To be gobsmacked at friend

[searchingforsomethiing]

I am part of a group of friends (there are 6 of us) we are all 40 and have known each other since school.

My closest friend in the group I’ve known since primary school. She’s struggled with money in the past due to various things and I’ve always helped her out. I’m in a reasonably high paid job and I’ve given her money and been explicit that a) I didn’t want it back and b) it was between us and not to say it our friends which she was always in agreement with.

Over the past couple of years I’ve given her probably in the region of £400 and done a lot of shopping for her as well get her kids good birthday and Christmas presents. Again there’s no expectation of this in return and I’m glad to help where I can. She’s on a more even keel these days so I haven’t helped in a little while.

Cut to Saturday night, and we were out for dinner with all the other girls. My friend had a bit to drink and announced to the table loudly and that I’d been giving her money because I thought she was a “charity case” and she knew I’d been telling them all privately what I’d been doing. She was really vitriolic about it. I was absolutely mortified and so were the others.

It was incredibly awkward and I excused myself from the table and when I returned it was exceptionally difficult to keep any conversation going because she was obviously unhappy.

I left the meal not long after. I’d given her a lift to the restaurant and she expected one home but I left without giving her the chance to join.

I don’t even know how I feel tbh. I don’t know what came over her and I feel like the friendship is over.

I find it really odd that people on MN don't know how to talk to their friends of over 20 years ... or their best friends. And that everyone seems to be on such a hair trigger and willing to be wound up by strangers on the internet. These threads always make me glad for my own RL friendships.

OP, I have a long-term friend who has behaved like this in the past with me. I've helped her more times than I can remember. She's attacked me in public too, never been grateful and had various outbursts about how easy my life is (could not be further from the truth).

I feel quite inspired by this thread and your response to your friend. Length of servitude does now justify using you as a punchbag.

@SecretRedhead

The number of people berating you for how you've handled it is astonishing. Especially because if you'd been any less firm in your response, they'd be calling you a doormat.

A woman's place is in the wrong.

I think your tests were spot on, OP. She can fuck right off.

texts

I find it really odd that people on MN don't know how to talk to their friends of over 20 years ... or their best friends. And that everyone seems to be on such a hair trigger and willing to be wound up by strangers on the internet. These threads always make me glad for my own RL friendships.

It's hardly a hair trigger @AnnesBrokenSlate . It sounds like a protracted, embarrassing and upsetting incident. Who does that to a friend of 30 years?

Proud of you OP

1. Kind when a friend was in need.
2. Discrete about helping, even when called out in a bonkers way. (Although keeping it a secret from your DH is a bit ott in my opinion)
3. Did not allow yourself to be a doormat. Sent a clear, firm message.
4. Did not accept the mealy mouthed excuse and non apology.

Your true friends are lucky to have you.

I agree with @RandomBasic.

Well done 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

@AnnesBrokenSlate

I find it really odd that people on MN don't know how to talk to their friends of over 20 years ... or their best friends. And that everyone seems to be on such a hair trigger and willing to be wound up by strangers on the internet. These threads always make me glad for my own RL friendships.

Me too to be honest. I’m often surprised when I read threads where the responses are to go in hard and brutal and ltb as the immediate go to position. “Fuck her right off op!” These women have been friends since child hood. The other woman did a bad thing, and no way should the op just accept it, no one is saying that, but the way people are egging her on and hurling abuse at posters advising any form of temperance or considered response is quite shocking.

@oliviastwisted

The question becomes then if on balance the OPs long-standing friendship can overcome this bump in the road.

If the friendship can only survive by overcoming the friend’s behaviour, but not OP’s assertive response, it’s not a true friendship.

Quite honestly I think you are better off without her! She sounds very ungrateful and rude. WTF! You sound very kind and thoughtful to me .I honestly think money and friendships dont mix very well . I would cut all ties .

Personally I prefer a back away quietly approach from people who are CF. However, this CF has shown herself to be so in a public setting. You did well to keep calm and excuse yourself to prevent an argument.

You've said your feelings without pulling in friends and she hasn't apologised, the friendship was therefore already over but only she knew it. It may have happened in her head when you were busy or it may have been earlier, but it suited her to pretend otherwise and to ask you for money.

She didn't even speak to her about it. The first thing I would have said is "what on earth has brought that on?" Not just leave her there/not give a lift home. I am far from being a doormat, but cannot understand why the OP didn't take the opportunity to actually have a conversation about it. Fine to say that she was extremely hurt by what was said etc.

Instead she left her at the restaurant and then sent a pass agg text asking for her cash back - with an exact amount which indicates (to me at least) that a tab was kept.

When the reply was "well you've been distant" - the friend could have been feeling guilty, thinking the OP didn't want to spend time with her any more because of the cash / the disparity in income. OP has pointed out how well off she is. One of the others might have said something. The OP could have said something that triggered this, without realising. But no-one seems at all interested in WHY it happened. Which is bizarre for a friend since Primary school.

You haven’t been too harsh at all @searchingforsomethiing

I think your response has been very classy considering her behaviour!!!

