AIBU to ask how anyone else copes being overcrowded?

[Lemontree1]

I am in an overcrowded very small 2 bed privately rented flat with 3 children.
The bedrooms are tiny.
To envisage how small the bedrooms are, a double bed can fit but nothing else maybe a bedside table, but no chest of drawers, or any other furniture.
According to the council, My 3 children are expected to share one of these bedrooms and myself in another room.
I can’t make them all share, as there physically isnt enough room to fit 3 beds in one room with all their toys, or any other furniture. (We don’t have vast amounts of stuff but 3 children combined do have a significant amount, and I am constantly decluttering)
So, I sleep downstairs on the sofa.
we are all on top of each other there is no where for me to escape and my mental health has been deteriorating for years now.
I have been told that I am not a priority and that there are bigger families in a one bed flat.
I don’t want anything fancy, just a room and a bed to myself and somewhere I can have time to myself.
I can’t get anywhere else privately as I can’t afford it, I work,but rent prices are high and I just can’t afford more than I already pay. I can’t work full time at least until my youngest boys are in school.
I am so claustrophobic and although I try my best this affects my parenting.
Also, for reference I have twins and a singleton. My children’s ages are 3,3 and 12. All boys, so apparently can all share until they are 16.

Is there anyone else in a similar situation? How do you manage to cope? I just feel like I can’t cope much longer, but have no idea how to get out of this situation.

@BrieAndChilli

It’s hard I’m sure and there is no point is people pointing out you shouldn’t have had the kids!

But unfortunately the truth is that councils don’t not have enough houses for everyone that’s needs one and there are thousands of families in emergency accommodation with whole families in one small room and having to share lot hens and bathrooms with strangers so if you have 2 rooms in a private flat then you are not a priority.

I assume at the moment you have the twins in 1 room and the 12 year old has the other? They should all be in bed by 9pm so you can have time to yourself for a couple of hours??
Most people don’t really spend much time in thier bedrooms anyway do they?

True, but everywhere is open plan and I feel like I need to just breathe in another room sometimes. There feels like there’s no escape at least with a bedroom of my own I could have that. I’m not meaning to come across as entitled or owed anything. As I said just another room to escape in area away from my children would be nice

www.bedkingdom.co.uk/flair-triple-decker-bunk-bed.html?fo_c=3456&fo_k=3b920cf1e879f5c157a7e6db26d6cb8a&fo_s=gplauk&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI0ce3gs7G9gIVB-_tCh1b0wfmEAQYASABEgJ8ZvD_BwE#80=23

Something like this

@CremeEggThief

I'm not in your situation, but lots of people I knew growing up in Ireland in the 1980s and 90s, grew up with 5-7 siblings in 3 bedroom houses (which were often 2 proper bedrooms and a box room). One of the families had 2 sets of bunk beds in the boxroom for 4 boys.

@CremeEggThief two sets of bunk beds in box room?? You exaggerate or else your idea of a box room isn't the same as mine.. I'm from one of those families. Dodgy camp beds that fell down in the night rammed between other beds so you had to crawl out the end weren't great living accomodation.

You could keep one child in with you and one child in with your 12 year old yeh it’s not ideal but it would be a solution, plenty of parents have to share with their kids my 4 year old is still in my room as I have an autistic child and they can’t share a room so I’ve had my 4 year old in my room since she was born.

That sounds really tough, OP.

Ignore the superior and sanctimonious posts - you clearly asked for advice and support not a moral lecture.

My friend was in a similar situation and she was, as pp suggested, utterly ruthless about decluttering, tidying and organising. Eg for birthdays/Xmas, she explicitly asked people to offer/buy experiences even just taking the children to the park one afternoon, rather than giving more stuff.

She kept as much of the children's stuff in their bedrooms as possible and did buy an good quality bed settee. I think knowing that you're going to get into a really comfy bed at some point must help with the day to day grind.

Hope that things improve for you, and you sound like a lovely mum.

@WomblingWilma

Unfortunately OP I can’t see you can improve on your situation unless you move to a bigger property which is not feasible right now.

A 12 year old should not be sharing with 3 year old twins to all the posters saying OP should put them in together! That’s not fair at all so you’ve done the right thing, and a selfless thing, making your sleeping area in the lounge.

Surely when your twins go to sleep and your 12 year old is in his room, you get some quiet time in the lounge? It’s really tough bringing up twins. I’ve had them with an older DC too, let alone in a tiny flat and as a single parent but you’re doing it! Do they go to bed at a reasonable time?

It’s not ideal at all but you’ve doing your best for your DC so you can be proud of yourself .

Thank you very much I appreciate this reply

To envisage how small the bedrooms are, a double bed can fit but nothing else maybe a bedside table, but no chest of drawers, or any other furniture.

It's a disgrace that it's even legal to build houses with rooms that small.

