… to wonder why people continue having more children if they cannot cope with the ones that they already have?

[NetflixMom21]

… or am I just being extremely judgemental?

A couple of recent interactions and conversations with people that I know has got me thinking about this. In one situation; the person in question already has a couple of children plus a couple of stepchildren which they have 50% of the time, they are always complaining of having no money, they have openly said that they max out their credit cards to survive and pay their bills every month and are in a lot of debt because of it… now they have just announced that they are having another child.

In the second situation; the person in question has 5 children. The first child was born with a severe disability and they were told that it could possibly be genetic and that if they had anymore children, those children could have a disability too. The second child was also born with a disability, but not as severe as the first. The person then went onto having 3 more children, of which, another child has a similar disability to the first 2. So 3 out of 5 children are disabled. This person now admits that they are unable to cope and it massively impacts on the care that they are able to give their children.

In the third situation; someone that I know was born with cystic fibrosis (they are the first born child of the family). They nearly died as a young child and was only just about saved by a lung transplant which they were incredibly lucky to get. The parents have gone on to have more and more children, even though they know that they have the gene for cystic fibrosis and any child that they have may be born with it too and after watching how badly their first child has suffered. Well another child has been born with it, and suffers horrendously already (they are reception/year 1 age) and unless they receive a lung transplant, they might not even make it to a teenager.

My own situation; I have a progressive disability myself and also a child that has a disability. I know that I will never have anymore children (I am looking into surgical procedures to ensure this) because I know that firstly, I will not be able to cope with my own illness and that is not fair on the child especially as I know that there is a possibility of me having another child with a disability, and secondly; I do not know how much independence my child will go onto have as a teenager and adult, and if I had another child, it would impact on the level of care that I am able provide for my child and that isn’t fair on them.

AIBU to wonder why people in these situations continue having more and more children rather than focusing on the ones that they have, and then constantly complain of being unable to cope?!

Some women also feel the need to "Keep a Man" by giving him a baby (Katie Price?)

Personally, I think this is madness. A guy can up and leave you any time he wants, and they often do. And then you're left juggling multiple children on your own.

When I met my DH, he was 35 and he didn't have children. I was 38 and had two (aged 11 & 9). I made it clear from the outset, that I would not be having any more children - and that the fact that he hadn't had children already, wasn't my problem to fix (said a bit more tactfully than that!) He was absolutely fine with this.

But, I do remember my Dad calling me one day and saying "If you want that man to stick around you need to give him a baby".
It hadn't occurred to my Dad, that me being at home with a screaming new born, covered in sick and poo, whilst my DH was at work with glamorous, single child free women, might be equally as able to make him stray as "not giving him a baby".

Also, how many "make or break" babies are there? Since when did having a screaming baby improve your love life??

@Echobelly

I've thought about this sometimes in terms of that I've noticed that a few people I know or have heard of with at least one very disabled child have lots of kids (4-5), and often most of their kids have some SEN. I did wonder in part if it's because once you have one child who will essentially need care for life, you may not be able to work FT or at all, so you kind of throw yourself into being a parent? Unless you have a lot of family money or very wealthy partner you're probably going to be badly off and crazy busy your whole life, so might as well share it with more kids?

well I get they might feel like that but surely any remaining vestige of common sense would identify the batshitness?

It is concerning that those least able to contribute to society are those increasing population.

I have one DC.

We called it quits trying for another because while I desperately wanted more, my age and given our difficulties we had a greater chance of having a child with a disability of some sort.

And while we would manage, and consider our child an absolute blessing regardless of any medical difficulty, what happens when we are no longer here?

Do I have the right to impact the life of my son with a sibling that requires increasing amounts of care? I don't believe that I do.

Another reason is that I was from a large family. Catholic so you know we were entirely at the mercy of my parent's sex life really. And we lived on benefits so we were poor. We ate well because we had a small farm, but I lived as a child with the impact of being one of many and poor, and I want better for my DC so we were always going to stop at 2 possibly 3 as a maximum had we the choice and if our finances allowed.

[quote LegMeChicken]@Pyri
As a society we are responsible for others, so we are allowed an opinion on what they do.
This is already happening. For example a child benefit cap of 2 kids. That’s an opinion.
Nobody says ‘you shouldn’t have so many children’ but policy is designed with that implied.

