Is Starmer seriously going to resign???

[Swayingpalmtrees]

I have been waiting for a thread to come up about this, but I can't see one to date. I can't believe Keir Starmer has now said he will resign (and Angela Rayner as well) Potentially leaving the Labour party with no leader at all!

Looking at the 'evidence' that is well known and has been published, it appears the Indian takeaway was pre ordered (due to its size) and pre planned according to the staff at the Indian and the leaked memo, it did include quite a number of people and bottles of beer etc and drinking. It was late into the night, so not work related, and no one is suggesting anyone continued to work afterwards as it was so late. I don't see how this is any different to the No10 arrangements! So how on earth will they avoid a fine??

Sir Keir's speech was so wobbly I actually thought he was resigning there and then, and although I appreciate the sentiments of integrity and honour, where on earth does that leave the LP with under two years to the election or less?

Who would replace him? Do we have any thoughts on a plan of any kind?

I am kind of aghast, we are in the middle of a European war, on the cusp of potentially WW3, I am not sure this is a responsible action given the seriousness of our predicament with Russia whom are threatening us on a weekly basis with nuclear war. At the very very least, we need a firm hand on the tiller, so to speak, we do not have time to be squabbling over beer and cheese.
AIBU?

Why do you have no doubt, given the information available and the relevant legal requirements? Why precisely do you say with such certainty that this gathering wasn't reasonably necessary for the purposes of the election campaign?

Why? A beer with a curry makes no difference to anyone's ability to work.

Come on, Lisa Nandy! Perhaps more suited to being a dinner lady.

Wow. And you accuse Starmer of elitism!

Why would a dossier given to the police in aid of an ongoing investigation be posted online?

Do you seriously believe the Labour Party would have announced that it had compiled this dossier if it didn't exist? If so, your fantasies are really getting seriously out of hand, OP.

Why? A beer with a curry makes no difference to anyone's ability to work.

That's manifestly not true.

I'd presume he knows or is very sure he hasn't broken any rules so it's fine to investigate and he'll be found innocent.

My parents run a very successful construction business. Some of their best ideas have been thought of after they've had a few!

Both are sweeping statements. I wouldn’t want a midwife performing a sweep on me after a late-night beer and curry, or my bus driver having a beer and curry before driving. But a bunch of party workers discussing speeches? Absolutely fine. Context is all.

Do tell us precisely where the "gushing" on this thread is, OP. Hint: disagreeing with you isn't gushing.

Well exactly. My dad and his managers coming up with ideas to make the business ore efficient, or a marketing strategy etc etc after a few beers is worlds apart from one of the site workers going up a ladder to work on a roof!!

But a bunch of party workers discussing speeches? Absolutely fine. Context is all.

That doesn't appear to be the work that's being referenced post-curry however.

From the evidence submitted, it appears to be video editing by two aides, which I doubt would be improved by booze as it's about precision. However I suspect the aides themselves didn't partake of the beer, or only very minimally.

OP, I do hope you're not silly enough to believe that the only people who can conceivably have been working are the people sending messages or physically editing documents? I can work my socks off for hours on end without doing either.

Remember, yet again, the criterion is whether the gathering was reasonably necessary for the purposes of the election campaign. That is the specific exemption in the rules in force at the time. You have not offered one solitary reason for saying it wasn't.

I think the person that would lead Labour to win the next election is Andy Burnham

Won’t be Emily Thornberry though a very intelligent, polished and professional MP her white van remark will remind voters of what Lady Nugee thinks of some working class voters

I think once beer gate is over this may won a few more voters over to support Starmer but he isn’t connecting with voters that’s a bigger problem for Labour than beer gate

Tories will be happy if Starmer stays he isn’t too much of a threat

The thing is, though, that you aren't entitled to your own facts. And that is what we are seeing on this thread. It's almost as if you have a vested interest in misrepresenting them.

OP, I do hope you're not silly enough to believe that the only people who can conceivably have been working are the people sending messages or physically editing documents?

This seems to be based on the evidence they themselves have submitted to the police, outlined in the link above.

Not if it was reasonably necessary for work. And having something to eat does tend to come into that category.

They were on the campaign trail. It's highly likely that they were still discussing strategies, plans for the campaign, how to edit that document, etc etc.

I can work very hard indeed after a curry and a beer. I suspect most people can.

Are they saying that is the only work that was done, or offering it as evidence of work being done by some people at the event? Normally on the campaign trail there would be loads of people working on lots of different aspects of the campaign, including kicking around strategy ideas.

God, I can’t, I need a lie down and to loosen my trousers.

But were I at work I would, well, work. And these people were at work. Nothing in the law said they had to work hard.

All of this shows how ill-thought-out the covid laws were. Even the people who made those laws can’t follow them. The incompetence from all of them is utterly depressing.

No, they are saying they have produced a whole dossier which includes time stamped evidence of video and document edits, and WhatsApp discussions. They don't appear to suggest that that is the only work that was being done. I strongly suspect that the contents of the documents themselves will give further evidence of work that was going on, e.g. WhatsApp messages asking that specific steps be taken at the suggestion of the people present, changes in the edits which were the product of ongoing discussions amongst those people, etc.

I seriously think the only purpose of this thread is to try and normalise what Johnson did.

It's to get us all saying: 'It's OK to have food and alcohol.'

Which is true - at 10pm, in the final 1/4 of a long day, yes. It is.

But while that is true of what Starmer may have done we must not lose sight of the fact this is not what Johnson did.

So, when the Big Dog Defenders come back with, 'Ah ha! You say you're OK with food + alcohol + work,' remember:

This is not what Johnson did.

What Johnson did was:

Mislead Parliament

Abuse his position.

Break his own laws.

Hold a series of social events.

Invite mates.

Repeatedly.

Because he sees being Prime Minister as a joke and a sinecure.

Because he is unfit for this role.

We deserve better than Johnson.

Don't let anyone normalise what this man and his government have done and continue to do.

I don't know what was ordered.

Do try to follow your own bloody thread - we were talking about the example posted by a previous poster of what one might order per head and how much it might cost (using the menu from the actual restaurant) which you went on to say literally no-one could ever eat and then referred to as a five course meal, which it wasn't. I was merely reminding you that the food we were discussing (the EXAMPLE) was nothing like five course, it was two at most. And given the cost of the whole order there's no way they had five courses.

If you will indulge (and it seems you will) in ridiculous hyperbole then expect to be challenged.

Few people on this thread have gushed about Starmer btw. And I definitely haven't, so I have no idea what this new hyperbole is designed to do.

They don't appear to suggest that that is the only work that was being done.

I only have the article to go on, which talks a lot about video editing and not much else. It would seem a reasonable assumption right now, I guess we'll find out