Unsafe to go to Kenya, Uganda and Rwanda as a queer woman?

[idiotwhoworries]

I have a new job in the third sector. Very much in the future, there are opportunities for work (not permanently, but for short term projects) in several countries in Africa.

I'm married to a woman and feel so stupid because I can't safely go and work there at all, can I? Perhaps Rwanda but not the others?

I have obviously known for a long, long time why this would be problematic in theory, but it's never been relevant personally before and only now I actually have this job and the potential opportunity on the horizon am I thinking of the reality.

If any immigration officials either looked at my phone or questioned me ("are you married?" "what is your spouse's name?") they would know quick enough I am in a same sex marriage and while I imagine they can turn a blind eye and ignore - that seems like a big gamble?

Hi op,
I understand as well as I can without being in the same situation that it must be a sad to have concerns about balancing opportunities versus personal safety. I have no advice but wanted to wish you well and hope that you manage to find opportunities and acceptance wherever you travel. Good luck.

I hope your project went as well as possible

As possible? What does that mean?

When I think of the projects I am involved with it's frustrating that due to an overall lack of resources, the medical outcomes in these rural settings are as successful as possible in the circumstances - but still not in line with outcomes in high-income countries.

The cause I work for is honestly amazing and does extremely important work that means that many children (who make up a large amount of the numbers) live longer and actually reach adulthood.

But in an ideal world, I wish every kid could get the gold standard treatment.

So when I say "as well as possible" I suppose what I mean is acknowledging the work happening in places in the world, where there is a lack of resources or other obstacles, is life changing for people and very much a success and positive - but there is still so much further work to do, to keep striving for ie medical outcomes for the kids in my field to be on a par with here.

Not all sectors will be the same. I am viewing things through my own lens, and thinking that that same lack of resources and limitations will be a problem in other areas, however.

I'm extremely invested in my field

And you don't get to tell us what words we find offensive

You’re free to find it offensive, but that’s for you to deal with, it’s not OP’s problem. It’s been an accepted descriptor for many years and it’s the term she’s comfortable using.

Take a look at the Reddit boards for those countries, OP, for the perspectives of those living there. Also, you may find this site useful:
www.equaldex.com/

For the countries I have to visit for work only one of them recognises same-sex marriages between the locals there. However all of them recognise same-sex marriage between foreigners that happen outside the country without any issues. They see it as a "well they are foreign - they don't think the same as us" type of thing.

Do a bit more research first. Make sure you look at embassy support available.

Both my and my husbands employer have a policy where staff are not sent to countries where being queer is illegal or legal yet commonly persecuted, they also avoid flight connections in certain countries. Certain countries are completely off the list for anyone, such as Saudi.

I just googled meaning of queer and the first result was the Oxford dictionary definiiton:

My gut feeling is this is disingenuous.

You weren't "confused" by my chosen word of queer. You just don't like it, for whatever reason.

You knew exactly what I meant by my saying I am a queer woman. You felt the urge to go after the language I use, which is the language I am comfortable with.

Yes, I'm in a lesbian mariage. I am comfortable saying that. My wife is a lesbian or queer, she's comfortable with both.

However, I am queer. I'm not a lesbian.

Anyway, it really is inconsequential if you dislike me calling myself queer - but don't pretend you are "confused" by the word queer in the context I used it in. That's a little daft.

I don’t know about Uganda and Rwanda, but my very good mate and her girlfriend travelled to Kenya and didn’t encounter any problems. They weren’t very open my about it but people figured it out.

I’m sorry this has turned in to a bun fight. Certain people on here love policing others identities.

I grew up in the times of “queer bashing” and I am definitely not normally woke but I completely understood the OP referring to herself as queer. She is fully entitled to use any descriptor about herself that she wants. I wouldn’t call a homosexual queer unless that was the descriptor they had claimed as I would not want to offend but in this case the OP has chosen queer so it would be rude not to use her chosen term.