I don’t agree with all of it. The hoops people have to jump through, disability payments etc are all clearly not enough and should be increased. But equally people should be made to think about the quality of life they can give their children. Because we will end up picking up the pieces, and we care about it them. Poverty doesn’t mean kids have a bad quality of life. Loving parents etc can make things work. My own grandparents couldn’t read and didn’t even having running water, all their children are doing well. Even in U.K. committed parents work teo joba, opposite hours etc. It’s really not the same[/quote]
except surely part of being loving parents is only having the children that you can afford both in terms of finance AND parenting

@mydogisthebest

Because so many people (especially woman) WANT a child or 2 or 3 or more and that want overrides everything it seems.

If you are struggling to afford 1 child why have more? If your OH is useless and you are unhappy that he doesn't help with 1 child why have more?

As for people who have a child with a disability and then have more knowing they may well have it too that is just pure selfishness.

Let's be honest, having children is selfish. You don't have them for any reason other than you want to. Far too often so little regard for what those children(s) life will be like.

This. In spades. All about rights but not responsibilities.

@coffeeisthebest

Allow them to deal with the consequences of their choices without being a judgemental silent confidant for their complaints. They deserve better than that. Move on with your own life.

But it's not them living with the consequences is it?

I also judge the people (and there are lots on here) who actively encourage people to go ahead with pregnancies they weren't expecting and can't afford because "it's meant to be" and "you'll find the money somehow". It's trite, irresponsible and patently not the case for many families.

1,000 times this ^. Its such an easy fucking thing to say, safe in the knowledge that you're not going to be the one to pick up the pieces. As if love is miraculously going to enable you to afford and cope with another child when you are just about coping with the family you have.

I also have

It is concerning that those least able to contribute to society are those increasing population

Education might be a way to improve that. It's also concerning that those who would probably most benefit from a good Education are the ones least able to fully access it. Schools don't have the funding to really offer support and in some cases schools actively exclude these children with admission rules ( academy's can set their own) and uniform cost/entry cost.

Government seems unwilling to provide funding amd resources to combat this . Then anyone on benefits is treated like they are the cause of all the wrongs in the country

@luckylavender
"None of your business. And if you're fed up of them moaning just stop listening"

As a taxpayer who funds benefits, housing, education and the NHS all of which are overstretched, I think that indirectly it iS my business.

I remember having a full on breakdown when I found out I was being considered for redundancy a few days after I found I was pregnant with DS2. And this was with DH having a good paying job. I was worried about not being able to pay bills, I wouldn’t be able to afford new baby things and that I would miss out on maternity pay. Fortunately I managed to hang on to my job long enough to acquire maternity pay but the stress of it all made me sick and I really did question whether I should be having this baby.

I also fell pregnant during lockdown. I would have loved to have had a third but we were both unemployed, in the middle of a pandemic and had two 2 children under 3. It just wouldn’t work out at it wouldn’t have been fair to any of us.

I don’t understand how people in much worse situations can be so blasé about such life changing situations. I envy them at times because I do think I overthink things but I can safely say my overthinking has protected me from making bad life decisions.

I agree Op.

We only had one child because we knew that having a second would be a strain physically, emotionally and financially. I find parenting harder than I expected so I want to do my best for the son I have.

But people do not stop asking if and when we're having a second. The people who push hardest on this are those with two who never seem to stop complaining about how hard it is to have two kids. I do wonder if maybe they just didn't really think about whether they really wanted or were able to cope happily with a second.

its probably to do with the fact that most heterosexual women in a sexual relationship with a man get pregnant sometimes, and people can be funny about getting abortions.

Id be really surprised if people who really didnt cope with their family would go out of their way to plan more children, but more likely they just continue with unplanned pregnancies

@658Doyouknowwheremysparkis

They are the same people who buy a dog (s) and raise poorly behaved animals, usually due to gross ineptitude and arrogance.

Once taught a family where they would have almost one child a year, the family were living in a shed and a bus and each child had a health condition which required ongoing in/ out of school support and an elective surgery costing $20,000 per child, plus health condition was lifelong. Am left wing but that situation appalled me … 8 children later … could be even more now…. they lived in appalling conditions and did nothing to help themselves or the kids. The mother just loved babies, children not so much!

''Baby addiction''

Some women just love being pregnant, the attention , made to feel 'Special', fussed over, love babies, but lose interest once the baby becomes a child {According to the children }

Two friends are from ''Big'' families ...One of them had more than ten siblings...Friend ''Hated'' it.

