Page 5 | Who's in the wrong here - him or her? Me?

namechange58928585 · 2022-04-09T12:00:25+00:00

Name changed just as not to be identifiable. Good friend of mine, a male colleague from 2 years ago. We've always got on well and kept in touch after his leaving - mostly via text but have met very occasionally for a walk or coffee. My partner is aware and my relationship is OK. His partner had an issue with it (not sure how aware she was of the detail of the friendship but she decided it couldn't possibly be friendship and he wasn't to contact me again) It's definitely friendship, but not sure anyone can reassure her - she seems quite insecure and suspicious of him. I am aware their relationship isn't strong and a big part of their staying together is the children (but I don't know her to get the full picture) Anyway - he has been told zero contact with me or there will be a divorce. This is where I'm uncertain who is doing wrong. He's said fine to her on this, however still wants a friendship with me, just without her knowledge. I can 100% confirm he has never made a move or been inappropriate with me in the past. If she weren't so reactive about it all I'd assume there would be no need for the secrecy. So if we remain friends, who is in the wrong here? His wife for having no trust in him and disallowing him female friends? Him for staying friendly with me when she's insecure about it? Me for wanting to stay in touch with my friend when my partner has no issue and they've even briefly met? It's not an affair, nothing physical has happened. It's not anything beyond the same friendships I have with my female work friends from previous jobs. There's no extreme emotional attachment or anything like that but sometimes we do talk about our lives and offer advice. Nothing I wouldn't be happy with my other half seeing. I'm just not sure who is being unreasonable - I like to think neither of us are, but appreciate he is now hiding this friendship from her.

MichelleScarn · 09/04/2022 16:25

*I am aware their relationship isn't strong and a big part of their staying together is the children (but I don't know her to get the full picture)

Anyway - he has been told zero contact with me or there will be a divorce.*

So zero contact with any female friends, or just special you I wonder?....

gannett · 09/04/2022 16:35

His wife is the most unreasonable. Policing your partner's friends is hugely controlling and an immediate red line for me.

He's unreasonable - for lying to her, yes, but more for not standing up to her and staying with her.

Their toxic relationship isn't the OP's fault at all. In her situation my priority would be to support a friend stuck in a toxic marriage and encourage them to get themselves out of it - as it would be if it was a female friend whose husband thought I was a bad influence and banned her from seeing me.

lemongreentea · 09/04/2022 16:41

I agree. Their marriage sounds like it will end in divorce tbh and hes trying to line you up as his next love interest. You'll probably end up in a relationship as you seem wayyyy too invested in his love/emotional life.

Feel sorry for your partner in all this, although maybe he just sees you as a casual things and is not invested in the relationship so doesnt care if you get together with your friend?

WonderfulYou · 09/04/2022 16:41

and trotting about the enabler's cliche 'controlling' every time another woman wants to set boundaries within her relationship.

If your partner tells you who you can and can’t see then that is not setting boundaries, that is controlling.

SickAndTiredAgain · 09/04/2022 16:49

and trotting about the enabler's cliche 'controlling' every time another woman wants to set boundaries within her relationship.

But where does “setting boundaries” become “controlling”. What’s the line?
Because if DH said to me “if you see that friend again, it’s divorce” then I would consider that very controlling. And tbh it would probably mean the marriage was over anyway because if it’s got to the point where, for whatever reason, one person feels like need to set such a hard line, there’s clearly no trust. Obviously in this case she’s right not to trust him, since he’s lying to her, but that doesn’t mean I think what she said is any less controlling.

NeedleNoodle3 · 09/04/2022 16:51

Is it controlling or is telling him clearly what she finds is acceptable? I very much doubt her saying this has come from thin air.

bembridge11 · 09/04/2022 16:51

Back away. Respect her attempts to save her marriage.

gannett · 09/04/2022 17:00

@NeedleNoodle3

Is it controlling or is telling him clearly what she finds is acceptable? I very much doubt her saying this has come from thin air.

I'd bet money that if a man told his wife she couldn't be friends with someone, you'd realise that controlling and possessive behaviour can indeed come from thin air (or at least, from his own toxic personality rather than his partner's actions).

Unreasonably jealous people, men and women, are all too fucking common. Bin them all off is what I say. I have had to tell too many friends (both sexes) that over the years, I'm sick of them.

SunshineAndFizz · 09/04/2022 17:01

This is a no brainier...tell him goodbye and hang out with your other friends. End of.

SleeplessInEngland · 09/04/2022 17:03

Reverse the genders and the jealous husband would be called controlling, so she’s exactly that.

However I’d end the friendship anyway, it’s surely not worth the hassle.

GreenFingersWouldBeHandy · 09/04/2022 17:04

not sure how aware she was of the detail of the friendship

Why should she 'be aware' or not? Your intentions do not sound honourable to be honest. Do you have a crush on him? If not, why would you cause trouble in his relationship?

SickAndTiredAgain · 09/04/2022 17:05

Is it controlling or is telling him clearly what she finds is acceptable?

But I don’t think those are mutually exclusive. Someone telling their partner what they find acceptable could easily also be them being very controlling.

PinkSyCo · 09/04/2022 17:05

Back away. Respect her attempts to save her marriage.

A marriage without trust is not salvable.

StScholastica · 09/04/2022 17:10

So hes willing to risk his marriage and his family for the sake of an occasional friendship with you? I'd say that moves things to another level.
I would back off if I were you as I hate drama.

