DM only has a landline..no internet, no mobile phone.

[sleaf]

Not really an AIBU but posting for traffic and to vent. I love my DM very much but I'm frustrated and sad that communication is often very difficult.

She is 75, lives 3 hours away, lives alone and only has a landline which she often doesn't answer and goes to answerphone.

She has no WiFi or internet and although she has a mobile phone, does not use it despite being shown several times and at her request being given written instructions on how to. So quick communication via text or email isn't possible.

The only means of communication other than in person is her landline or sometimes by letter.

Probably irrelevant but she doesn't drive and never has.

I know I'm probably bring an awful daughter but being 3 hours away means I can't simply pop round to see her.

@Blueeyedgirl21

Having said that my grandma is 85 and runs an eBay shop! She only sells two or three things a week but still. She learned because she wanted to. I think with my MIL she enjoys the helplessness in a way. She wants something specific so she has to get one of us or one of the older grandkids to take her out to the shop for it, it becomes a whole morning or afternoon. She needs an number for a plumber and she just asks her sons and they sort it all for her down to going round and letting the plumber in and everything. She wants to see pics of someone’s baby, so we have to go round sit with her and show her their Facebook profile and send a message on her behalf to say how she doesn’t do technology but wanted to make the effort to look on the Facebook. It creates a whole thing around it. I know I’ll be called all sorts for saying that on here as everyone over 65 is deemed as some sort of elderly vulnerable innocent who can do no wrong, but it’s true !

I think what's clear from this thread is that the problem lies with people who want the benefits of modern technology, but expect other people to do the work of providing it because they refuse to learn. Your MIL is a good example of that.

Unless you are hard up is it really too much to do and pay for her shopping? Or as other posters have said, set up an account in her name with her debit card details and then you can order from her favourites list with any changes she may want.
Even I am old enough to remember pre internet pre mobile phone days, and I can see how, even for people of normal intelligence, the technology can be hard to grasp if the majority of their lives things were done differently. Is she not interested in learning how to do internet shopping/getting WiFi etc? Or is just needing you to go through it with her (several times) so she understood how?
Is there a possibility she move closer to you? If she doesn't go out much, does she still have a social network where she is?
Not having or using new tech is fine. And asking you to help her with a few things is fine too. Stop getting frustrated and figure out a way to communicate better, and scheduled phone calls makes sense.
When they phase out landlines get her something like this - looks like a landline but uses mobile technology.

If you’re willing to do the food shopping then I’d either have yourself added to her bank account or add her debit card details to the account so there’s no faffing with cheques.

Set up a standard order and then amend it as needed. Set up a standard time in the week when you will do her shopping so she comes to the phone with her list.

Phone her twice when you call so there’s a little more time for her to get to the phone.

Then grit your teeth I’m afraid OP because she isn’t going to change.

Unfortunately some older spoke who have never used technology just don't get it and won't use it.

I can understand this in someone in their 90s who won't have used technology much at all and were already often retired before technology was used much in work places and in general society.

But technology has been in every day society now for over 20 years and more. I had computers at home since the mid 80s. Mobile phones have been in use for over 20 years. Sky has been around for at least 2 decades. People have been using email for the same length of time.

The OP's mum was working until not that long ago it seems.
They'd have been in their 50s when technology was being used much more in every day life.

And for most every day technology you don't need to understand it. So for most older people these days, unless they have a health condition which reduces their capabilities, technology is something they could just use, after a brief introduction to the device,

In the main, using a mobile phone to call is no different to using a land line. Even my 90+ year old great grandparents were able to use an iPad.

My 86 year old mum who lives 4 hours away has always used mobile phones, iPad and laptop so will do FaceTime, online shopping and banking for herself and email, texts or what's app messages. She also drives so will do her own shopping normally but get online deliveries for heavy things. I think she is unusual for her age though.

I'm not sure that is that unusual these days. MIL (75) and her friends (70s-late 80s) all use technology, as do my parents (70s) and their friends. Technology is sort of their every day life because they've chosen to use it and don't want to become isolated. Even the more reluctant of MIL's older friends embraced technology as soon as covid hit.

The problem is that this is how it used to be, some people didnt even have phones!

Not really. Plenty of 75 year olds are very happy to use the internet and mobiles. My father, who died 10 years ago at the age of 95, did so. I wish people wouldn't make these sweeping assumptions.

Ah, thanks, Zazdar

@sleaf

It's just frustrating sometimes for me is all. It would just be good sometimes if I could send her a quick text and vice versa rather than call. She also talks very quietly and I sometimes can't hear her.

I know I am being selfish.

She's just called me to place an online food delivery order. So I started up my laptop, went to the retailer site. When I asked her what she wanted me to order she had to go off and get her list. It was a very tedious call. I've now come off the call completely drained and at the point of tears.

As she doesn't do online banking, I always pay for her shopping. It takes weeks for her to eventually send a cheque.

Just wish things could be easier.