Other countries have regulations on minimum acceptable living space, and houses are measured by square metre of floor space, not just "number of bedrooms" which can be extremely deceptive.

If you can fit a double bed but no clothes storage then it shouldn't count as a double bedroom at all.

It is really depressing being overcrowded, I really feel for you. I agree you have to get really tough with clutter - toy library, or 1 in 1 out from charity shop. If you can get hold of triple bunkbeds - the middle one kind of goes out at an angle - then do it, or double then a single bunkbed in your room. Don't try to build anything yourself though, home made bed solutions for kids can be really dangerous.

If you've any stairs, see if you can store things under there, or under the beds, or think about the walls - can you put more shelves up? Store as much as you can on the walls or even ceiling! Think vertical - some sofas even have storage or you can roll your bed under there. If you can get hold of floor to ceiling cupboards or wardrobes, do it. Ikea do really narrow but really high sets of drawers you can find second hand on ebay. You can store things on top of kitchen cupboards if they don't go right to the top. If you have any energy (ha) then painting everything the same light colour helps, mirrored stuff, having the curtains right back and blinds/ windows open as much as you can. No cushions/throws/ beanbags nonsense.
If you're children are different sexes, you might get higher priority one day (not sure its still the case but in my old LA, once over 8 then different sexes needed own rooms).

Other countries have regulations on minimum acceptable living space

They do. And it's often very much less than is considered acceptable here it the UK.

@WallaceinAnderland

Could you divide the bigger room into 2 by doing something like this. Cheap MDF on standard bunk beds might do the job.

I love that idea, but long term the twins would need two beds?

I'm sorry things are rough OP.

Referring to a previous poster's suggestion re use of wall space: I could not agree more.
The only thing is that I don't have the skill set or the tools to put up proper storage and could potentially create a dangerous situation.
One thing councils could possibly do is help people to do this, to put in good quality storage fitted by a professional on appropriate surfaces to take the weight etc.
Op, I hope things get better x

@roarfeckingroarr

Why did you have so many kids without your own housing? Why is this the council's / taxpayers' responsibility?

I didn’t “have so many kids” we could have somewhat comfortably lived as a family of three but I didn’t choose twins

Hi OP, must be really difficult and I can totally understand why a 12yo would not like sharing with x2 three year olds. It may take a short while in the morning or when you’re next free but do you think you could draw out a very rough floor plan with dimensions? I’m good at very little sadly but one thing I can do is look at spaces and come up with practical solutions - would love to help. If not don’t worry. Most obvious is twins in biggest room with bunks (if one is capable of going upper bunk yet?…you can get some with mega high sides, if not trundle will have to do for now)…. Dc 12 prob does need the other bedroom - bunks so there’s an alternative bed for if/when the need arises and desk for study and a chair if space for chill out. God, it must be so hard not to have any of your own personal space - but if you post sitting room layout we can see what can be done. Extremely strict bed times are your friend here….twins in bed by 7, 12 yo upstairs by 8 (he doesn’t have to go to bed, just give you space - he can read, study, listen to podcasts, watch an iPad). Definitely declutter - be strict with kids about what goes where. You may well have gone through all these options before so if so I’m sorry!

OP, it sounds really hard, and you do not need to justify yourself to anyone - especially the handful of arseholes who've decided to give you a kicking.

I agree with you that you can't reasonably expect your 12yo to share with the 3yos. I liked an earlier suggestion of repurposing the living room as the twins' room if possible, but this depends on all sorts of other stuff including whether your dining table fits in your kitchen (if your kitchen is separate from your living room - mine isn't!)

Space for you is important, but if you're needing to sleep in the living room you need to find a creative way of fulfilling that need. Balcony, even a window box?! Sorry that feels really cut down to size, but what you need is something that brings you joy and which your children won't be interested in trying to nick (because a lot of the pleasure and peace of your own space comes from not having to fight 3 year olds for it!). It might even be the poky corner of hallway by the front door, idk.

All the stuff about storage and minimalism is also useful, but the space for 'you' is key I think. Even little things which make the living space feel more 'yours' once the kids are in bed, burning essential oils or something? And definitely get some collective tidying up done every eve before bedtime. My room is my sanctuary because it's a place I can come to when they've scattered their stuff everywhere else, so I'd want to replicate that as far as possible too.

Hope you find a way

"you are adequately housed as per the guidelines" - wow what a cold nasty comment. Clearly it's not ideal for the children - so how about thinking of it from their perspective?

We can acknowledge a massive shortfall of council housing without being rude to people - quite clearly it's not 'adequate' - it's shit for the OP and for her kids.

We lived in Japan for a short time and it completely changed my view of how much space I actually need. Lots of the furniture there is smaller than what we have and folds away. We slept on a futon mattress and that would be folded away and put in the cupboard and then that area was our living and dining room.

I don't think you have much choice other than giving the DC the rooms between them, especially with the age gap.

