Support thread for those hosting refugees and advice for those thinking about it

[Honeysuckle9]

As per the previous thread this is a thread so we can offer support to each other and also outline the things we should be thinking about before making this leap

Nooooo, don’t be a guarantor!! You are fully liable for unpaid rent. I said no to my own family as I don’t have a year’s worth of rent money to lose.

I think they may not understand the legal implications of being a guarantor, and why it is a big NO. Just explain you have to have the whole terms rent available to be a guarantor… and you don’t. Explain it’s someone who has significant savings or a very high income, and you don’t.

The barriers, in most urban areas, to private rentals are huge. Guarantor, visas etc. Direct her to house share adverts.

Agree it's a big ask to be a guarantor. A lot of local authorities offer help though and have a list of landlords who don't require guarantors or the local authority guarantees it for them.

Also worth checking out just what kind of rents might be affordable if on UC. Check the local housing allowance rate in your area here lha-direct.voa.gov.uk/. People who are working might be able to contribute a little bit to the rent to top it up above the maximum amounts of LHA that they will get added to their UC claim, but not a lot as if they're earning more than you get on benefits then the UC starts to taper away. The Entitledto website can work it out for you in more detail.

Don't be the guarantor. I do not even do it for my student children. It is very very risky indeed and could ruin your credit rating for life and mean you have to pay tens of thousands in a worst case scenario.

On fillings the UK ones are much stronger and last longer than white ones and are arguably better but I know from the posts above not everyone abroad agrees with that!

How do you know this? Have there been published trials?

But what do you define as "dire need"?

^ I would say someone who is homeless and has lost everything/living near the front line is in dire need. The people I have taken in have taken the place of someone in dire need I could have helped.

My council are prepared to act as guarantor if it comes to it. I'm not sure why each council is allowed to make their own decision on this?

There are companies you can pay a couple of hundred and they will act as guarantor.

"Housing Hand" is one such company.

Housing Hand is for students and professionals and they require a co-signer who is in employment. It looks to me as though the company would pay out on the guarantee but would then pursue both the tenant and the co-signer for any money paid out. In all probability they would pursue the co-signer as they re in employment. Therefore they co-signer is effectively as on the hook, for potentially years worth of rent (up until successful eviction of the non paying tenant) as they would be as a guarantor.

I came across the following link

propertyindustryeye.com/rent-guarantor-firm-told-to-make-its-requirements-clearer/

Anybody would have to be mad to put their finances on the line in this way, unless they wee so rich that they could afford to pay several years rent for somebody else.

Oops, can't edit typos!

I looked into guarantor companies. Basically it’s the same as being a guarantor being a Co-signer for rent, you are liable and they would chase you for the rent. They are for people who wouldn’t pass a credit check, the companies don’t credit check Co-signers it seems. So if for example your parents would sign, but wouldn’t be eligible to be guarantors because of an IVA or something they could still co-sign through one of these companies if they had pay-checks.

Also most were around 3-6 weeks rent, not cheap at all.

This whole guarantor issue is a disaster waiting to happen. Opora's guide tells Ukrainians to ask their sponsor to act as guarantor. I questioned this with them and they said they intended it to be for family members but that isn't at all clear in the guide. I've seen plenty of hosts on social media asking about it (to be fair they are quickly told by lots of people it is a terrible idea) and I can see lots of well intentioned hosts offering it as a way of supporting guests to move on.

Our council has a contract with the Refugee Council who are clear this is not something hosts should offer. The council is entirely silent on whether they will step in and open up their guarantor scheme to Ukrainians but this is really the only route I can see for many if not all guests, without hosts being put in a very difficult position.

I would never be a guarantor, even for my own child unless they were the sole tenant in a property. I have explained the situation to my guest but it isn't sinking in - she's still talking about renting a 3 bed property in London with friends, neither of whom has a full time job. It's not going to happen. When I say she needs to think about renting a room in an HMO after she's saved several months' rent she looks sad and says she wants to live with her friends. Which I understand but just isn't practical.

I saw a post on a hosts' Facebook site earlier which nailed it for me - government should have framed this scheme as "you will get xx months' free accommodation from a host during which time you will need to work and save for a deposit to allow you to rent on the following terms or if you rely on benefits your housing options when the sponsorship terminates will be dormitory accommodation (or similar)" The details don't matter but this open ended "oh come over for three years and it will all be fine" was always going to result in this situation.

I hold myself partly responsible; I matched with my guest very early on when the scheme had launched. She was on her way west running away from the Russian invasion and had nowhere to go. I was happy to help her and still am but wish I'd said at the start "if you want to come here this is the reality - we can offer you a home for up to 12 months but you need to arrive ready to work after the first month and start to plan for a pragmatic and realistic next step as soon as you arrive. You will not be able to find work in your current profession on arrival as your qualifications aren't transferable but there are lots of retail and hospitality vacancies which, although not what you have trained for, will give you a solid income that will allow you to save".

Hindsight is a wonderful thing...

What is Opora’s guide?

That is indeed awful advice and sets people up for upset when the sponsor refuses.

With the best will in the world it would be enormously risky to be a guarantor for someone who ultimately would like to go back home (93% I think?) and who when they get there is very likely going to feel that the immediate needs of their war ravaged country trumps any debts left behind in an England they might never want to go back to. It’s almost a perfect storm for default even for people who set out with honest intentions.

