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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To wonder if she’s making this up?

185 replies

Strawberriesonasummerevenin · 30/03/2022 22:46

We live abroad, we hired a private tutor a few weeks ago to do some fun language teaching/babysitting with Dd, almost 4, in preparation for her new school in our new country.
She was very keen after the first visit, whatsapped extra phrases to learn and even offered to accept less pay per hour. She already charged a reasonable rate, seemed very good and was sweet with Dd, who really liked her.
She came back the next week, similar thing, very loving with Dd, they had lots of fun, she gave homework for the next week.
Sadly that weekend I got kidney stones and was quite ill, still not great by the time her day to come came and couldn’t do much more than lazy tv with Dd.
I contacted her explaining and apologising and that we’d see her next week.
She was due to come yesterday, we were all prepared, Dd very excited and she texted one hour before saying she’d been ill and was worse so couldn’t make it. I wished her to get well soon and said we were looking forward to seeing her next week, Dd was a bit sad.
Earlier tonight, she’s WhatsApped saying her school have asked her to start teaching 9-6 pm now, starting this Friday 🤷🏻‍♀️
She asked if she was able to do a Saturday if possible…this seems like an excuse to me and she possibly doesn’t want to continue the job…such a change when she was so enthusiastic, aibu to think it’s an excuse and to wonder what changed? Am I missing something?
Dd will be disappointed, was very excited about her lessons and it was her first proper introduction to a teacher.
Saturdays are more difficult for us due to kids parties/family times.
I had mentioned to her at the start, if Tuesdays went well, we might try to add some Saturdays in the future if she was available, Dh and I would go out, she was very keen and said she’d be able to do Saturdays too. I was hoping to continue with the Tuesdays for now

OP posts:
Zonder · 31/03/2022 17:44

@AmyDudley

I wouldn't worry - at 4 your DD will pick up the language very quickly once she starts school and will be fluent in no time.
Nooooo! Urban myth!
AmyDudley · 31/03/2022 18:17

Nooooo! Urban myth!

Nooooooooo - based on experience - I've known quite a few children (five in my own family) who all picked up a second language very very quickly when they moved to a different country, - the younger the child the quicker they pick it up. There has been some debate over the critical period theory (although it is based on brain development) but language is also picked up by quality and quantity of exposure - the OP's child will be going to school she will be surrounded by the language and she will be absorbing it.
My sister's children ranged from 3 - 14 yrs when she moved to another country, they all picked up the language very quickly when they started going to school even the 14 yr old - although the youngest child was the fastest. They moved back to UK after 5 yrs, all are adult now and all are still fluent in their second language.
My other sister has taught in areas where there is a large population of children from Latvia and Lithuania - they didn't have any problems in her school with these children not picking up the language, because they were surrounded by it, and children make a lot of effort to communicate with each other and want to talk together so they just get on with it, they aren't inhibited and don't shy away from playing because of a language barrier.

Original poster
Strawberriesonasummerevenin · 31/03/2022 18:44

@AmyDudley 100%

OP posts:
Zonder · 31/03/2022 19:21

Well there's picking it up and there's actually being able to speak it fluently. I speak 3 languages, have taught in international schools in 3 countries and have years of experience with EAL children in the UK. It takes 7 years to achieve full fluency in language oral and written. But only a few days to be able to say "toilet please".

Zonder · 31/03/2022 19:22

And @Strawberriesonasummerevenin I was actually defending you and your choice of getting a language tutor in for your child. By doing this you are showing that you know you can't just throw a child into a new language situation and they will be fluent really quickly.

Zonder · 31/03/2022 19:27

My other sister has taught in areas where there is a large population of children from Latvia and Lithuania - they didn't have any problems in her school with these children not picking up the language, because they were surrounded by it, and children make a lot of effort to communicate with each other and want to talk together so they just get on with it, they aren't inhibited and don't shy away from playing because of a language barrier.

If this were the case schools / councils wouldn't need to invest in EAL support!

AmyDudley · 31/03/2022 20:55

If this were the case schools / councils wouldn't need to invest in EAL support!

Oh well I'll let my sister - a teacher with 40 years experience teaching children in areas with large immigrant populations - that a random on MN thinks she's lying.

And I'll let my nieces and nephews know they aren't fluent and can only say 'toilet please' - I'm sure they'll wonder how they've been speaking a foreign language all this time despite not knowing a word of it.

Zonder · 31/03/2022 23:09

I'm not saying she's lying. I'm saying someone somewhere along the way is confusing being able to use a bit of English with actually being able to speak it proficiently. I'm sure she would be able to tell you that it takes years for a child to learn to write fluently in English and that's a guide to their actual language level.

And of course I'm not saying your nieces and nephews can only say toilet please. But I am saying it will have taken them a lot longer than people like to think to actually get a decent level in the language.

Geamhradh · 01/04/2022 06:08

And some people need to look up acquisition v learning, which use two different parts of the brain.

The OP's child would actually become far more fluent if she ONLY had a babysitter who spoke to her in L2 rather than a tutor/babysitter who does a bit of both.

That said, purely as L2 learners, I've yet to meet a student who started at 4 and a student who started at 11 (for example) who don't have exactly the same competencies by the time they get to 16 (all other parameters being equal) Language schools will put on courses for 3 year olds- sure, and that will help with what's known as the Affective Dimension, but real competency? Nah.

