Live in partner expects assurance of interest in my property

[joboy2]

My recent female partner would like to move in to my property. I'm 67. She is 69. Until now, I had expected to date a partner with her own property, meaning we would live separately but regularly stay over in each others property. My partner has no property. My main worry is that I have always intended to pass my house on after my death, in its entirety, to my single mother daughter. As I understand it, if my partner moves in and contributes anything in terms of work, money, even decoration, she could, on my demise, declare a financial interest in my house, allowing her to occupy it. I have discussed this matter with her, and been blunt or rather frank and honest as to my intentions. Both she, and her friends seem appalled that I will not consider passing on an interest in my home upon my demise. I have pointed out that if the sexes were reversed, they might take a less charitable position regarding a relatively elderly male expecting an interest in his partners house, indeed they might think he was taking advantage. The upshot is, that I have insisted that some sort of legally binding document be drawn up between us stating my position quite clearly before any move by my partner. The only other options being that we break up over this issue, or we carry on as we are and she continue to live in her own rented accommodation. I wonder what other readers might think, or indeed what advice they might offer. Joboy.

the OP is confusing imo

I agree. I find it astonishing that so many posters thing the partner should give up all her security to move in with someone who could make her homeless either by death or choice. Its prudent for the asset owner to consider impact but so must the person giving up their home.

If the OP didn't want anything more than a casual or platonic relationship then hopefully he made that very clear up front rather than create the impression that a more serious relationship was on the cards.

I agree with the general sentiment. At this age I think what you’ve made and saved is down to your actions and should benefit your family. And the same should be true of her. Perhaps if you are still together in 20 years then review it but if I were her I would absolutely insist I had no financial stake in your home.

I don’t know your full situation but on the surface of it YANBU.

In her situation I would not expect an interest in your property but I also wouldn’t be contributing to upkeep or any bills that weren’t impacted by my being there , e.g. internet/tv/cleaning/maintenance but would expect to pay my part for food/council tax/water/electricity/gas. Honestly though, it doesn’t sound like you should be living together, you seem to have fundamental differences that will cause relationship issues.

Sounds like you are being sensible if it is a relatively recent relationship.

She will save a lot of money by living with you and if she sets that aside, she may be able to buy a retirement flat if you pass away before her. Or it will be a stockpile of money to cover rent at that time.

If she moves in and you are still happy together in 10 years and your daughter's financial position has improved by then, you may feel differently; at some point you could always amend your will to say she could have the right to live in her property for her lifetime, before it passes to your daughter upon your partners death - or you may decide at that point to leave her some % of the value of the property to permit her to buy a small retirement flat. But there are many variables to consider, the most important of which is likely to be your daughters circumstances by then. It also depends if you were 20 or 50 when you had your daughter - if she is already older, you might be less inclined to delay her inheritance whereas if she is younger you might feel it's something that will stabilise her later when she comes to retirement age herself.

But very wise to have open discussions with your partner about this now. You have a wide disparity in assets and living with you will allow her to save a lot - there are plenty of affordable retirement properties. It's not reasonable that she expect to inherit your entire estate but I'm not sure from what you say that it's her intention that she would.

At your age I’m not sure I’d want to share my home again (I’m not sure I ever will and I’m half your age) and be reluctant to take that step.

Of course if she’s renting she is going to be spending a lot of money which seems silly if you too spend most of your time together anyway.

Firstly, how long have you been together?
Secondly, if you’ve been together years and this is something you both definitely want then I’d get it written out that legally she isn’t entitled to anything so she knows she’s taking on a risk that if you die she’ll be homeless and it all goes to your daughter.

I think she's letting you know what sort of person she is and has done you a massive favour. 😬

I don't necessarily believe she has bad intentions, as a PP said she is protecting her interests....who wants to be potentially in their 80s and made homeless when their partner dies as it's his house? Dealing with grief AND finding a new house in old age, no thank you. That said the fact she's discussed it with friends and they're "appalled" does raise red flags.

Similarly, you are right to protect your own interests and that of your daughter. If you died first this would leave your daughter with a huge headache in what to do with your partner still living in the house. How long would she give her to get out? What if your partner refused to leave?

Honestly I think the best thing here is to stay living separately. For both of you!

I don’t like the sound of her at all.

I’m in a similar position to the OP s partner. The main difference is he is close to retirement and I am mid fifties. I don’t think we have enough information to make a judgement

From a different perspective;

I have a beautiful council flat and we live far apart from each other. He doesn’t want to move to live with me, nor to sell his property and buy something else with me. But I don’t have enough savings or potential to buy on my own. He would like me to give up my flat and job, move to his area and get another job (just like that). He also wants to leave property to his DC which I fully support but I can’t commit to this and give up my security while he carries on as usual. This issue has basically driven a wedge between us and we are at a stalemate.

If it’s a new relationship and you live close to each other, I would just keep things as they are.

OP, exactly how old is the relationship. Also, how do you know her friends are appalled. Did she tell you?

@HollowTalk

She's a recent partner who isn't happy at the thought of living rent-free but wants you to give her the whole house after you die, instead of leaving it to your own daughter?

Are you insane?

