AIBU to wonder why so many people assume Johnny Depp is the good guy and Amber Heard is the villain? ..

[Cowslip4567]

People (from what I am reading in a variety of places on the internet) seem to have decided this even before the trial has been concluded. Presumably, we won't know all of the evidence until the trial ends.

The previous trial in the UK concluded that there was indeed evidence that JD was indeed a wife beater. How come everyone feels that they are sure previous trial had the wrong verdict?

100% agree with your post @MarieIVanArkleStinks

The lawyers for AH certainly do come across as hamfisted and incompetent (I’m sure they aren’t but…). In most instances you can see where they are trying to get to but they hit a road block with their questioning when they don’t get the answer they were expecting/hoping for and they appear to get a bit flummoxed and flustered so, instead of trying to move it on they spend 20 mins rewording the question 10 different ways in the hope they get the answer they want. The ‘muffin’ questioning was a good example of this, you could see where they were trying to go with that line but the door was firmly shut with the answer they got. The questioning of the LAPD officers was similar as was the questioning of the front of house chap at the apartment block where the main line of continual questioning was focused on hair, makeup and fashion, there only so many times the man can say I don’t remember her hairstyle, whether she had blusher on etc etc. All that is achieved is that you end up with fed up and disinterested witnesses.

The hearsay on your own question probably sums it up. I’m not sure how much she is paying them but it’s probably too much.

I am also finding the body language and demeanours of both parties interesting. It is like two extremes.

Interesting take on it all here

melmagazine.com/en-us/story/johnny-depp-amber-heart-trial-fan-reaction

Couldn't have written it better myself, I agree with you both.

I'd have just started answering no to every question in the end also because I would have become fed up with the same question becoming hashed multiple times. This does no good, you need to work with the witness not bore them to death and shut them down to single word answers.

I was also surprised when AH team started reading the rag piece headlines, I'd have objected as JD on "relevance" and when questioned asked "what is the question Mr Rottenborn is proposing, because right now all he is testing his his own ability to read with clarification from the witness" it really should have a been a "get to the point" moment for the judge.

Or maybe in UK courts we just don't need/want showboating and questioning that lasts an hour on one point. We really do operate a "get to the point" style, trials are long enough without it being drawn out.

"Johnny is that you ? I thought you were great in Edward Scissorhands."

Thanks Amber. You weren't too bad in Aquaman either.

"No, you’re saying that, and you’re trying to put your words in my mouth. As I said upthread, I’ve been through an abusive relationship so all the little manipulation tricks don’t work on me now, sorry."

I'm not interested in your history, it makes no difference to what you say and lots of us have suffered abusive relationships. No-one is manipulating you, merely pointing out the weakness in your argument.

"Perhaps women choose methods like pills rather than a gun or jumping off a building because they are more concerned about not leaving someone a gory mess to clean up."

Perhaps. Not very likely though. And hanging yourself doesn't leave all that much mess.

"Whatever the reason is, if someone is at the point of undertaking any serious self-harm action they are clearly in severe distress"

I agree, which is what I said.

"so it seems extremely heartless to describe their survival afterwards as “incompetence” or “stupidity”."

I didn't describe them as stupid or incompetent. I said that was what you were unintentionally implying, that they wanted to die but simply weren't very good at achieving their goal. I suggested a more likely scenario is they didn't really want to kill themselves, unlike the men who actually kill themselves in far higher numbers. People who really want to die usually manage to end their lives without too much difficulty.

"His swagger, habit of bursting into laughter at inappropriate moments and the quips he no doubt thinks are clever and witty, might well be impressing his legions of doe-eyed fans, but it isn't as smart as he seems to think it is.

I think most people who saw them would think a lot of his responses are pretty funny (regardless of whether they are fans), mainly because of the stupidity of Amber's lawyers. Other witnesses are reacting in a not dissimilar way, including the police and psychiatrist. The whole muffin thing was ludicrous and the cop not knowing who Amber was was hilarious too.

"Judges are a great deal cleverer than Depp, and as a general breed they are not impressed wit that kind of behaviour."

Some judges might be clever, others seem pretty dim, like people in every other profession. This strange veneration of judges on MN is a little weird. I guess it's because the London judge reinforced your view of the case. I wonder if you would think them quite so clever if the judgement had gone the other way. Plus, it's not the judge his quips need to win over but the jury.

domesticviolenceresearch.org/domestic-violence-facts-and-statistics-at-a-glance/

www.researchgate.net/figure/Percentage-of-Sample-with-Male-only-Female-only-and-Mutual-Violence-and-Subtypes-Note_fig1_328565543

www.coastallegalcenter.com/men-women-common-instigator-domestic-violence-cases/

ncadv.org/STATISTICS

There were also two large scale reports that I will track down for you that broke the various types of domestic violence down. I get this may go against your confirmation bias but you should do some reasearch and learn the actual facts.

Nothing in your post is factual, they are sweeping generalisations that you are trying to make sound factual to fit with your narrative. You are in good company, the world is overpopulated by people who blame women for men’s violence.