TL:DR - @Amydudley is right. And no linguist or teacher would disagree with her.

Zonder · 01/04/2022 07:48

@Geamhradh I'm both a linguist and a teacher. I don't disagree with the method but I do disagree with the suggested time scale and the idea that this all happens really quickly.

VeganCow · 01/04/2022 08:11

The big question is did you still pay her for the missed session?

ravenmum · 01/04/2022 11:54

You'll see big differences in how long it takes for a child to learn a second language depending on their background and age. An older child that comes from a country with poor schools and can only just read and write in her native language, whose parents are not well off and don't have a high degree of literacy themselves, or much contact with the majority language community, will be in a totally different position to a younger child with a great vocab in her native tongue, from a country with great schools, rich parents that can take her to activities ...
Social workers who only have experience with difficult cases often have the impression that the process is hard for all children, but that's not the case at all.

ravenmum · 01/04/2022 12:02

(And obviously there's also a huge difference between children learning a language in a school in a different country, then going home and speaking and hearing their native language - and those learning it in the country, surrounded by the language.)

Marvellousmadness · 01/04/2022 12:06

Yabu she got a fulltime job and offered to do the lessons on Saturday

And also ask yourself: what is more beneficial for my kid right now:ballet or language lessons???HmmConfused

Sally872 · 01/04/2022 12:13

That's great news, glad she has replied and Saturday's will work.

Woobeedoo · 01/04/2022 15:35

I think so many text problems (he said, she said, what does it mean?) could be solved by phoning the person and not texting. With text, the correct tone doesn’t come across - if you are having a bad day and are a bit angry you will naturally read a text in an angry tone, putting the emphasis on words to suit. It’s a bit ‘lost in translation’ so to speak.

TheGrinchsDog · 01/04/2022 18:03

@Strawberriesonasummerevenin You keep saying you 'would have paid her for the missed lesson' - as in the one you cancelled - have you still not paid her for it?

You also say she has offered Saturdays and now you are asking her to confirm if you can swing it, can she do Saturdays?

You seem to be making this a lot harder than it needs to be I'm afraid.

Again, chill out! Pick a Saturday, book a slot and job's a good 'un no?

Although do pay the girl if you haven't already, being owed money won't help any bad feeling there may be. It really doesn't sound like there is though, you are way overthinking this! Am surprised this is still an issue tbh.

NdefH81 · 01/04/2022 18:05

@Sally872

That's great news, glad she has replied and Saturday's will work.
You seriously regard this as “great news”?!
BoredZelda · 01/04/2022 18:50

If she didn’t want to do it, why would she offer a different day?

Julie21255 · 01/04/2022 19:05

To be honest she has tried to accommodate you and you're putting every reason, excuse over thought barrier in her way. I'd have second thought about working for you. Intense or what!!!!!!!!

Jeannie88 · 01/04/2022 19:31

Unless you have reason to think otherwise, just sounds like she's a hard worker and offered to work weekends to help make amends? Her primary job must come first and she has offered a different day?

Tigger1895 · 01/04/2022 19:56

Did you offer to pay her for the day you cancelled?

TheGrinchsDog · 01/04/2022 20:05

I'm bored so I went back and re-read the thread and the OP's replies and I'm really baffled lol!

You think this poor girl, who you have jerked around by cancelling and then being wishy washy on the Saturdays that you originally mentioned no less, is not keen/lying etc?

She keeps coming back to communicate with you, sure she's not replying as instantly as you'd appear to like but she's got a life and she is replying.

Shas tried to be accommodating even with her change of circumstances, offered you a reasonable alternative and she might not even have been paid yet for the session you cancelled!

And you think she's got/is the problem? It's just really weird @Strawberriesonasummerevenin for you to have reacted like this I think.

Can you tell us if you have paid her or not? I really hope so because it's not on for you to have not paid her yet. These days it takes seconds online after all. She shouldn't have to wait till her next session, whenever that turns out to be since you can't seem to make up your mind about what you want.

As a teacher and ex-tutor yourself it seems really strange for you to have taken the stance you have about this, and for your DH to have confirmed it. The majority here just think she's telling the truth and being really very helpful in the circumstances.

She actually sounds really quite a find in terms of a tutor/babysitter since she is so keen and gets on so well with your DD. Why aren't you trying harder to be as give and take as she is?

If it were me I would have not worried about the state of the house or if DD was still in PJ's on the day you were very sick, you say you aren't in the room anyway so you being in bed/in the toilet being sick wasn't a change from the norm. Your DD would probably have enjoyed a PJ day, and tutor/babysitter (long ass title!) would not have minded at all, I'm sure.

Also don't think you understand the nature of casual work as most people understand it but that's not really the point here. And this turned out far longer than I meant! Grin

Hmm1234 · 01/04/2022 20:06

You came across unreliable and she’s picked up a stable job. What do you expect

TheGrinchsDog · 01/04/2022 20:09

Sorry! You being sick in bed wasn't a change from the norm in terms of you not being in the room with DD during sessions. Just re-read and looks like I'm saying you being ill is the norm Blush I'm sure you understood what I was going for.

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