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AIBU?

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Original poster

Is Starmer seriously going to resign???

788 replies

Swayingpalmtrees · 10/05/2022 09:51

I have been waiting for a thread to come up about this, but I can't see one to date. I can't believe Keir Starmer has now said he will resign (and Angela Rayner as well) Potentially leaving the Labour party with no leader at all!

Looking at the 'evidence' that is well known and has been published, it appears the Indian takeaway was pre ordered (due to its size) and pre planned according to the staff at the Indian and the leaked memo, it did include quite a number of people and bottles of beer etc and drinking. It was late into the night, so not work related, and no one is suggesting anyone continued to work afterwards as it was so late. I don't see how this is any different to the No10 arrangements! So how on earth will they avoid a fine??

Sir Keir's speech was so wobbly I actually thought he was resigning there and then, and although I appreciate the sentiments of integrity and honour, where on earth does that leave the LP with under two years to the election or less?

Who would replace him? Do we have any thoughts on a plan of any kind?

I am kind of aghast, we are in the middle of a European war, on the cusp of potentially WW3, I am not sure this is a responsible action given the seriousness of our predicament with Russia whom are threatening us on a weekly basis with nuclear war. At the very very least, we need a firm hand on the tiller, so to speak, we do not have time to be squabbling over beer and cheese.
AIBU?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
8
MyHusbandTheIdiot · 10/05/2022 11:33

OP, you are being histrionic, and naive.

As countless other posters have said:

  1. It is completely normal, and believable that people might be working well in to the evening/night in politics, and indeed in many careers, even those that are 9-5. I can think of countless times as a healthcare professional that I was still in work well after 9pm when I was supposed to be working a standard day. Hell, sometimes we ordered takeaway and scoffed it in the doctors’ room in between dealing with whatever shitshow was occurring.
  2. The rules were different at the point at which Starmer is supposed to have carried out his offence, so comparing the events directly is pointless, whether or not rules were broken on either occasion.
  3. It is absolutely, totally undeniable that there are countless points on which literally ANY other party leader in UK history would have resigned on now, that Johnson hasn’t. We are no longer living in a democracy.
Starmer has done the right thing, and whatever the outcome is, he maintains his integrity and that of the Labour Party at this point.
Ambertonix · 10/05/2022 11:33

Considering he has 'self-isolated' i think seven times now, he doesnt come across as someone who knowingly would break the rules. Seems like a bit of a stickler to be honest.

MyHusbandTheIdiot · 10/05/2022 11:33

(And no, I’m not a labour voter)

VanGoghsDog · 10/05/2022 11:35

Swayingpalmtrees · 10/05/2022 11:30

How feeble that you just say I am a tory, without a shred of evidence, I take that as a signal that you can't argue with the facts so now trying to personally attack me.

You will find nowhere that I am of any political class, like most people, I don't care to follow traditional party lines and parties. I am a swing voter, but I see this as a stitch up - a very unfair stitch up. And I hope the police do not let themselves or the country down.

Dunno about swing voter, you sound like a bot.

kirinm · 10/05/2022 11:35

OP has got to be a Tory stooge? So indignant and convinced there will be a fine but also a whitewash which will anger EVERYONE but then also doesn't want Starmer to actually resign. Are you Harry Cole?

stuntbubbles · 10/05/2022 11:35

We have a fair and just police force,
Now I know you’re on the wind-up.

Comefromaway · 10/05/2022 11:35

Anyway, its Chippy Tuesday here at my work so I'm off to order.

MyHusbandTheIdiot · 10/05/2022 11:36

Swayingpalmtrees · 10/05/2022 11:28

Who on earth is going to eat all of that hos 😮 No one is going to order all of that food for ONE person!!!! At least try and look like you are working within the normal range of consumption when you are bending the maths to suit!

Me OP, I would eat that…

Luculentus · 10/05/2022 11:36

Swayingpalmtrees · 10/05/2022 11:11

The police investigation will look into proof that work was conducted during and after the drinks and dinner if the defence of a work related break is to be believed, and yes the Labour Party will have to provide proof. A few emails fired off at 1am won't cut it.

The underlying issue here is one of fairness and justice.
If you are going to fine one political party for food and drink consumption in a group etc then you have to apply the same measure to the other party.

There is no reason why the party should have happened at all, the safest decision would be for all members to return to the hotel and safely order room service. They choose to organise the beers, they choose to organise a group dinner - no collective work happened during or after... that is the core issue.

A fine is coming. For sure.

No "political party" has been fined (even if Johnson has got someone else to pay his and Carrie's fines).

This is, purely and simply, a legal issue. You can't just decide that simply because A, who broke the law, has been fined, then B who did something similar that didn't break the law must also be fined. The laws were different at the time of Johnson's 15 gatherings than they were at the time of Starmer's election event. Johnson wasn't fined for food and drink consumption in a group, he was fined because it was a social gathering, not a work one - any idiot (apart, apparently, from Johnson himself) can work out that a gathering involving birthday cake and various people who don't work for the relevant organisation isn't necessary for work purposes. Feeding people who have done a long day's work together is highly likely to be necessary for work purposes.

