To be gobsmacked at friend

[searchingforsomethiing]

I am part of a group of friends (there are 6 of us) we are all 40 and have known each other since school.

My closest friend in the group I’ve known since primary school. She’s struggled with money in the past due to various things and I’ve always helped her out. I’m in a reasonably high paid job and I’ve given her money and been explicit that a) I didn’t want it back and b) it was between us and not to say it our friends which she was always in agreement with.

Over the past couple of years I’ve given her probably in the region of £400 and done a lot of shopping for her as well get her kids good birthday and Christmas presents. Again there’s no expectation of this in return and I’m glad to help where I can. She’s on a more even keel these days so I haven’t helped in a little while.

Cut to Saturday night, and we were out for dinner with all the other girls. My friend had a bit to drink and announced to the table loudly and that I’d been giving her money because I thought she was a “charity case” and she knew I’d been telling them all privately what I’d been doing. She was really vitriolic about it. I was absolutely mortified and so were the others.

It was incredibly awkward and I excused myself from the table and when I returned it was exceptionally difficult to keep any conversation going because she was obviously unhappy.

I left the meal not long after. I’d given her a lift to the restaurant and she expected one home but I left without giving her the chance to join.

I don’t even know how I feel tbh. I don’t know what came over her and I feel like the friendship is over.

@searchingforsomethiing

I’d be interested to hear how people would react to being verbally attacked publicly for something you never did I.e gossip and tell lies.

It’s a real slur on your character, let me tell you.

A number of possibilities, ranging from:

• expressing genuine concern for her (if this behaviour is totally out-of-character) whilst at the same time letting her know her conduct was unacceptable and you expect an apology
• stepping back from the friendship temporarily
• stepping back from the friendship permanently

One thing I hope I wouldn't do is ask for the repayment of a gift (not loan) from a very old friend who has been financially strapped in the past and finally seems to be on even ground. Even if I didn't want to see her again, I still wouldn't want to risk causing her financial hardship.

That, and the fact, you told her it was a gift - so you should no more ask for its return than you would any other gift you've given her in the past.

No of course not accept it. There is a mid ground between wanting to destroy her and demanding uour money back and accepting it.

@searchingforsomethiing

I’d be interested to hear how people would react to being verbally attacked publicly for something you never did I.e gossip and tell lies.

It’s a real slur on your character, let me tell you.

If it were a close friend I'd known since primary school who said it while they were drunk I'd be really upset. But in the morning I'd be wanting to talk and understand why on earth they would think that.

@JackieWeaverHandforthCouncil

She’s resentful of her situation and that has turned into jealousy against you. She saw you with your car, eating out and drinking, not having to worry about how to pay/split bill and the jealousy boiled over into a rant.

The fact she bit the hand that feeds also points towards terrible decision making which may be connected to why she’s constantly having to be bailed out by mates.

Stay away from her. This has been festering for some time. You’re handing your hard earned over to her whilst she’s all ‘who does she think she is, she thinks she’s better than me’ behind closed doors. Nasty attitude.

This is wise, especially the part about resenting the OP and having a history of poor decision making.

I'd like to know more about what led to her supposed hardships. Probably self-inflicted like this episode.

Two people with hot heads and self righteousness.

And you don't think your post sounds self righteous @Santaslittlemelter?

I think you have dealt with this very well @searchingforsomethiing.

Don’t ask for the money back that’s just rubbing salt into a wound. Cruel.

@Butchyrestingface

No, because that's not remotely the same. Ex friend doesn't want to be a charity case. So she pays the money back. Easy solution to her problem with OP.

But it IS remotely the same. OP GIFTED her friend the money. And she isn't an "ex" friend - OP's message suggests she wants to continue the friendship.

Friend was very obnoxious, made an idiot out of herself and I would not blame OP for wanting to end the friendship.

But to ask/demand the return of a gift you have assured someone you did not want repaid is a poor show, imo.

No, it's not at all the same.

Christmas and birthday gifts among friends are reciprocal social rituals. Not related to need or hardship (usually).

One friend being a one-way source of emergency cash for another is not a reciprocal social nicety. It's WAY above and beyond, and shows the OP has a kind and generous impulse toward someone she thought was a dear friend.

Now we know the "friend" is a lying POS, the terms of the relationship are brought to light and the terms of the funding should change too. I don't give money to people who slag me off to my friends and it doesn't appear the OP wants to either.

Actions have consequences.

I would leave her be and remind her of her "speech" next time she asks for money........

Don’t give her any more

I agree with a PP that I could have stomached the “she thinks I’m a charity case” I don’t think she’s a charity case. I told her when I first gave her money that me and DH were skint when we had our first child (at 23) and borrowed money to get by. Loads of people have difficult times. I think that’s why I gave her it because I know the panic of not being able to pay the leckie bill or have a tyre burst and not know if by paying for that you’re going to struggle doing the weekly shop.

Granted my DH and I have worked hard and also had some luck in our careers meaning that we are well off but you wouldn’t instantly know. We’ve also inherited a lot. We save a lot and we are not flash in the slightest and neither are the kids (mainly because they don’t know because our lifestyle doesn’t give it away)

I felt like it was the right thing to do at the time and I still think it was the right thing to do.

I just couldn’t believe the anger and vitriol in the restaurant and in public. It was vicious and so embarrassing. The other tables could hear as well. Our other friends looked confused and also mortified.