How isolated is she? If she has nearby neighbours who help with day to day stuff does she think this negates the need for comms technology? Has she always been fearful of learning new skills and is she as reluctant to have you there as to visit?

I'm just wondering if she lives alone and has been isolated for much of the last two years could she have developed more general fear of going out but also lacks confidence to learn new things.

If you are ordering shopping for her create her own account with her debit card so that you don't have to wait for cheques (also being phased out). However I'm sure you know that facilitating in this way is going to make it easier to avoid learning to use the tech.

It may help if you can focus on the things she might enjoy (video calls, social activities on line etc) and learn one thing at a time. For someone who has never engaged with comms technology the sheer size and scale of the options can be terrifying and breaking it down to one skill at a time may help.

I wish people wouldn't make these sweeping assumptions.

I also wish that people wouldn't make sweeping assumptions.
Not all retired people are ex office workers who used modern technology. My late MIL was a cleaner before she retired. I know people my age (63) who work in retail or are hairdressers, gardeners or who do other manual jobs who feel uncomfortable or unconfident with technology.

Granted, they probably all have smart phones, but they aren't confident with ordering online or doing online banking.

All these "my 110 year old grandmother is a whizz with spreadsheets" posts aren't really helpful either. At 75 years plus there are a lot of people who have never used or felt the need to use modern technology the way we do. And there will be a significant number who are struggling with their memory.

This sounds exactly like my mum. She is 85, but has never been particularly tech savvy. She's got a mobile, but rarely uses it. Has a landline but has a habit of turning the sound down, or putting the Do Not Disturb button on (although she swears she doesn't) and then of course calls don't get through - and she won't think to phone me. I worry about her because she lives on her own, albeit only about 40 mins away, and has had a couple of falls. During the first lockdown we couldn't get hold of her for about 2 days, so we went tearing over to find that she'd put the Do Not Disturb button on. She then said 'I wondered why you hadn't called'.

I've set her regular payments up as direct debits, but she still calls me to get her an online shopping order. At least now I have her card details so I can just fill those in. I did say to her about getting a tablet, and she's mentioned getting Netflix but I've said that she'll need to get WiFi and she said she doesn't understand that so she's not going to bother.

I understand your frustration. My parents are 80, my dad used to use his computer and the internet all the time but now has lost all confidence. I wish people on here would not be so judgmental of the elderly though. Most would be perfectly capable of using the internet, the trouble begins when the IT side malfunctions. I use modern technology all the time, but I'm first to admit that when things go wrong I often can't fix it. My dad has given up for precisely this reason. IT becomes obsolete very quickly and many pensioners can't afford to upgrade. Everything seems so simple when you're young, now my parents are elderly I'm beginning to understand that it's not so easy. Also remember that people deteriorate at different ages. It's just not fair to make comparisons.

I do worry about some people-whats going to happen when all the banks close or theyre too far and you have to do online banking

my df partner refuses to banking online says she doesnt trust it-i said yeah but what if you local bank closes-she didnt have an answer

@Momicrone

She should be doing her own online shopping

It's not unusual for children to help their parents as they grow older.

Shopping is one way and the OP has been given advice here to make that more straightforward

My DM lives abroad and I can only contact her on her foreign mobile which costs me about £20 a time for a short call. It is always me calling her, she never calls me. She has a landline but for some reason it blocks overseas incoming calls and she never bothers to get it fixed. Have set her up on Skype, Teams and Zoom but she says she can't work out how to use them and never responds to messages. She has email but never replies to any I send, but always confirms she has had them if I call her and ask.

I frequently wonder if she just wants to be NC with me.

My grandma has an Alexa echo (i think that’s the one with the screen) that was set up so she can ask it to make video calls for her. We have prearranged times for calls anyway but I know that she has a few other Alexa devices set up around the house so if she were to fall (sadly likely) and was alone she could just shout out to Alexa to call whoever she wanted in her call list.

I agree that she's being very unfair on you.
She needs to meet you halfway.

I would have a good, hard word with her and tell that if she won't meet you at least half way and cooperate - then she is on her own, except for the bare essentials.

Old people can be so selfish.

All these fearful elderly people without online banking are going to be left high and dry eventually when banks close. I'd suggest opening a new additional online account at a different bank in which £500 max is kept in. It can be 'practised on' for transfers, paying online etc but is unrelated to their original account, therefore alloying their fears about security. They'll soon realise how straightforward it is. No one should just have one account anyway.

@OnGoldenPond

My DM lives abroad and I can only contact her on her foreign mobile which costs me about £20 a time for a short call. It is always me calling her, she never calls me. She has a landline but for some reason it blocks overseas incoming calls and she never bothers to get it fixed. Have set her up on Skype, Teams and Zoom but she says she can't work out how to use them and never responds to messages. She has email but never replies to any I send, but always confirms she has had them if I call her and ask.

I frequently wonder if she just wants to be NC with me.

I'd stop chasing her.

Give it 6 months to 1 year +, without contacting her.
See if she ever contacts you.
If not, I would just leave her to it. I wouldn't go NC as such but I'd stop doing all the running.

