To ask why having an elective C-Section is so frowned upon?

[Rosesandbutterflys]

I am (hopefully) having an elective C-Section soon. First baby, don't want anymore children after.

I've always had a fear of child birth, which over the past 5 years has been compounded by a lot of people around me having children and the vast majority of these (though I appreciate I'm probably unlucky here) have been pretty traumatic births that have ended in severe tears, forceps and a lot of the time, an emergency section anyway. Granted their experiences have mostly been better on their second birth/ child.

Nothing and I truly mean nothing about natural childbirth/ labour appeals to me. Not the hours of pain, pushing, potential rips/ tears, forcep intervention, epidural (yes I appreciate I'd have one of these for a section), damage of my pelvic floor and the panic and stress of potentially having to be rushed to theatre because it just wasn't going to happen naturally and the baby is in distress or whatever.

Now don't get me wrong, nothing about a c-section appeals to me either, it's absolutely no walk in the park and I'm dreading it, but it has to come out some way and I am a person that likes to plan things and to somewhat be in control/ aware of the plan. I have also had abdominal surgery before (though not as severe as a C-section) and I know recovery is likely to be painful and slower than if I were to have a natural birth. But for me, this is the preferred/ lesser of the 2 evils option.

I have also spent hours pouring over research as to the benefits of a vaginal birth over a c-section and last night came across a NICE/ NHS study/ research that found that actually, for a planned/ elective c-section, the risk to the mother of a c-section compared to a vaginal birth is pretty much the same. It states that the risk of the baby ending up in NICU with a C-section is 13.9% compared to a vaginal birth which is 6.3%, so double the risk, BUT it says the research does not take into account the fact that most c-sections undertaken are for medical reasons and therefore the likelihood of the baby needing NICU attention after it's born is increased anyway.

It then went on to say that the risks of an unplanned, emergency C-Section are a lot higher than a natural birth/ elective/ planned C-Section. So I guess if each woman was guaranteed to have a straightforward, natural birth, then great, but a lot of women do end up needing an emergency c-section so, technically they are more at risk than someone who has chosen an elective.

This now seems like I am bashing natural delivery and I'm not at all I totally admire and respect women that chose that route, I only wish I were that brave.

However, the responses I have had from people my whole pregnancy when I have admitted I am opting for an elective C-section have been ridiculous. Not one person has responded positively, all I've had is 'Oh, really? Are you sure??' and 'Oh, why on earth would you elect to have that?' etc etc. Or just a stony faced, tight smile and 'oh right' making it clear they disapprove but not actually coming out and saying it.

I got told last night that the reason I'm getting these reactions is because a C-section is 'taking the easy way out '😕

If that's the case, why on earth wouldn't you? Why is it that it seems the prerequisite to being a good mother is seemingly having to martyr yourself all the time?

So many of my friends that have had children and also the women in my NCT class who are preparing for their births have all expressed dismay/ distress at having to have any pain relief, they all want it to be as natural as possible and I know my friends that haven't had 'textbook' births still harbour 'guilt' and sadness to this day. Why? If you need gas and air or an epidural, so what? What exactly am I missing? If they ended/end up with forceps or an emergency section, it's not their fault, it's just one of those things. Surely modern medicine has provided these things to make childbirth safer?

Anyway, gone off on a tangent now but if you disapprove of someone having an elective c-section, could you tell me why?

No idea. I think it’s mostly cost saving for the NHS tbh.
Don’t worry too much about your CS- mine was a great experience and I healed really well and quickly.

Was it you that posted this yesterday the same thread? Just to clarify people didn’t say that’s what they thought they said that’s what others see it as, no one on the thread said it about you? I’m not sure why you need to tell people? Just don’t mention it? I don’t think I told anyone how I was planning to give birth?

Stop discussing your birth plan with people? It's the only way to shut them up.

Can you link the other thread? Definitely wasn't me!! I don't tell anyone, it's people saying 'and are you having a natural birth?' and then I feel awkward lying so just tell the truth.

People do frown upon it, just like people frown upon FF rather than BF etc, it's naïve to say they don't.

Don't tell people. Just go for it. I've had both caesarean section and vaginal birth and greatly preferred the caesarean. There really was a lot to be said for it.

I feel like i could of written this post.

I am currently 19 weeks and have been toying with the idea of asking for a Elective C-section. Almpst everyone i have spoken to have turned up their nose like i have just told them im planning on making the baby sleep outside.

I too have no idea why look down on a C-section like its any worse than the complete unknown of childbirth. Just wanted to say i am with you x

I think it’s all mixed up in this weird complex women have about wanting birth to be ‘natural’ while ignoring natural also means maternal and infant death. I have a friend who described the day her second was born healthy and well by planned c-section a week early as ‘the worst day of her life’.

I am having a planned section due to a potential issue I might face in vaginal labour and anyone I’ve told has been horrified I don’t get to ‘try for a natural birth’. Whereas for me I’m just looking forward to meeting my baby and baby hopefully arriving safely. Maybe it’s NCT or pregnancy books that indoctrinate people in to this idea that natural birth is best. I don’t know why I’m immune to not caring about birth just caring about the baby being ok! It’s probably also wrapped up in the ‘Mummy martyr’ complex a lot of women have around birth and breastfeeding - ie if it’s not horrible and hard you’re not doing it right!

it's people saying 'and are you having a natural birth?'

This is an odd question. Is it being asked at an NCT class or something? Some women get very invested in their own birth choices, I think, and take anyone making different choices as implied criticism (see also: every other aspect of parenting). Just swerve the question if you can and ignore the frowns if you can't. It's no one else's business.

www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4538432-to-understand-the-attitudes?reply=116890453

identical thread from last night about it being the “easy way out”

Why are you trying to imply I've posted the same thread twice??! I absolutely haven't, yes it is just a coincidence and MNHQ can confirm that.