And judge her not only by her own actions (which are bad enough) but by the company she keeps, too.

This.

You don't want her to move in, so don't be bullied into it.

I would advise you move on from this relationship, it sounds as if she has enormous expectations that if you were to die suddenly could bring huge hassle to your daughter.

It sounds grabby from both of you, her assuming she would have done rights and you for assuming every woman owns a property.

Obviously going your separate ways is an option, but that aside you can simply have her sign an agreement that says on your demise if first she has x weeks/months to vacate the property with her personal belongings and any joint purchases. Another option is lifetime residency which is what we have.

This is precisely why no-one will be moving in with me, ever. You are being eminently sensible to attend to the legal niceties OP, but I would in your shoes be concerned at her sense of entitlement.

@ChiefAdjusterOfRubensShorts

I would not be letting her move in I’m afraid.

There are red flags all over this, protect yourself and your daughters inheritance!

Same here. Best she doesn't move in at all. Sorry to say, I expect she will find someone else once you say no to an interest in your property.

@Thighdentitycrisis

I’m in a similar position to the OP s partner. The main difference is he is close to retirement and I am mid fifties. I don’t think we have enough information to make a judgement

From a different perspective;

I have a beautiful council flat and we live far apart from each other. He doesn’t want to move to live with me, nor to sell his property and buy something else with me. But I don’t have enough savings or potential to buy on my own. He would like me to give up my flat and job, move to his area and get another job (just like that). He also wants to leave property to his DC which I fully support but I can’t commit to this and give up my security while he carries on as usual. This issue has basically driven a wedge between us and we are at a stalemate.

If it’s a new relationship and you live close to each other, I would just keep things as they are.

I know someone who has given up their council flat to move in with her partners owned home.

I think she’s mad, the minute her (not great health) partner dies, his family will have her out of there and she will have nothing. She’s just won’t hear of it.

On a practical note @Thighdentitycrisis. Would he not do it the other way? Sell his, move in with you or to your area? He should respect you need to protect your future and understand your concern.

@Trippingslippingx1
I’m sorry your friends were advised incorrectly if your in England. That’s not the case that 2 years is treated as marriage.
Many people think they are protected in that way. But they are not.

You definitely should have a legal agreement in place.I remember a very sad post here on mumsnet where a posters parents had worked their backsides off to paid off their mortgage.

Her mother died earlier than expected and the widows came flocking to her father.He married one of them who moved into his home.He died after only 2/3 years of marriage and he hadn't gotten around to writing a will;thé house went to this woman who ensured her sons who inherited the house.They did and sold it and profited from another couple's hard work and stole this posters and her sister's inheritance.

Until now, I had expected to date a partner with her own property, meaning we would live separately but regularly stay over in each others property.

You're being sensible in terms of protecting your daughter's provision on your death but its quite clear that you are putting your daughter first and that any partner in a relationship with you will be second.

I wonder how appealing a prospect that is to someone? Putting aside the financial aspect, a healthy relationship means a generosity of spirit and a desire to share everything from secrets to intimacy.

You might find a financially independent widow or divorcee but again, many women might want to move in with their partner rather than having a transient relationship, so that will statistically reduce your chances of having a happy relationship with someone else - there will be a limit on how many women will put up with what you suggest.

If theres nothing to the relationship except physical intimacy and companionship, its not really a relationship at all but a girlfriend-boyfriend situation or maybe even just FWB. I think your post is all about what you want and you sound extremely suspicious of the motives of women.

There was a woman at my work who moved into her older partner's house on the promise that he would marry her. He never did, and she spent her money on renovating and decorating his property. When he died, not only was she bereft but his adult children gave her 6 weeks to leave. She then had no option but to move into a council house in a rough area where she is extremely unhappy. In that sort of situation, all the benefit is for the homeowner, and I think people are growing increasingly wary of getting themselves into that sort of situation. Same as in your situation, its all about what you want and what will benefit you but nothing about your partner. So its not a relationship to me.

It might be a better choice for you to remain single or have short term transient relationships as the liklihood of you meeting someone who owns their own home and doesn't want to move in together must be quite reduced at your age of late sixties.

Thing is even if you get paperwork in place it won’t necessarily prevent her making a claim. She could claim anyway after your death and whether she succeeds or not will depend on the judge.

Stay living separately.

Just throwing this “factoid” in..,

Demographically women outnumber men, more widows than widowers etc, in those golden years 65+

If this relationship doesn’t last, you OP have a greater choice of potential free and single partners.

Oh, and the obvious way around the problem is to grant her a liferent in your will which reverts to your child on her death. If you are prepared to be in enough of a relationship to do that.

[quote EvilPea]@Trippingslippingx1
I’m sorry your friends were advised incorrectly if your in England. That’s not the case that 2 years is treated as marriage.
Many people think they are protected in that way. But they are not.[/quote]
Its scotland 😂

Could you agree a time period say one year after your death so she can grieve and find somewhere else to live

You would be a fool to ever allow this golddigging, entitled con-artist to move in. She will take you for everything she possibly can. Personally, I think this woman has shown you her true colours. Consider it your warning shot and run like hell.