Factor in genetic issues, and it becomes like a lottery.

@mam0918 - I have no experience of your life, and I completely understand that you have value, and so does your child.

It is unreasonable, however, to say “all disabled children” in your way too.

My son is only 12, but has already said he wished he hadn’t been born with his condition, and has already expressed the idea of not wanting to continue.

Just as it is abhorrent for anyone to say those with disabilities have no value, it is almost as difficult to accept the idea that anyone would choose to have a child knowing that they are going to suffer. Because however much you disdain the concept of disability causing suffering, it absolutely does. Not for you, but for some.

Same 12 yr old told me with great interest that he had just read an article about genetics, and being able to delete his tricky genes at some point in the future. I was surprised that he was so calm about it, that he didn’t feel dismissed, or undervalued as a result. I don’t think I will ever forget where we were, how he looked, or what he said.

We were at traffic lights, he turned and looked directly into my eyes, and said “If these experiments mean that no one has to feel like me ever again, they should do it in a heart beat”.

I cannot imagine not having him. Even if someone had told me beforehand, I would’ve probably thought “we’re up to this!, we’re good people! It’s not life threatening”. Thank god I didn’t know in advance and make that decision, because now I would feel I had already failed my child by allowing them to experience this.

@Branleuse

its probably to do with the fact that most heterosexual women in a sexual relationship with a man get pregnant sometimes, and people can be funny about getting abortions.

Id be really surprised if people who really didnt cope with their family would go out of their way to plan more children, but more likely they just continue with unplanned pregnancies

Morning after pill if contraception fails {Or none used} is definitely an option.

Have to say I agree with you OP, even if it is judgemental. At the end of the day all parents have a responsibility to their children, if they do something detrimental to them for their own wants then that is selfish.

Some women also feel the need to "Keep a Man" by giving him a baby (Katie Price?)

Or think it isn’t a “proper” relationship until they have a baby together irrespective of how many children they already have.

I certainly agree on the pets.
Seems like every time we get an, “oh the mental load is so tough” from someone (usually with non weight pulling useless man on the sideline) there’s pets in the mix.

Yes you’re being judgemental but you are also right. I would feel the same way and don’t believe people who claim to never judge anyone for anything.

If those people are not coping and complaining and go on the have more children I would definitely judge. I also judge people on here who complain their DH is a shit partner but are heavily pregnant with #2 or #3.

I agree with all this. I sometimes think we need more judgement in life. As a few pps have already said, dickhead men who walk out on families, refuse to support their kids and then start new families with other women deserve judgement to rain down on them.

. I guess some people are less responsible than others and that’s the long and short of it. I have friends who have a wonderful son with complex disabilities and I know they would have loved more children, and it’s not a disability that’s likely to recur, but they decided his needs meant they had to focus on him and the life they could offer any siblings wouldn’t be fair on any of the children.

Also I guess some people have more resources or resilience and are able to cope with things others of us couldn’t.

I get contraception failures too. It happens but they’re not all contraception failures. Sometimes it’s obviously the triumph of optimism over reality.

I agree about unplanned pregnancies. The larger families in my wider family all have unplanned pregnancies explaining number 4 and or 5. All user error though.

Morning after pill if contraception fails {Or none used} is definitely an option

Ha is it?

I mean I've taken it twice. First time I was given the run around by hospital ( not a&e don't worry) and sent on some lengthy bizarre walk down a gazillion dark allies to get to a closed clinic ( thankfully a staff member who hadn't left let me in)

And the second I was treated to exasperated staff who instead of just explaining this night was for under 18s ( I had no idea I'd just gone and I could surely have been told at the desk.discretely amd given an alternative option) decided on be loud and rude to humiliate me on purpose.

I can honestly say if I was weaker mentally id have just walked out. People I these clinics aren't supoosed to be judgemental given what they must deal with.

Amd that's befire we get to the fact that pharamaciats amd drs can refuse to sell/prescribe it.

When do men get turned down for viagra
or condoms incase it's not their wife they are shagging.

Maybe it's not as easy an.optiom as people believe

Most people are short-sighted dimwits.

Oh the irony. I just stumbled across a Facebook post announcing the announcing a 3rd pregnancy. Language is cringe, makes super clear mum has been desperate for a boy -they already have 2 girls. It’s their 3rd child in 4 or 5 years, neither of them work and yep they have a 2 bed place so will probably start over crowding moans soon. It’s like a full house of bingo!