@5128gap

The moral high ground was lost when the OP used the money as a weapon to get her own back. The OP claimed not to want anything in return or to be repaid, yet when the friend stepped out of line, the OP uses it to attack her. The friend behaved badly, no doubt, but if the OPs generosity was as unconditional as she claims, then she would have restricted her comments to her friends behaviour, rather than issuing a reminder of the power imbalance. I would imagine there is no going back from this, which is sad given the length of the friendship, but perhaps better for both. As well meaning as it may be, this sort of dynamic in a friendship is very unhealthy.

Yep.

I believed OP in her first post when she said money wasn’t an issue to her. But subsequent posts make clear that money is a very big issue to her in a way that’s not very attractive.

You can either be graceful in a situation like this, or you can go down to someone’s level and hurl a verbal punch like OP or a physical punch like Will Smith. You can’t say they’re not justified but a more dignified response would have played out better.

I really don't understand the 'moral high ground' argument. That implies that there's a set of impartial onlookers, awarding brownie points for good behaviour.

To me it comes down to: in a year's time, what memory of the event will you be able to live with?

Will you look back and cringe yourself inside out for sending a text and wished you'd stayed silent and gone the freeze her out route?

Or would staying silent and 'taking the moral high ground' mean that you would still seethe with resentment whenever you thought about it years down the line? If so, then you should absolutely say something and stick up for yourself. Send the text.

You're the one who has to live with it. Who cares what people looking on might think?

OP is allowed to have emotions and say the truth too. If someone says you have been talking behind their back etc. you may throw things out at them. OP excused herself so didn't say it across the table, many may have said the truth straight back, "no I have not and don't think you're a charity, but as you're unfairly accusing me pay it back".

Why, when attacked, should she just take it?

But subsequent posts make clear that money is a very big issue to her in a way that’s not very attractive.

I'm not getting that impression at all. The OP has had her kindness thrown back in her face. I'm team OP all the way here.

@searchingforsomethiing

I am part of a group of friends (there are 6 of us) we are all 40 and have known each other since school.

My closest friend in the group I’ve known since primary school. She’s struggled with money in the past due to various things and I’ve always helped her out. I’m in a reasonably high paid job and I’ve given her money and been explicit that a) I didn’t want it back and b) it was between us and not to say it our friends which she was always in agreement with.

Over the past couple of years I’ve given her probably in the region of £400 and done a lot of shopping for her as well get her kids good birthday and Christmas presents. Again there’s no expectation of this in return and I’m glad to help where I can. She’s on a more even keel these days so I haven’t helped in a little while.

Cut to Saturday night, and we were out for dinner with all the other girls. My friend had a bit to drink and announced to the table loudly and that I’d been giving her money because I thought she was a “charity case” and she knew I’d been telling them all privately what I’d been doing. She was really vitriolic about it. I was absolutely mortified and so were the others.

It was incredibly awkward and I excused myself from the table and when I returned it was exceptionally difficult to keep any conversation going because she was obviously unhappy.

I left the meal not long after. I’d given her a lift to the restaurant and she expected one home but I left without giving her the chance to join.

I don’t even know how I feel tbh. I don’t know what came over her and I feel like the friendship is over.

You sound like a good friend. To not even tell your partner you've lent her money. I think she's just embarrassed and outed herself. It's something she needs to get over not you. You shouldn't be upset that she's announced to everyone you've helped her. That's a great friend

@TheBeautifulMoors

Ooh your response mentioning not asking for help is harsh. I think Ok to ask for an apology but the last bit makes it sound like you’re throwing the help you gave her in her face.

How? Don't you think the friend's conduct was harsh? OP knows if she gives any help her so-called friend is still liable to vilify her for it in public. If's the friend who threw the help OP gave her into OP's face.

The moral high ground is more often than not a silencing tactic and it often results in stonewalling of issues. Saying absolutely anything to the other person involved in the issue so long as it is not abusive, starting any conversation and expressing yourself is a million times better than stonewalling an issue which is usually what the moral high ground looks like in practice.

@babywalker56

This is allll so dramatic to me.

I would have just said ‘oh shut up you idiot what you talking about’ at the table and just left it at that. Maybe mentioned it to her again at a different time to say how you felt but all this messaging about calling her a dick, don’t ask for money again etc. Sounds so dramatic, was that all even necessary?

Obviously I wasn’t there so maybe the situation was worse than it sounds but it really doesn’t sound like the end of the world to me

Let's face it, the friend wouldn't have left it at that, would she? She would just have taken anything OP said as encouragement, and probably raised her voice even louder.

I could get over it as a one off if she was insecure and drunk if she actually apologised!!!! The behaviour at dinner is poor, but for me the lack of apology when sober and realising she has been offensive is much worse.

By OP's own admission the friend was drunk and emotional. OP is neither of those things.
I don't understand how people can be friends for 20+ years and not have an open, honest conversation. Filtering communication through the internet and text messages isn't a sign of a long friendship. It's very dysfunctional.