A good declutter and some multi purpose furniture/storage would make a massive difference.

there are bigger families in a one bed flat

Which is a fucking travesty.

Meanwhile taxpayers last year were mugged for £330,000 to fill potholes in a multi millionaire Tory aristocrat's driveway.

It sounds tough and I'm not surprised your mental health is suffering.

I don't understand why some posters feel the need to wade in and abuse you, says a lot about them 🙄 but you have my sympathy.

I don't want to give advice as I've no experience of living in such tight accommodation but absolutely it is hard on everyone 💐

It was quite common for DHs school friends to live like this when he was growing up. He actually had a room created by splitting another room. But there were children who slept in the kitchen or in their parents room, even when they were teenagers (and they still had other children after).

A teenager can’t sleep with toddlers! The only helpful thing I can suggest is be ruthless with ‘stuff’ esp toddler things, once they are done with stuff, get rid. And be strict with bedtimes. I’ve known a few parents who’ve slept in living rooms. It’s not ideal but better than sharing.

Do you live in a particularly expensive part of the country?

I have a shelf on the landing for my dd clothes. She has a bed in our room. If my downstairs wasnt open plan I would turn the dining room into a bedroom. I also have a bunk bed and cabin bed in one bedroom. Needs must I guess. Although we rent I did put up a stud wall as well. The landlord hasnt done a check in 20 years so that was easy to do. I doubt that is a choice for most people but I know our house will be gutted when we move out so we can do that kind of thing.

As you're renting privately, you won't be losing any security/disadvantaging yourself in giving up a social housing tenancy by saving up to move into a larger property.

If you aren't working right now, one of the things that will make it easier to get approved for a new rental is to go back to work fulltime. It might not happen overnight, but if you had moved into a two bedroomed council/HA property in the first place, you'd have absolutely no chance of ever being moved - and there are smaller two bedroom council flats than a two level one as you describe.

@NellWilsonsWhiteHair

OP, it sounds really hard, and you do not need to justify yourself to anyone - especially the handful of arseholes who've decided to give you a kicking.

I agree with you that you can't reasonably expect your 12yo to share with the 3yos. I liked an earlier suggestion of repurposing the living room as the twins' room if possible, but this depends on all sorts of other stuff including whether your dining table fits in your kitchen (if your kitchen is separate from your living room - mine isn't!)

Space for you is important, but if you're needing to sleep in the living room you need to find a creative way of fulfilling that need. Balcony, even a window box?! Sorry that feels really cut down to size, but what you need is something that brings you joy and which your children won't be interested in trying to nick (because a lot of the pleasure and peace of your own space comes from not having to fight 3 year olds for it!). It might even be the poky corner of hallway by the front door, idk.

All the stuff about storage and minimalism is also useful, but the space for 'you' is key I think. Even little things which make the living space feel more 'yours' once the kids are in bed, burning essential oils or something? And definitely get some collective tidying up done every eve before bedtime. My room is my sanctuary because it's a place I can come to when they've scattered their stuff everywhere else, so I'd want to replicate that as far as possible too.

Hope you find a way

Thank you, I’m going to have a good think when boys are at school/nursery about space and what we can do.

To give some idea I’ve currently got 1x single wardrobe in eldests room which have both our clothes in.
He also has a cabin bed with desk and other storage underneath.
He has his own space and Minimal furniture but everything which he needs.
Twins room 1x double bed (which was mine) and some toy storage.
I plan on getting different beds for them in the future as I’ve only just starting sleeping on the sofa.

I will definitely think of a way to create my own space like you have suggested.

I get that in an ideal world you'd want your own room, but you have to work with what you've got. Perhaps decorate the living room to make it more 'bedroomy' for you, and when the dc go to sleep it is your space. Ikea do nice day beds which double up nicely as seating.

@Blinkingbatshit

Hi OP, must be really difficult and I can totally understand why a 12yo would not like sharing with x2 three year olds. It may take a short while in the morning or when you’re next free but do you think you could draw out a very rough floor plan with dimensions? I’m good at very little sadly but one thing I can do is look at spaces and come up with practical solutions - would love to help. If not don’t worry. Most obvious is twins in biggest room with bunks (if one is capable of going upper bunk yet?…you can get some with mega high sides, if not trundle will have to do for now)…. Dc 12 prob does need the other bedroom - bunks so there’s an alternative bed for if/when the need arises and desk for study and a chair if space for chill out. God, it must be so hard not to have any of your own personal space - but if you post sitting room layout we can see what can be done. Extremely strict bed times are your friend here….twins in bed by 7, 12 yo upstairs by 8 (he doesn’t have to go to bed, just give you space - he can read, study, listen to podcasts, watch an iPad). Definitely declutter - be strict with kids about what goes where. You may well have gone through all these options before so if so I’m sorry!

Thank you so much, I will find some time and get back to you. So kind of you to offer