I genuinely don’t know how I can be friends with someone who aimed so much poison at me for something that was unfounded and assassinated my character so much.

Havent rtft but I think you handled it fine. I think I'd have probably just ghosted her (block on all social media, not take calls, not spend time with her and obviously never give her money ever again) but I think you handled it way better.

@searchingforsomethiing l think you have conducted yourself admirably.

Have you heard from any more of the group?

She did behave outrageously, but if this was out of character I would be concerned there was more going on - I usually roll my eyes when people blame a whole host of things on the perimenopause as it can be a lazy way of dismissing women's actions/concerns about things, but this level of eratic behaviour plus the fact that she reacted badly (emotionally) to the alcohol makes me wonder if it's not her hormones going a bit haywire. There is another thread I spotted this evening about how to make sure your marriage survives the menopause and the personality changes it can bring.

Maybe you just want to wash your hands of her though rather than see if there is anything going on with her, and no-one would blame you for that. I think your text to her was spot on and I guess it is up to her how things go from here by her response.

You have done the right thing OP.We are all responsible for our own actions,she has behaved atrociously and has to suffer the consequences.

@iRun2eatCake

Yeah I have messaged three out of the four tonight and just said that friend’s outburst was about something entirely untrue and that I don’t think she’s a charity case. I’ve made it clear as well that any discussion about money is off limits. They’ve responded to say they know it was nonsense and that they’ve said to her that I said nothing to them about any money.

There are some truly angry / bitter / unhappy people on here, who couldn’t see something positive if it slapped them about the face. confused

I'm relatively new to Mumsnet, and thought it was a place you could come to for support when you couldn't talk to someone IRL for varying reasons. And generally I guess it is, but I think too there are some "misery loves company" posters like you say.

It astonishes me when people fire bullets at a poster without giving an alternative. "You sound awful" is hardly constructive criticism or giving an alternative viewpoint, is it? That sort of poster really shouldn't bother "contributing".

Sounds like she’s hurting in some way (probably not related to you) the booze took over, and she needs a good mate. I’d try and have a frank conversation before binning her, all cards on the table

Is (ok was) she a good mate though, or have you been friends for a long time more because nothing happened previously to end the friendship? Sometimes people "have been friends since school" but actually are, or have become, (or always were!) very different people, and the "friendship" persists out of mere habit.

@Ihopeyourcakeisshit

Given the length of your friendship and the out of character (presumably) outburst , I think it's probably worth a text/phone call to check there's not something going on with her? Then take it from there...

Don't you think that call might be better coming from the other woman?

@gospelsinger

It is bang out of order to give someone money with no expectation of it being paid back and then to ask for it back.

She didn't. She suggested that if her friend didn't want to be seen as a charity case the solution might be to pay the money back, and told her the amount. That's not asking for it back, that is pointing out how not to be a charity case if you vitriolically accuse a generous person of treating you as one.

That must've been really really horrible for you. I think the ball is in her court now and she should approach you, sincerely apologise and pay back. If she doesn't then to be honest I wouldn't want anything to do with her. And I wouldn't normally have asked for the money back but in this situation I would.

In terms of you now requesting the money back - you gave it to her without expectation of getting it back on the basis that she not tell any of your mutual friends. She has now broken that agreement so you're not at all unreasonable to ask for it back.

I’m the kind of person that would probably have just never spoken to her again. The biggest revenge is just never giving her money again - she hit the hand that fed her and now is going to struggle. I understand why you asked for the money back though - as you said - no good deed goes unpunished.
There’s no smoke without fire though OP - something provoked that reaction - you may never know what it is - but something happened - whether it’s something in her life or something you said or someone else said - but there is a root cause.

@searchingforsomethiing

I am part of a group of friends (there are 6 of us) we are all 40 and have known each other since school.

My closest friend in the group I’ve known since primary school. She’s struggled with money in the past due to various things and I’ve always helped her out. I’m in a reasonably high paid job and I’ve given her money and been explicit that a) I didn’t want it back and b) it was between us and not to say it our friends which she was always in agreement with.

Over the past couple of years I’ve given her probably in the region of £400 and done a lot of shopping for her as well get her kids good birthday and Christmas presents. Again there’s no expectation of this in return and I’m glad to help where I can. She’s on a more even keel these days so I haven’t helped in a little while.

Cut to Saturday night, and we were out for dinner with all the other girls. My friend had a bit to drink and announced to the table loudly and that I’d been giving her money because I thought she was a “charity case” and she knew I’d been telling them all privately what I’d been doing. She was really vitriolic about it. I was absolutely mortified and so were the others.

It was incredibly awkward and I excused myself from the table and when I returned it was exceptionally difficult to keep any conversation going because she was obviously unhappy.

I left the meal not long after. I’d given her a lift to the restaurant and she expected one home but I left without giving her the chance to join.

I don’t even know how I feel tbh. I don’t know what came over her and I feel like the friendship is over.

Even with drink, sill seems she's ungrateful.

Yes - nowhere does OP say anything about wondering what triggered such behaviour. If this was truly a really old friend of many years and money was freely given, I would want to understand first what happened to make her kick of like this? Did someone say something to her? To storm off from the table and then send quite an unpleasant email - well that's not what you do with genuine friends in my book. Not without taking them aside and asking what is happening. It all sounds like one of those threads to get everyone in a froth. "Ooh look at uber generous me - and isn't my friend a bitch " If this was my friend of 30 years I would have spoken to her first and foremost.