OP I’d consider this a little like working in strict Arab countries with dubious womens rights. I think personally that I would find it very stressful to work in a place where I worried about getting into trouble just from being myself. I think it’s easy to say “it’ll be fine, particularly as you are a woman and not a gay man” but you only need to find a pocket of homophobia (and this thread shows how easy that is) and you could end up in a lot of trouble…. Particularly when the homophobia is backed by the law. I think I would not take the risk but I am a pretty risk averse person generally.

The problem is that the word ‘queer’ is used for heterosexual relationships if they’ve got a few kinks between them. So it can be confusing when it is used in regards to same sex attraction. It has been co-opted by straight people so that they can be included in the rainbow.

I was a teenager in the 90’s, and there’s no way I would use that word to describe someone any more than I would use f**t to describe a gay man, it just has too many negative connotations in my mind.

And no, I know I don’t have the right to dictate what other people call themselves, but I do think that some people find it jarring to hear the word and might want some clarification. And yes, it’s up to you if you want to give them that clarification.

This doesn’t make me a homophobe or a bi-sexualphobe (is that even a word), it makes me a person who remembers the word ‘queer’ being used in vitriolic rants to gay and lesbian people.

I think (and it’s only my personal opinion) it’s sad that the word lesbian is being used less and less often, sometimes it feels like it’s a word to be ashamed of. My daughter is a lesbian and I do feel like sometimes they are forgotten in the LGB community, even though their letter comes first!

So your gf is a lesbian and you are not? Seriously living in 2022 confuses the shit out of me.

Haven’t you ever heard of bisexuals? Seriously some people on this thread are either thick as shit or just acting like it. That confuses me.

@GregBrawlsInDogJail

To many of us, ‘queer bashing’ in the 80s and 90s is still very real.

It's thirty years since 1990. LGBT people reclaiming "queer" is very, very old news, and I really don't think you get to tell people they're describing themselves wrong.

I really don’t think you get to tell people how they feel about certain trigger words.

@Marvellousmadness

So your gf is a lesbian and you are not? Seriously living in 2022 confuses the shit out of me.

Do you not know what a bisexual is? Are you even a lesbian yourself or are you just another straight women policing LGBTQ people's identities for the fun of it?

@risefromyourgrave

The problem is that the word ‘queer’ is used for heterosexual relationships if they’ve got a few kinks between them. So it can be confusing when it is used in regards to same sex attraction. It has been co-opted by straight people so that they can be included in the rainbow.

I was a teenager in the 90’s, and there’s no way I would use that word to describe someone any more than I would use f**t to describe a gay man, it just has too many negative connotations in my mind.

And no, I know I don’t have the right to dictate what other people call themselves, but I do think that some people find it jarring to hear the word and might want some clarification. And yes, it’s up to you if you want to give them that clarification.

This doesn’t make me a homophobe or a bi-sexualphobe (is that even a word), it makes me a person who remembers the word ‘queer’ being used in vitriolic rants to gay and lesbian people.

I think (and it’s only my personal opinion) it’s sad that the word lesbian is being used less and less often, sometimes it feels like it’s a word to be ashamed of. My daughter is a lesbian and I do feel like sometimes they are forgotten in the LGB community, even though their letter comes first!

Whilst I agree with the 'lesbians can be forgotten' sentiment (as a lesbian, have definitely noticed this), that's not really the point.

OP might also be into men. Therefore why would she use lesbian? Lesbian means someone is attracted to females only. If that doesn't fit OP, then I as a lesbian wouldn't want her to use it.

This is really difficult op and I’m sorry it’s another thing you have to think about as a queer woman. Travel can be difficult enough so this sucks.

Can you talk to work about what it’s like over there?

And as someone who loves travel, yes it’s completely shit to not be able to go there even if you don’t ‘have’ to for work.

Are people really turning this into a thread to question the op’s sexuality? get a grip.

