To not want neighbours coming in my garden?

[Hosta13]

I don't particularly like my neighbours. They have a lot of unruly children, and the family as a whole are generally quite loud and irritating. That said I'm happy to keep myself to myself, and accept noise is a fact of life when you live in a built up area and houses are only a few feet apart.

What I do object to is them intruding (for want of a better term), into my property. The children used to ride bikes on my driveway, I now keep my front gated locked. They also used to frequently climb over the 4ft fence between our properties into my back garden. I replaced it with a 6ft fence last year but have had suspicions they still enter my garden as things would be moved, or I'd hear a ball being kicked over but when I'd go outside to look there wasn't one there.

Today I was in the garden and found 4 of their balls that must've been kicked over earlier today which I threw back - I always do throw the balls back, although sometimes it might be a day or two as I don't go out in the garden every day, am at work, can't be bothered going out there if its raining etc. They very rarely knock to ask for the balls back and rely on me throwing them over but if they do ask I give them back straight away.

So about half an hour later I hear all the kids in the garden (its warm and sunny here today so I've got windows and doors open)whining to the parents about how their balls are in my garden, and can't dad just lift the fence panel again so they can retrieve them. There are 2 that it seems I missed, ones in a bush and another one in the far corner and despite having 10+ balls and the 4 I've chucked back, they need these ones. They've seen them from looking over the fence I assume, they have a climbing frame near the fence which they can see over into my garden from. So anyway dad kind of fobs them off ineffectually but its clear this is what they've done more than once for them to even suggest it. They're still going on about it an hour later and saying well we'll climb over her gate then and get them that way.

This isn't on is it? I wouldn't have dared go in someones garden when I was a child and there's no way my parents would have allowed it either. I'm now trying to work out how I can stop them lifting the panel, because clearly although they didn't do it today they have and I'm sure will again. It feels really intrusive and unpleasant.

They're not tiny BTW, ages range from 8-13.

when i was young, if i kicked a ball over a fence, it was gone. i'd lost it

Wow, that’s so harsh, and really is far from normal💐

If there was ready access into my garden, eg through a gate, I would allow next door's kids in to retrieve lost balls, rather than have the careless buggers knocking my door every five minutes. But lifting the fence panels to let themselves in? Nonononononono. I would lurk at an upstairs window and find out which one they were using to get in, and plan Operation Deterrent from there.

The funny thing is, you say there's no point speaking to him, but you haven't even bothered. This, to me, isn't a massive issue. To you it is. Fair enough, that's your prerogative, it is your property. But if it does escalate, they will probably say "oh well if it annoyed you , why didn't you just say?"

@alexdgr8

i think this is all wrong. when i was young, if i kicked a ball over a fence, it was gone. i'd lost it. and i had very few so i was careful. unless it is very rare, or someone chooses to return it, why can't kids take responsibility for their actions. maybe they shouldn't be playing with balls in a small space. there are other things to do, and parks to kick around in. why are children allowed to do anything and everything these days. why must respectable householders be subjected to such stress.

I completely agree!

One of my friends lives near me, her son is grown up now and a great boy but he was a real handful when younger, always in trouble at school and so on. When he played football in their garden, my friend always said to him if your ball goes over, its gone don't expect it back - and I'm not buying another if you lose it. So he was very careful or lost his ball (neighbour never returned them) and would have to replace out of his pocket money. Even he wouldn't have dared climb over or go under the fence to get it back.

The attitude of next door is really alien to me.

Is that really how you'd like your community to be though? If a child plays and makes an error, their neighbour will refuse to return their toy? It isn't the kind of world I'm keen on living in.

Please do not do what PPs suggested and stab the balls, it will just make an annoying issue into a dispute. Try and secure your fence panels to put a camera up, but make sure the camera does not infringe your NDNs privacy as they could then report you.

@Rosebuud as I said upthread I was in the bath. I'd not long come in after being outside for a while. And I'd just thrown 4 balls back, plus they have another 10 or so. Why do I have to drop everything and rush out to throw 2 more balls back? Especially given that tomorrow there will probably be 4 in my garden again.

@Obviouspretzel Like I said talking to them is pointless because the kids run the show. The parents can't or won't say no. So whatever I do, they'll give into the kids.

Arguably if they didn't have 15 odd balls and only had 1, they might be more careful with it and keep it in their own garden.

Again, they're not 5 year olds. The eldest is a teenager and the youngest 8 or 9.

I don't understand why parents don't teach their children boundaries. If my son were to kick his ball over the fence, I'd retrieve it and tell him to be more careful. If he did it again, I'd warn him again that he needs to be careful and if he kicks it over again, the ball will be lost and we'll only play with it on open fields, but he won't be having it in the garden again if he can't look after other people's property whilst playing with it (who knows what it could smash it somebody else's garden).

For it to be happening repeatedly, with multiple balls, sounds like it's just a game for them now.

You don’t sound suited to living close to other people, hopefully you can move to a more isolated location sooner rather than later.

Wedges and brackets are good suggestions from other posters but even that may escalate things with the family next door. As a previous person said, sure it’s annoying but just throw them back in a timely manner.

I am so glad my neighbourhood isn’t like this. We throw balls back.

@girlmom21

If you heard them discussing those balls and where they were why didn't you just throw them back and call over the fence that if they ever need a ball back to just knock and ask?

if ever they need a ball, just knock and ask

Why would OP want to put herself in this position with children who have 10+ balls and seem to play with multiple ones at the same?