Hospedia · 10/05/2022 11:36

Here is a takeaway from Spice Lounge in Durham. Two bhajis, pilau rice, and what looks to be a tikka masala. You could share the bhajis, one each. You could share the rice although you wouldn't get much, that's a small carton. You could also split the masala if you didn't mind having mainly sauce as you only get around 5-6 pieces of chicken in it.

Still wouldn't be able to feed 30 for £200 though.

Hospedia · 10/05/2022 11:38

Forgot to add the photo.

I am now also gasping for a curry and a beer to the point that I've just messaged a pal to ask if they fancy a lunch meet up tomorrow.

Is Starmer seriously going to resign???
Maggiethecat · 10/05/2022 11:38

@Swayingpalmtrees - 🤣 'defending the indefensible' - the irony!

VanGoghsDog · 10/05/2022 11:38

Swayingpalmtrees · 10/05/2022 11:33

And what is painfully obvious on here is in fact the LP bleeding hearts churning out every excuse under the sun. Defending the indefensible.

We have a fair and just police force, or we should have, of course they need to be fined for having a dinner party. Most people will believe that to be outside the rules at the time, no matter how you try to spin it!

People can believe what they want - and they did believe an awful lot of shit about the rules at the time - but what matters is the law. The police don't work on made up rules, suggestions, guidelines. They work on law.

Can you please link to the law that was in place in 2021 when this happened and show how it has been broken. That would be really helpful.

the80sweregreat · 10/05/2022 11:39

I don't think he could ' back track' now could he? Honestly ? He has put it out there now.
If Durham police fine him ( whenever they have looked into it all ) then he'll have to resign.
I don't think there is any doubt that he will do this.
I wonder how long it will take to sort out?

Original poster
Swayingpalmtrees · 10/05/2022 11:39

No wonder we have an obesity crisis - who on earth would eat all of that in one sitting!!

OP posts:
YellowAndGreenToBeSeen · 10/05/2022 11:39

Swayingpalmtrees · 10/05/2022 10:18

Do you honestly think the British public will believe that he was working, even though they can see people standing around at nearly 9pm drinking beer and eating curry?

It will look like a police stitch up if they do not fine. There will be an uproar and a huge backlash if the police are not seen to be acting fairly and treating both parties equally.
If he is double bluffing that is a huge risk to take and one that might see the end of his career now.

I’ve frequently - very very frequently - worked till gone 8 or 9pm, stopped for food and a beer with colleagues (delivered to the office) and then carried on working till past midnight.

Of course people will be able to conceive of such a thing. We don’t all work 9-5 / in places that fire you for having a beer.

Luculentus · 10/05/2022 11:39

Swayingpalmtrees · 10/05/2022 11:15

I think Starmer would have been wise to wait until the second police investigation has been concluded before making a decision and a statement.

Now most of us are simply waiting for him to go, and worried about the next leader and who it might be.

Had he waited, you and people like you would have had a lovely time over the next few weeks demanding to know why he won't say that he will resign if fined.

The truth is that the Tory party are now in a total panic that their bluff has been called and that Starmer comes out of this as the person with integrity, unlike Johnson.

Do tell us, do you think Johnson should have resigned by now?

VanGoghsDog · 10/05/2022 11:40

Out of interest, what is the difference between "order" and "pre order"?

SleeplessInEngland · 10/05/2022 11:41

Boris-bot is malfunctioning! 😆

Hospedia · 10/05/2022 11:42

Swayingpalmtrees · 10/05/2022 11:39

No wonder we have an obesity crisis - who on earth would eat all of that in one sitting!!

Lots of people, we're not all possessors of teeny tiny appetites who can subsist on the dew brushed from half a lettuce leaf. Some of us eat normally.

HerculesMulligan · 10/05/2022 11:43

You'd be much more credible if you rationed your exclamation marks, OP.

caringcarer · 10/05/2022 11:43

Of course not. He and Raynor made the grand announcements safe in the knowledge that Durham police policy is to warn not fine. He won't get a fine. The Met issues fines for first offence.

Luculentus · 10/05/2022 11:43

Starmer and the rest of the party need to PROVE that they were working collectively post beer and Indian at 10pm - they need to PROVE they were having a break. This is the issue, they did not carry on working and returned to the hotel.

Where exactly is that stated in the relevant statutory provisions, OP? Why does work not count unless it happens in the same venue?

stuntbubbles · 10/05/2022 11:43

Hospedia · 10/05/2022 11:38

Forgot to add the photo.

I am now also gasping for a curry and a beer to the point that I've just messaged a pal to ask if they fancy a lunch meet up tomorrow.

He ought to resign over ordering what looks like a terrible generic curry.

maddy68 · 10/05/2022 11:44

It's fairly obvious to see that no breaches were made. They work into the night at campaign times (and often Throughout the year )

He knows what he is doing

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