@risefromyourgrave

The problem is that the word ‘queer’ is used for heterosexual relationships if they’ve got a few kinks between them. So it can be confusing when it is used in regards to same sex attraction. It has been co-opted by straight people so that they can be included in the rainbow.

I was a teenager in the 90’s, and there’s no way I would use that word to describe someone any more than I would use f**t to describe a gay man, it just has too many negative connotations in my mind.

And no, I know I don’t have the right to dictate what other people call themselves, but I do think that some people find it jarring to hear the word and might want some clarification. And yes, it’s up to you if you want to give them that clarification.

This doesn’t make me a homophobe or a bi-sexualphobe (is that even a word), it makes me a person who remembers the word ‘queer’ being used in vitriolic rants to gay and lesbian people.

I think (and it’s only my personal opinion) it’s sad that the word lesbian is being used less and less often, sometimes it feels like it’s a word to be ashamed of. My daughter is a lesbian and I do feel like sometimes they are forgotten in the LGB community, even though their letter comes first!

I know plenty of lesbians. I really, really don’t think you should policing somebody on their identity.

Countries vary but in my friend's experience they don't ask too many questions of westerners travelling alone for work, it's if you wanted to go as a couple there would be issues. He works in a country that has the death penalty for being gay but his partner lives in London (their choice for my friend to work out there, money!) Colleagues ask about his wife and he just says he doesn't have one (true, he has a husband to be, he doesn't actually lie)

Shame this has got de railed by the queer policing here.
I also used that word to describe me, and see it everywhere in the community from going to a pub quiz called the queer quiz, to queerkulele (a ukulele band) and everything in between!

As shock horror a non lesbian in a relationship with a lesbian, I've spent fair amounts of time in uganda.

Previous posters have it right that male homophobia is much more prevalent than women. We are only 6 years past the death penalty being agreed for male couples, although that's now been repealed but there was a surprising amount of support for it. There were also fairly public outings in newspapers, lots of the legal prosecutions are aimed towards locals and men.

It's not simply a country where gay marriage isn't legally protected as others have said, its a country that has repeatedly raided gay bars, and has repeatedly tried to push through death penalties, or long criminal sentences for acts of homosexuality (usually men)

That being said....

I had zero problems as a queer woman at that time. Its not a country I would take my wife, or really return to now I'm married. There was distinct lack of curiosity about female sexuality, so you'd often find people who we would assume are gay, or lesbian if we saw them in the uk being assumed as straight in uganda.

I didn't disclose my sexuality at all, and made sure I completely deleted everything. I've no doubt that if they had found my Facebook and realised there was evidence of my partner that my working relationships would have soured and it would have spread quickly. Some people in the community are clearly allies but I had to bite my tongue alot as its fairly common for people to openly share their beliefs about homosexuality and hell.

As is normal in most countries, people did seek to add me on Facebook etc (even in rural areas)

It's been interesting since I've been back home, subsequently married my wife to see how that impacted the friends I made. Some will happily comment on Facebook photos, others sent pleas for salvation and others completely disappeared

I worked in a health care setting and it was difficult for me to hear the judgement placed on patients who were identified as queer.

Ultimately I would be more concerned now that when I went I would be legally recorded as being in a same sex relationship which is more discoverable. However it was fairly easy to be incognito.

For me it would depend on the length of the assignment. There's only so long I'd be willing to pretend to be single, not display any pictures of my wife, and hide my online presence for.

On a side note, if you say you are married and are there for a long time, then its natural that people would ask for details of your husband and photos.

@Joystir59 the OP has specifically said that she's NOT a lesbian, and refers to herself as queer. Maybe you should read the thread.

@Joystir59

Shes clearly said she isn't. I'm not sure what your angle is?

@Joystir59
Queer is how the OP refers to herself. In the title and here
*21:56idiotwhoworries

Interested in why you describe yourself as "queer" rather than a lesbian?

Because it's the one that I feel fits me best and am most comfortable with. I am not a lesbian.*