I wish people on here would not be so judgmental of the elderly though. Most would be perfectly capable of using the internet, the trouble begins when the IT side malfunctions.

I agree. It is obvious that many posters on this thread haven't come across anyone in the early stages of dementia.

Hi OP. My Dad is pretty good with technology but will send too many texts. Pictures of my mum, constant running commentary about his day and am expectation that I will reply and comment on everything. He's had a long and interesting life but conversations are a one way street with him. I feel really selfish saying this too. But the point being is that technology doesn't always help and can often make the whole thing more complicated.

It is obvious that many posters on this thread haven't come across anyone in the early stages of dementia.

My mum has been a Luddite as long as I have known her. She has a fear of electricity that is completely neurotic. She is also paranoid about scams, but if you went up to her and asked her for her bank account number using a naice, educated accent, she would hand it over immediately and than ask if there was anything else she could help the thief with. Lots of fears, far too much confidence in the well spoken stranger, and too much confidence in her ability to fend off a gang of junkies who wanted her cash - it's a huge problem and has been for decades. She is 88 and up until a few years ago used to put wads of cash in her handbag and hike into town on the bus to pay her gas and electricity bills.

Dsis and I persuaded her to get a debit card and to do direct debit payments. But we've tried for decades to get her to learn to use a smartphone, to no avail. Texting and taking photos and email were completely impossible for her. She talks admiringly of her brothers and sisters (all over 80 now, and one is over 90) who are all well able and willing to use tech to enhance their lives and those of their children. Her insistence that none of that is for her means she can't easily keep in touch with her grandchildren who live in the US. This saddens us all, but while sad about it, she won't try to solve the problem.

It's not just a question of enabling more frequent contact either - Dsis and I use WhatsApp and DM could too, for the price of her monthly (very basic mobile phone) plan, but no, she has her old familiar landline, and calls from mobile phones in the US to landlines abroad can be pricey or out and out impossible, depending on plan. My phone doesn't call outside of the US, Canada, or Mexico. I can use WhatsApp to call anywhere in the world. To call DM I have to keep a landline ($30 per month just for the line) and on top of that I pay for CelticTel minutes because international calls would cost a lot on top of the monthly service charge. I could get an international option on my mobile but that would cost me more than the landline I am forced to keep.

We are all paying in various ways to try to keep in touch (Dsis bought her mobile phone and pays for her plan) and paying with lack of a close relationship because she has opted for limiting family relationships with her by her refusal to engage with technology.

For many years she has been incredulous that I can look up houses for sale in her neighbourhood, sitting here in my sitting room in the American midwest. It blows her mind. Dsis was able to order grocery deliveries for her during covid, and looked up solutions to her TV remote control problems for her. I have looked up various tradespeople for her, found painters, garden people, etc. She gives me family news on the phone from relatives in Australia and I already know it thanks to SM. Amazeballs! And all of this connectivity and closeness could be hers too, but no.
No, no, no, no. 'But I can't do it'.

@OnGoldenPond, try WhatsApp. The phone actually rings so it's less complicated than Zoom, etc. Plus you can send photos, do face calls..

Sounds very like my mum also 75. She’s always been anti technology we were only house in street without a video recorder/microwave growing up.
She uses landline only and phones at set times.
It’s a shame as she misses a lot as she’s not included in photos etc and by time we speak life has moved on.
I print photos for her sometimes. At end of day it’s her choice. I do stuff online if she asks me but tbh most of time she finds a way around or just doesn’t do it.
During covid her area which has lots of elderly people adapted well and greengrocer and supermarket would take a phone order, local milkman etc.

@FoxyFoxyLoxy

My parents are the same. Landline only. No internet. They have a shared mobile "burner" style phone, the old fashioned flip type on a pay as you go. It lives in a drawer and is never switched on.

During the pandemic things were very tricky as nearly everything moved online and they just can't access any of it.

There is a whole other level of stuff going on though, Mum has this sort of sneery attitude about technology that it's not for the likes of HER, that the internet is all porn and hackers, that it rots your brain, etc etc etc.

Your last para is my mum.

I made a rule that any person I’m responsible for has to have internet, a cell phone, and Alexa.

I’ve just sat down with my uncle (85 yo) to pick a new computer for him. I set him and partner up wit Alexa, and they are both pretty proficient with it now. The cell phone has been a bit harder, because the one who used it had a stroke, and can’t see well enough to use it. I’m thinking of changing their IPhone over to a basic dumb phone.

I was able to successfully communicated with my own mother via Alexa, while she was temporarily cognitively impaired and in a temporary rehab facility. Basically I set it up so that I could drop in and just start talking to her. Thankfully she’s regained all of her cognitive functions, so she’s back to being tech savvy again.

If it were me, I’d take a day off, sign her up for internet, tell her she needs it, and get her Alexa and a tablet or chrome book. Leave the landline. She can do just about everything with those 3 things.