NoSquirrels · 09/04/2022 17:12

Anyway - he has been told zero contact with me or there will be a divorce. This is where I'm uncertain who is doing wrong. He's said fine to her on this, however still wants a friendship with me, just without her knowledge.

He’s in the wrong.

Doesn’t matter if she’s paranoid or controlling - he’s had the choice and he knows the consequences yet he’s lying to his wife.

I wouldn’t be friends with him whilst he regained married.

He’s lying to her rather than sorting his relationship out. Don’t be complicit.

MrsTerryPratchett · 09/04/2022 17:12

@PinkSyCo

Back away. Respect her attempts to save her marriage.

A marriage without trust is not salvable.

So he leaves. But he shouldn't lie and sneak around.

NeedleNoodle3 · 09/04/2022 17:13

I'd bet money that if a man told his wife she couldn't be friends with someone, you'd realise that controlling and possessive behaviour can indeed come from thin air (or at least, from his own toxic personality rather than his partner's actions)a.a.z

Unreasonably jealous people, men and women, are all too fucking common. Bin them all off is what I say. I have had to tell too many friends (both sexes) that over the years, I'm sick of them
Fair enough, I guess I was thinking of a couple of friends who aren’t at all jealous or controlling but have had enough of their DH’s becoming friends with women at work, helping them and then gradually crossing the line.

gannett · 09/04/2022 17:17

@NeedleNoodle3

I'd bet money that if a man told his wife she couldn't be friends with someone, you'd realise that controlling and possessive behaviour can indeed come from thin air (or at least, from his own toxic personality rather than his partner's actions)a.a.z

Unreasonably jealous people, men and women, are all too fucking common. Bin them all off is what I say. I have had to tell too many friends (both sexes) that over the years, I'm sick of them
Fair enough, I guess I was thinking of a couple of friends who aren’t at all jealous or controlling but have had enough of their DH’s becoming friends with women at work, helping them and then gradually crossing the line.

That's fair too - I'd be supporting and encouraging friends whose partners cheated to leave them rather than try to fix it by controlling them.

Just don't think responding to toxic behaviour with a different kind of toxic behaviour is a real fix for a relationship.

NeedleNoodle3 · 09/04/2022 17:19

Very true.

godmum56 · 09/04/2022 17:22

@MidnightMeltdown
"I don't agree with this. This guys wife has basically forced him to lie by giving him an ultimatum and telling him that he's not allowed to see his friend. That's completely unreasonable. He clearly needs to leave this women."

nope that is called "look what you made me do" nobody has forced him to lie

5128gap · 09/04/2022 17:23

@SickAndTiredAgain

and trotting about the enabler's cliche 'controlling' every time another woman wants to set boundaries within her relationship.

But where does “setting boundaries” become “controlling”. What’s the line?
Because if DH said to me “if you see that friend again, it’s divorce” then I would consider that very controlling. And tbh it would probably mean the marriage was over anyway because if it’s got to the point where, for whatever reason, one person feels like need to set such a hard line, there’s clearly no trust. Obviously in this case she’s right not to trust him, since he’s lying to her, but that doesn’t mean I think what she said is any less controlling.

The line is where the person in the relationship thinks it is, not where strangers not in the relationship think it should be. If she said to him I'll divorce you if you kiss another woman/watch porn/don't stop smoking, some people would consider that setting reasonable boundaries, while others would think it equally controlling. It's very subjective. My view is that everyone is entitled to say what the deal breakers are for them, and other people should not use allegations of 'controlling' to urge them to tolerate things they're uncomfortable with. It so often just gaslights women into putting up with things they don't want to, and enables men to get away with poor behaviour.

PinkSyCo · 09/04/2022 17:25

So he leaves. But he shouldn't lie and sneak around.

He has been forced into that situation by his controlling wife. Why should he have to leave his home? If a man told his female partner either drop your friend or say goodbye to your kids and fuck off out of our home Mumsnet would be in uproar.

NoSquirrels · 09/04/2022 17:28

@PinkSyCo

So he leaves. But he shouldn't lie and sneak around.

He has been forced into that situation by his controlling wife. Why should he have to leave his home? If a man told his female partner either drop your friend or say goodbye to your kids and fuck off out of our home Mumsnet would be in uproar.

MN might be in uproar (because it’s outrageous controlling behaviour) but the advice would be the same: leave your marriage and be free to pursue your own friendships. Not stay in your marriage and lie to your controlling partner.

MrsTerryPratchett · 09/04/2022 17:30

@PinkSyCo

So he leaves. But he shouldn't lie and sneak around.

He has been forced into that situation by his controlling wife. Why should he have to leave his home? If a man told his female partner either drop your friend or say goodbye to your kids and fuck off out of our home Mumsnet would be in uproar.

Leave is shorthand for ending the relationship. Al the men I know who've ended relationships recently have had shared residency of some sort and either sold the family home (or ended the rental), or the woman has moved out.

Lying is not the answer.

5128gap · 09/04/2022 17:32

@WonderfulYou

and trotting about the enabler's cliche 'controlling' every time another woman wants to set boundaries within her relationship.

If your partner tells you who you can and can’t see then that is not setting boundaries, that is controlling.

Fair enough. If the alternative is having to smile stoically like a 1950s housewife while waving off a man to do precisely what he fancies, including badmouthing me to another woman, I'll take that.