Boys in girls changing at swimming

[TonksInPurple]

This is not a trans issue!

my daughter 11 attends swimming lessons at a hotel pool there are several parents who insist on helping there boys age 9/10/11 in the girls open plan changing room. The hotel’s suggestion is that my daughter and her friend change in the disabled changing room.
So the girls should be pushed out there own space. The boys have no additional needs but surely if they did they should use the disabled changing room.

It’s labelled disabled/family.

and this in itself makes life harder for people with disabilities because the chances are when they need it then won’t be able to access the only space they can change in. For many people that uncertainty makes it so they can’t risk going swimming because they can’t wait around getting cold while a family finish off.

disabled facilities shouldn’t be shared facilities.

The OP has said that the unisex changing room is badged disabled/ family so the boys and their mums are entitled to use it.

That is also unacceptable. Toilets for disabled people should be reserved for disabled people.

That's a debate to take up with the hotel, not the people who use a room labelled for them. It's like blaming parents using baby change facilities for using disabled toilets when they're put in as shared spaces.

But that's not the fault of the people using the space labelled for them. I am disabled so need the extra space etc. But if the only facility I can use is labelled as family as well I cannot blame the family

I wonder when men are going to sort their shit out so women don’t have to worry about sending their boys into the men’s/boys to get changed alone.

i definitely don’t think the solution is to tell parents of boys that they have to put their young boys in a situation where there is a very real possibility that they could be sexually assaulted though.

But I do think (reluctantly) as the mother of a boy that this is a problem for me to solve, rather than allowing boys over the age of around 8/9 to go into the girls' changing room at an age when the girls probably need more privacy and are becoming increasingly self-conscious.

I think most children that age can get changed by themselves. So the problem is generally men and the safety risk they are viewed as posing to young boys in a vulnerable situation. That leaves three solutions for their parents:

• DC don't use the men's changing rooms. Instead, dress them ready to go swimming so they can just strip off a onesie or something like that and go straight in. Have a wearable towel or one of those changing towels for afterwards so they don't need to get changed back into their clothes or they can do it outside the changing-rooms.


• The old classic of mum stands next to the men's changing room speaking incredibly loudly to her son while he gets changed so she knows he's not messing around and everyone in there knows mum is outside ready to rush in if they try anything. Unsubtle and irritating, but effective depending on the changing room layout.


• Give boys a personal alarm in case they feel unsafe. Will probably be misused quite a bit and end up irritating a lot of people, but better safe than sorry and may work to frighten off a potential predator.

One thing I would say is be careful judging boys' ages - some are a lot younger than they look. My 5yo is very tall for his age and could probably pass for around 7. I remember a young girl telling him when he hadn't even turned 3 that this was the girl's changing room and he couldn't be in here, which I found quite funny 😁. The mother shushed her and I explained nicely that he was only 2 so very little and couldn't swim so I needed to keep an eye on him, but I hope that girl will still feel confident standing up for her right to privacy as she gets older!

Lots of smug girl mums on here. Off course your ‘precious’ girls will never sexually abuse boys right? Well it happens a lot in my sons secondary school, girls making obscene comments about boys genitalia, also my younger son was made to feel very uncomfortable when year 6 girls were re-naming boys and girls genitals and asking him if he likes them.
This thread will (as always) be turned into a boy bashing thread AND yes boys are at risk of sexual abuse too.

I'd definitely contact the management and discuss it privately with the manager. Girls start getting periods from age 8 sometimes (there was an article in today's Independent about this). I have G&B twins and our son came with me until he was 7.

The way for the management to deal with this is to make family changing rooms, not to require someone to move out because they don't want to have a difficult conversation with another guest.

These are children you are talking about young children don't project your your feelings about men onto young young children 🙄

Tbf no one has mentioned 11 yo girls in the Boys with Dad but of course the same point applies.

However, men DO pose a greater risk than women, which is why men are more comfortable sending their girls off (hence the issue not being raised here) than women are sending their sons off.