My 3 professional guests all with excellent English presented to this scenario to me at the start that this was their intention. I provided huge support to get their UC and all other admin in place and then worked my own professional network to open opportunities which they just turned down (embarrassing for me).

They have done nothing over 16 weeks. They just nod and smile and do nothing. I had the conversation at 12 weeks about what is needed to secure rented accommodation (ie a job) and again nothing happens. They are away on a 2 week holiday in Ukraine - back on Tuesday.

It feels like a slow car crash waiting to happen. But maybe they have other plans, options and financial resources open to them - so I shouldn’t worry myself.

Not looking forward to their retune as the weather changes and they will move from sunbathing in my back garden to inside lolling around - I work from home so it’s very difficult. My expectation was that they would be productive, out at work or working from home. We are in London - where there are loads of opportunities. I struggle with the clash in values around work ethic - but it’s not my call. Just need to suck it up for a couple of more months….and enjoy the space until they return on Tuesday.

UPDATE- my guest is currently en route to view alternative sponsor accommodation (in the big town) and meet the hosts. I'm hoping it all goes well. I will find out later.

Thank you to those who have offered advice regarding being a guarantor.
I have subsequently found out that my guest is planning to claim full universal housing credit whilst working almost full- time for a “cash in hand” job. This is so opposed to my own personal values it has made it easier for me to finalise my decision not to be a guarantor.
Truthfully I am now struggling with this new information. Whilst I had much sympathy for her situation I now find it hard to accept her accepting a free lovely home to reside in, several hundreds of pounds a month in benefit, the cost of living payment of several hundred and now government-funded accommodation. Meanwhile I see hundreds of hard- working families struggling to pay for essentials . Not sure how I can reconcile this or maybe I am being unreasonable considering the fact she is a refugee of war?

No yanbu; benefit fraud is wrong, refugee or not. And possibly she doesn’t understand quite how much trouble it could get her in if caught.

Without knocking lovely Ukrainians, it is a country that has fairly high levels of corruption compared to here but just because something might be more socially acceptable there doesn’t mean it’s ok.

Yes, benefit fraud isn't acceptable, particularly given they've been welcomed into another country and hosted for six months.

I'd have a word and if they don't agree not to do it, I'd be tempted to make an anonymous report.

@Cambridgegirl90 if you look a few pages back on this thread - I bring this situation up.

I will not turn a blind eye to benefit fraud which is paid for from the taxes of others (Ukraine refugees included) blood, sweat and tears grafting away in minimum wage jobs trying to feed a family and paying full rent and bills.

This is not on.

@Cambridgegirl90 have a read from p23-25

My very practical answer is that she isn’t doing it yet, of course you may express to her how wrong it is- but at this stage there is nothing to report. There’s no point in getting upset about the possibility being sounded out, it may or may not come to pass. Many talk bigger than they are, claim they’ll pretend to be students etc. It’s spoken about a lot, sort of ‘I’m hard’ talk- but people chicken out. People in reality are more scared then they act of visa loss, or they lie to impress people they’ve made it some how. I see it often when people have little, they even claim they own multiple houses out of their clever tricks at times- but year after year the reality is they earn minimum wage and rent in shared houses. Maybe it’s pride too. They don’t know the system like British people and generally don’t manipulate it in the same way. They are scared of the system.

If you are aware she does do it, by all means report her. But at this point it’s just big talk.

Are your Ukrainian guests making a connection between fuel poverty and cost of living in the UK? I've spoken to mine and tried to explain the energy cap situation. By January when the new rates are released, it is quite possible many many peiple people will be spending more on their energy bills than rent and food combined. Its disaster waiting to happen.

Current price cap estimates are around £5-6k per year, so £500ish per month. You'd have to live somewhere pretty cheap to rent a home and eat for less than that per month!

It's high, and much higher than we've been used to. But if you were earning minimum wage on 40 hours a week that's £400 a week (£1750 a month gross) so energy would be about 20-25% of your income (if you live like the average Brit). Rent might be 50%, but if you have children you'd get some UC on top of that.

I think it's easy to forget how wealthy we still are by Ukrainian standards. My guest tells me her dad's pension is £60 a month and her mum's around £70. Almost all of that goes on food and fuel. She's spent almost nothing of the money she's earned here - a bit on food but she gets what she can from the food bank. I think she would manage on very little spare cash after rent and bills are paid. But does sound like not all Ukrainian folk are the same, which shouldn't really be surprising I guess

As far as benefit fraud goes, as MumEeee says, she isn't doing it yet. I would send her an email stating very clearly that if she does what she has said she will do, that will be benefit fraud, with serious consequences if she is caught. I would also say that there is no reason to think Ukrainians will be treated any more leniently than other benefit cheats and moreover there is a chance her visa would be revoked. I'd say you are not going to be a party to that and that if you have reason to think she is doing it you would be obliged to report her. Other than that I don't know what you can do at this stage.

On the energy price question, I have spoken to my guest about it but I don't think she really understands. I haven't really given her figures or put it in writing. I need to find a good explanatory article from somewhere that puts the price rises into context. She is very careful with energy use and I have no issues on that front, but I am trying to explain to her that costs of moving out and living independently are going up quickly and she needs to save every penny she can, and then some. She's got some very peculiar spending habits which are none of my business except in so far as I worry they will make it that much harder for her to save what she will need to move out and move on.