I was also surprised when AH team started reading the rag piece headlines, I'd have objected as JD on "relevance" and when questioned asked "what is the question Mr Rottenborn is proposing, because right now all he is testing his his own ability to read with clarification from the witness" it really should have a been a "get to the point" moment for the judge.

Yes, this was another example (along with the playing of the self-harming audio, which could also have been counter productive depending on your interpretation/slant, maybe they were just playing a psychological card, I don’t know). But no follow up questions on either.

"Johnny is that you ? I thought you were great in Edward Scissorhands."

Thanks Amber. You weren't too bad in Aquaman either.

Cheers, I can confirm that Jason Momoa is HOT in real life.

Bizzare isn't it, but I have come to the conclusion in this type of civil media interest case, it's all about showboating rather than facts and testimony. The whole court is a pantomime.

I attend/testify on trials on a regular basis (criminal/crown) due to my career, and I must say I do prefer the UK style to US. Far too much pantomime in the US even in their criminal proceedings. Much evidence presented in US courts wouldn't make it to the court room in the UK.

The UK are very clear cut, court is open for anyone who wishes to attend, but it's not a broadcasting opportunity. To be fair if someone said you are now a witness and the proceedings will be live streamed to the world I'd demand a screen to be sat behind 😂 nobody needs to see my mug for hours lol

I cannot understand why these trials are televised. Who is that helping?

On a really strange side note, does anyone remember when Jason Momoa fessed up to ripping out pages of Amber's book for a prank on set? Really weird behaviour - I'm still to feel really jaded about men and their jokes (be it destroying property or laughing about fucking their wife's dead corpse).

www.news.com.au/entertainment/movies/jason-momoa-slammed-over-amber-heard-anecdote-not-remotely-ok/news-story/5e973df2ed5b50176230131f2efe55fe

What happens if JD* *wins this case?

Will be because he was unfairly labelled

Or

Because of the "patriarchy"

I'm sure plenty will their excuses at the ready

I don't think anyone is going to win this case - they've both already lost.

Even if the jury decides he was defamed by Amber, his awful behaviour is out in public now and she'll be unemployable.

The lawyers on the other hand ....

I think he's unlikely to be able to prove defamation, but if he does win I'm not sure that changes very much. He seems to have left things on bad terms with the big film studios, he may find getting insured will be difficult etc; on the other hand if he actually starts listening to advice I'm sure he can build up to a pretty decent comeback regardless of the verdict.

I don't think losing will change things either, public opinion seems pretty set to me (unless there are big revelations to come).

From a legal POV it's highly likely he'll lose. Defamation is very difficult to win.

If he does win, I expect Heard will appeal and they'll continue to drag the shit out of this

I think both of their careers are shot regardless.

Speaking of Jason Momoa, I just happened to resee the clip of Regina Hall groping him and Josh Brolin at the Oscars. It was just a weird sexualized and inappropriate skit. Got completely overshadowed by the almight SLAP but I can't believe anyone approved this skit

.

Skit itself starts at 2:45. Set up is she calls multiple single men to the stage for a covid test where she says they will need to take off their clothes and she will swab their throats with her tongue. Then she does a covid pat down where she runs her hands all over their bodies. Just bizarro.

That is bizarre @Midlifemusings - they don't look comfortable with the pat down!

Also, this isn't relevant but I just looked up Regina Hall to see what I recognised her from and she's 51 years old!! I would NEVER have guessed that.

"the world is overpopulated by people who blame women for men’s violence."

No, we are blaming women for the violence they commit.

No man made my grandmother violent. She did that all on her own. Stop trying to minimise female violence and male and female victims of female violence.

It is a very odd kind of feminism which wants to pretend women are almost always victims of abuse and rarely the abusers. Women are not angels and men are not devils.

At the most charitable I could say you are wallowing in ignorance but such ignorance is inexcusable when people are pointing out to you the reality of the situation.

"It is a very odd kind of feminism which wants to pretend women are almost always victims of abuse and rarely the abusers. Women are not angels and men are not devils."

Not a single person here nor any feminist is arguing that. You are tilting at windmills.

Did you read the link I posted upthread misssatan?
Men make up 40% of domestic abuse complainants, by number of individuals. Abuse is broader than violence and includes the kind of things you dismissed upthread as "a bit of door slamming"
Women are by far the greatest victims by numbers of reports e.g. levels of repeat victimisation are higher.

Women are by far the greatest number of domestic violence victims.

And in terms of being killed by your partner, 80% of victims are female and 20% male. I don't know how many of those male victims were in same sex relationships.

I don't think anyone here is denying that men are also victims of abuse by women.

I think we all know a few door slammers, screamers, object throwing females in our lives. I certainly know of one who I know blocks exits for people trying to flee from her and who has in the past slapped a male partner. She's not a very nice person.

But what people are simply trying to explain is that women are still proportionally greater in number in victims of domestic abuse, and generally the abuse is greater/more harmful.

Now I'm again not saying that men do not suffer physical, emotional and psychological abuse at the hands of some women. It's just that statistically the number is less. That's all.

Why is the fact she is woman mentioned by anyone? What does being a woman mean to anything? So not as many men r not victims as woman, so what that's not a good argument for JD being abused!