If men weren't a risk, and if men wouldn't rather ignore a kid in need that risk someone THINKING he's a risk, we wouldn't be having this chat.

I know two grown men who were sexually assaulted in public toilets, messed them up for life. I support mixed changing facilities with secure cubicles for this reason.

Sorry, the men were young boys at the time of assault

These are children you are talking about young children don't project your your feelings about men onto young young children 🙄

Boys manage to change with other boys at school swimming.

I have sons and I have noticed that some parents have higher expectations of their daughters than sons and it is likely that this extends into the teenage years and adulthood.

Treating 9/10 year old boys as "young young children" doesn't do them favours. It's a parent's job to give them confidence to take care of themselves and getting changed after swimming is within the realms of capability for the majority. I don't see girls getting into knots, banging their head in the womens, why would boys be doing the same when their swimming costumes as easier to get out of ?

Are you generalising that all men are a risk?
If so, does this mean that fathers should not be changing their child’s nappies, wiping their bottoms, helping them to get dressed, bathing them etc. As in your eyes ‘men’ are a risk but these men are another child’s father.

The 18yo boys are intimidating to your 12yo son the same way that your 12yo son would be intimidating to my 8yo daughter.

IMO it is clear cut, from 8 (9 at a stretch) everybody goes in the changing room that matches their sex. Anybody that needs assistance from someone the opposite sex should ask for a separate cubicle.

And this is what I agree with.
Obviously the parents on this site think only girls are at risk of abuse and not boys.

Are you generalising that all men are a risk?

Clearly not all men are a risk, but some are and the percentage who are is a lot higher than it is for women. Also, not every male in a public changing-room will be some other child's father.

The National Crime Agency estimates that between 1-3% of men have paedophile tendencies. So that's as high as 1 in every 33/4 men. Not taking into account that paedophiles may deliberately target public toilets and changing rooms where they can access vulnerable children so the percentages there may be higher.

So while the risks shouldn't be overstated, neither should they be ignored, and any parent sending young children into a situation where they are vulnerable and unsupervised needs to make sure that they are aware of the risks and know what to do should anything happen. And that's an awkward conversation to have with a 9 year old boy, which is why getting changed in the car park or hall might be preferable.

Over 90% of sexual assaults in changing rooms happen in mixed sex changing facilities.

They do not keep women and children safe.

Are you saying you don't care if 8 year old boys get assaulted? Do you think mixed changing with cubicles is unacceptable? I know a pool that has this poolside, seems to work.

This is why I moved lessons to a pool with mixed changing village with big family showers and changing rooms. Mine do have sen though you wouldn't know it to look at and are incredibly vulnerable. I wouldn't want them in any changing space without direct supervision.

Surely parebts need to take sone responsibility here ?

Phone. Email. Look online. Find pools that have facilities that suit you.

Don't just show up to a pool and expect to be able to override everyone else's safety amd privacy because you won't go elsewhere or pick a day your dh /dp can take the kid instead.

What do you think the rest of us did?

The answer is definitely not boys being in the girls changing rooms. I used to hate this when it was family swimming at my gym. Boys of 10/11 in the female changing rooms. One pointing out to another ‘you can see that woman’s Boobies!’. I complained and they simply put up a sign. I noticed it was usually mum with about 3 kids to wrangle despite dad being there too and he was happily in the male changing not having to supervise any children. In that situation send the boys in with Dad ffs!

I completely agree with this, I have a DD and a DS and I can see how women and girls dont want to change infront of boys but I can also see that boys aged around 10 can still be vulnerable on their own changing with grown men they dont know.

Mums of girls often comment on how the girls feel (which also matters) but as a mum of a boy, the thought of sending a 9 year old boy in to change without knowing whos also in there and whats going on can be quite worrying. It is most likely to be fine but you wouldn't know otherwise. Mums of girls can supervise DD changing until they are 100% happy they are ready to be on their own and can always pop in to check if they're unsure.

The only answer is unisex and family cubicles, solves a lot of issues.