I didn't read the thread last night so I wouldn't know what the comments were re judging. I don't opt to discuss it with people but when asked directly, which I have been now I'm not sure how I'm meant to get round that without lying? And actually, I don't want to lie because I don't think an elective c-section is some big, dirty secret.

People don’t like to see others take the ‘easy way out’ because suffering when you don’t have to is virtuous and makes you a better person. Or something. There’ll also be the assumption that you’re a total idiot that’s completely oblivious to the risks involved with a c section (like there’s none involved with vaginal delivery) like you haven’t done one iota of research.

It’s your body. Do what’s right for you.

Whatever you do as a mother will be judged some way or another. Birth methods, feeding, sleep, nursery, parenting methods ... Best way is just to crack on and be comfortable in your own choice and not feel like you have to justify anything to anyone.

If you’re feeling fiery just tell them you are at risk of tearing to your arsehole, so you don’t fancy that. Hopefully will shut them up

Technically anyone having a vb is at risk of that, so not a lie.

As someone who has torn through their arsehole and then had 2 ELCS, I know which was a more calm and serene entry into the world for the babies :)

Totally understand an elective. Let me correct the responses to you saying, "I'm having an elective c section."

"You are a brave, strong woman. You know your own mind and have done your research. Wishing you a good recovery and a beautiful, healthy baby."

I have had a drug free birth and a third degree tear. I made my choice and I wouldn't change it but I have also seen an emergency c section and it was probably one of the worst experiences of my life. I respect every woman's right to make her own choices. We are all basically heroes.

You’re not missing anything. Yes most people want to take the natural route and halve the risk of the baby ending up in NICU. The vast majority of vaginal births don’t end in c section. There is also a cost implication to an already stretched NHS and a higher risk of post surgery complications for you including infections and not being able to have more children.

i was one of those who needed an EMCS with my first. All fine thankfully. With my second I had an ELCS due to my increased risk of needing another EMCS it was actually the safest route. DC2 was also the last child I planned to have so I wasn’t worried about the implications for future pregnancies. The ELCS was straightforward but I did get a recurring infection which hampered recovery time and was quite distressing when trying to look after a newborn and toddler. I’m left with scars which are below my bikini line so not usually visible. I don’t usually carry a lot of extra weight but if I do eat too many crisps I start to get a bit of an overhang that wasn’t there before. Also I got all feeling back but I hated the numbness you get around the scar area - for some people the feeling never returns.

Of course because of the costs and availability of staff. An anaesthetic consultant doing a cesarian is one taken away from emergency, critical surgery.

So it is a selfish choice. I don't think it's the end of the world, but I'm surprised you didn't consider this.

Just own your choice. It's hard. I had an ELCS and got fed up with one friend who said oh that's a shame and asked if I could bring things into the opportunity theatre. Also Elective doesn't always mean there was much choice in the matter, just that it was planned and not an emergency.

I was worried about a vaginal birth too. I found a hypnobirthing course helped with the fear. I ended up with an episiotomy and suction cup to assist as baby was in distress. My labour was too fast for anything other than gas and air (wonderful stuff!). Honestly though, recovery was easy and my vagina is back to normal. Although, to be fair my baby was smaller than average...

A c section isn't the easy way out people think it is. As long as they are fully informed of the risks, I think women should be allowed to choose how they deliver their babies

It’s not that surprising that there would be 2 threads using the same phrase though, given it’s a line regularly trotted out verbatim on this topic :)

I think women should be allowed to choose what’s right for them BUT the NHS is on its knees and the cost of a c-section is more than double that of a natural birth. It’s not an unlimited resource and if increasing numbers request c sections then free NHS maternity care as we know it may well be very different when our children are having babies.

Cost aside, it only matters what is right for mum and baby.

I don't care what anyone else does, and I think you should stop explaining your personal decisions to all and sundry if you don't want them to have opinions, including apparently when you are just interpreting their expression.

Surgical adhesions aren't much fun, but the risk is yours to take. As you say, plenty of risk however the baby comes out. Most people opt for non-surgery because that is the option with a chance of having lower recovery time.

Buy in plenty of paracetamol and ibuprofen in advance to keep at home, volume purchase restrictions mean frequent trips out for your DH to get drugs otherwise.

I remember when I was pregnant the lady serving me in Argos commenting on my bump and asking if I was going to have a natural birth. I definitely think there's a pressure on women (largely from other women) to suffer the pain as some sort of badge of honour. I had a vaginal birth but ended up having an epidural as the pain was too much. I still feel like I chickened out which I know is silly really. I only think that about my own birth and don't judge other women for wanting to avoid pain.

The only reason I'd personally express surprise at someone wanting a c-section is because I hate the idea of not being fully mobile and having to take things easy post-surgery but I get that not everyone feels that way.

It’s because the op said “I was told last night” and the thread was posted last night.. so I was just clarifying that no one said that personally about the op

I was going to go for ELCS for same reasons as you @Rosesandbutterflys

In the end I agreed to see how I found labour and actually had an uncomplicated vaginal birth (6hrs) and no damage with no epidural as was too quick. As it turned out in my case I was glad I made the decision, as I didn’t even need a paracetamol after the birth and was bouncing around the ward within an hour. Didn’t even hurt to wee after which astounded me.

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with ELCS but in hindsight I am glad I faced my fears instead. I had such a positive birth (it hurts like a bastard at the time but it was honestly a good experience) and I was an old bat at 41.