is not allowed in the house until she shows consistent improvement and I feel safe to have her here.

OP posts:
Crazycrazylady · 16/09/2022 09:49

Op
Glad things to be improving . Fingers crossed she has seen the light and will behave at school. She will be maturing all the time if she can just stay in school.

Goingforarun · 16/09/2022 17:58

You never gave up. Everyday without a crisis must be quietly celebrated.

Original poster
Alwaystoblame · 16/09/2022 21:17

No, I'll never give up on her. I just roll with whatever she throws at me. I treasure the good times and if she turns then I keep her at a distance. She's knows I love her and I demonstrate that to her and that's why she kicks off at me because she's safe to do it as it were. She knows I'll love her regardless of her bad times. I have to keep faith in her because she doubts herself. She's been appalling and there is no excuse for her behaviour and she knows it won't be tolerated by school or by me. She's at school and seeing me under terms that are schools and mine, not hers. She is so little physically, barely 5 foot, and there's a very lost lass under all that anger and aggression and lies. She's engaging with professionals now and I'm praying that she will get what she needs from camhs and be settled and happy at school. Any aggression verbal or physical and she's out of school for good and she knows I won't see her unless in public or with others.

OP posts:
itsgettingweird · 16/09/2022 21:54

All I can add to this is what an amazing mum you are.

Supportive of your DDs needs but so from and honest about her behaviour and sympathetic to her victims and their feelings.

It's not easy accepting when your child is being a bully.

🤞 she settles back in well and realises the massive lifeline she's been handed here.

vivariumvivariumsvivaria · 17/09/2022 11:10

Another wanting to heap praise on you for your patience and consistency as a parent.

It is easy to parent a kid who is easy. I am in awe of women like you who manage to do the hard stuff day in day out.

Your daughter will be fine because she has you and you are giving her a soft place to fall. The fact that she has that will always help her.

<wee hug>

Original poster
Alwaystoblame · 23/09/2022 07:47

So far, not good. In the first 3 days she spent one morning in the nurses office faking illness and then her dad picked her up, one day she was truant for part of the morning and all in all it adds up to 1 day in lessons. She's not done any homework. Everything was false promises as usual which I expected them to be. I am so pissed off with her. School are doing everything they can to support her and she just insists on messing it up.

OP posts:
Porcupineintherough · 23/09/2022 08:30

I know that there's little you can do to influence your dd's choices but I really think you viewing her behaviour as something she is actively choosing and could turn around "just like that" if she wanted to is well, bonkers. This is a child that is chosing chaos and sabotaging everything that comes her way because there is something going on that she just can't deal with alone. Something is badly wrong and until she gets the right help and let's someone help her nothing is going to get better. Extracting promises of change from her and then getting cross that she won't stick to them is crazy, no matter who's doing it.

Original poster
Alwaystoblame · 23/09/2022 08:58

She is under CAMHS and is having counselling via school when she turns up. There has been lots of help offered to her over the years but nothing changes.

OP posts:
Original poster
Alwaystoblame · 23/09/2022 09:04

Imo retested in any suggestions of what may help. She's under social services too along with the early help team. Her current career plan is to join the FBI and she genuinely believes this is something she is suited to and will achieve. I admire her ambition but at the moment she can't even get herself to school.

OP posts:
TheLongGallery · 23/09/2022 09:46

I think at some point if she engages with services she will be diagnosed with a MH condition this along with your suspicion she is neurodiverse needs addressing but I see she will not engage. Obviously people can have both. Even if she engaged now she is so young they would not give an actual diagnosis of a MH condition such as EUPD or bipolar.

I have known one person who had behaviour that was wildly extreme and could switch on and off, one minute sweetness and light and the next abhorrent. I’m slightly concerned saying what I know of them, it’s a relative of mine. Myself and many others in my family gave this person many chances over the years but their behaviour was so destructive, really so extreme it’s hard to believe it, in the end it became just too much so we are all no contact.

Its hard watching people you love self destruct, I’m so sorry.

Legofigure · 23/09/2022 10:03

For the vast majority of DC in similar situations it is can’t engage, rather than won’t, and they require support and adjustments made to the support offered in order to help them engage.

Original poster
Alwaystoblame · 23/09/2022 10:10

What can be done to help her engage?

OP posts:
Legofigure · 23/09/2022 10:18

There are many ways, but without knowing DD it is impossible for anyone online to say exactly what will work for her as what each DC needs is different. To give you a few ideas - different approaches (e.g. many find indirect therapies easier to engage with as they don’t rely so much on communication especially verbal communication, home visits, other therapeutic provision, alternative provision instead of expecting full time school attendance which at the moment is setting her up to fail), different professionals involved to find one who is a good fit, medication, more in-depth assessments (e.g. if you suspect she is ND OT and SALT assessments would be a good idea) to make sure there aren’t any hidden needs (which there often is, especially in ND DC).