Only on mumsnet do people defined the neighbours kids instead of saying those kids should be taught boundaries and respect for other peoples right to enjoy their private house and garden and not have then trespassing.

As you said OP they have over 15 balls. Its ridiculous that they cannot play with the other ones instead.

Its not okay for then to go into your garden without permission, what if you had planted beds and they trod on your flowers.

They should be tusght to knock on your door u less ur happy to set another arrangement.

Definitely put something in to stop your panels being lifted.

@NativityDreaming I do throw the balls back 'in a timely manner'. Should I be standing by the door and running out if I see one come over, like a ballboy at Wimbledon? ! Maybe I should have jumped out of my bath, gone outside in my towel when I heard their conversation and fetched for them the 2 balls I'd somehow overlooked earlier?

I do have a life other than being their 24/7 ball fetcher. Why can't the parents stand up to their own children, rather than letting them kick or throw balls into my garden and then enabling them to trespass?

I've got some gravel so I'll try that solution myself tomorrow while I wait to get some actual wedges and brackets, and someone to fit them for me.

You don't need anyone to fit wedges for you, you just shove the wood into the gap. That's literally a job anyone can do

I completely agree with you OP. It's bang out of order to invade your privacy or to expect you to return balls or open the gate to let them retrieve them if they bothered to knock. When I was a child if we kicked a ball over the fence we were only allowed to go and knock once, and only at a sensible hour. If it happened again that day our parents said we'd have to wait and see if it got thrown back over when convenient for our neighbours. Children playing should never be an inconvenience like this to the next door neighbour.

The last time they knocked which was at least a month ago, I went straight out and threw the ball over. Since then I've seen one or two in the garden and thrown them back there and then, or sometimes the next day if it was raining (reasoning they weren't playing out in the rain and I didn't want to go out in it either so the ball could wait a day). I'd say they maybe knock once every couple of months if that. On those occasions I usually throw it back there and then, sometimes its been an hour or so later if I was in the middle of work. Last summer they knocked at 9pm for a ball, I was in my pyjamas and said I'd do it in the morning (and did). I've never refused to return them. They know that full well as I heard them earlier -'she's thrown these 4 back but not those 2 whinge whinge'...

Woodside Pack of 10 Fence Panel Security Brackets – Fits 4” x 4” Posts – Strong, Galvanised Steel – For Concrete or Wood – Predrilled, Fixings Included https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07YG2R23S/ref=cmswwrcppapigltti4MXBTES4NJZGBCZNFEN6??encoding=UTF8&psc=1

Fence panel security brackets. Couple of screws per panel and hey presto, they're all attached in a line making them a able to be lifted individually.

@Hosta13

Well *@Sparklingbrook* maybe you'd like to live here and have them kicking 4+ balls over a day and coming in to fetch them even if you've already thrown a load back and missed one? Or are you the sort of parent like my neighbours who can't say no to their kids or accept they ever do any wrong?

I would've chucked the other 2 back but they'd already helped themselves by the time I went back out.

And they've got 15 balls maybe - all footballs of varying sizes. So its not like they have nothing to play with.

Well no I am not that sort of parent. I like a bit of middle ground TBF.

And you can buy trellises for a couple of quid from sites like Wish to stick on the top to stop anyone climbing over.

Jesus people are going over the top here. We’re talking about some kids kicking their ball over the neighbour’s fence. Literally an every day fact of life. I highly doubt they’re kicking them over on purpose given they are then complaining to their dad that they’ve lost the balls.

From your OP your main concern in general about the family seems to be them being loud. I mean they’re kids. I can’t see they’ve done anything that would mean an ASBO was warranted. Why not talk to them?

They shouldn’t be going in your garden. But all they’re doing is retrieving their balls. What’s the alternative if you secure the fence - as some PP think will be some sort of miracle cure? They’ll come knocking all the time or just find a way to climb over anyway.

Wouldn’t it better for your own stress levels to speak to them and see if there is a better way forward? As kids we used to hop over and grab the ball ourselves as the neighbour said we could. We never lingered in the garden (why would we?), the neighbour wasn’t bothered by it and everyone was happy. Is that an option? Wouldn’t you feel better having an amicable arrangement?

@Hosta13

I have got quite a few spiky plants along the boundary. But there are 15 panels between our 2 houses, and some are alongside a concrete path so I can't plant there.

A motion sprinkler might work although I'd need to know what panel they were coming through to position it right.

But you can force their pesky balls into the spiky plants, really forcibly.

I’d probably have a chat with them about it before resorting to popping balls or installing a sprinkler. Just pop round and nicely tell the parents the balls keep coming into your garden and you don’t appreciate them lifting the fence to let their children in. It’s always best to try being civil first.

Just lose the balls in the middle of the night, aha alright in the middle of the night.

@Rosebuud

when i was young, if i kicked a ball over a fence, it was gone. i'd lost it

Wow, that’s so harsh, and really is far from normal💐

Why does that deserve flowers? An unreturned ball is hardly deserving of sympathy. Nobody died.

@Changeee15467 there is no amicable arrangement. How do you have an amicable arrangement with a family where the kids rule the roost and don't understand no? Years ago before I started locking my front gates I told the children to get off the driveway (didn't shout or swear, I needed them to move because I was moving my car and also because they were in my front garden!) and the kids whined to the mum that I'd said no to them (who was stood right there) and she basically said she's mean, ignore her.

I've kept the driveway gates locked since then.