to want a dog despite working full time and living in a flat?

[goodforyounoonecares]

My boyfriend and I have been together for 12 years. We’re 30, have just bought a flat in London and we’ll have a very inexpensive wedding soon. I’ve always wanted a dog. He’s grown up with dogs and loves them too but obviously has more experience in having one as a pet.

I really feel that a dog will significantly improve my mental wellbeing. I am aware of the stress dog ownership can bring, esp in the puppy period and I know it’s a huge responsibility.

I work 3 days a week from 8am to 7pm and one in four Saturdays. My partner works normal days, nights, weekends and long days (8am to 10pm) in equal sharing. Obviously the dog will need to go to daycare.

My partner is strongly against us getting a dog because he thinks it’s not fair to have them in day care half the week as they may be neglected by the day care owners/other dogs and that a dog should be given 100% undivided attention by their owner. He also thinks is not fair to raise a dog in a flat.

We can easily afford a dog. He thinks I’m desperate for a dog as I’m very broody which is partially true although I’ve wanted a dog long before I’ve been thinking about having our own family. We can’t TTC until we’re mid 30s for a multitude of reasons.

Taking 6 months off work unpaid to look after a dog must be a joke right??

Everyone talking about day care is missing one vital point - I don't know of any day care that would work pick up around your hours. Ours is 7-9drop off, collect by 6pm. Our kennels does an out of hour service for day stays which is 8pm latest collection. Assuming you have a commute of some kind I don't know that you'd be able to get a dog droped off pre 8am to collect post 7pm, but maybe London works differently. I work until 10pm and day care isn't a daily option for this reason, we can only do it on days DH can collect.
Good day care can be amazing, ours comes home exhausted and fulfilled, but she only goes a few times a month. It's the daily activities with her that make our bond so good.
I'm seriously having to consider turning down a promotion at work because it would change my working hours and mean she had to go to day care at least three days a week. We couldn't afford it even with a pay rise, and also it doesn't seem fair or right.

@Snoozer11 you should probably speak to someone if you can’t handle leaving your dog at the groomers for a few hours. That is not healthy.

I think if you got an older dog that slept a lot, you'd be fine.

My friend has an older King Charles. She watches it on a webcam all day, it's active for an hour in the morning and a couple of hours in the evening, otherwise it just sleeps.

Getting a puppy seems mean IMO.

Why are you waiting to TTC until you are mid 30s? What if you wait 5 years and find out it's difficult for you?

I had 2 golden retrievers over 20 years. I worked part time, my husband worked from home a lot. We had a big garden in each of the houses we owned during the time we had the dogs. They were pedigree dogs and both had very sensitive stomachs. It didn't take much to cause explosive D and V. It could go on for a week at a time. Vets are not cheap. The only way to clean the dog and the part of the garden they had pooped in was with a jet hosepipe and a bucket of warm water. It would be horrendous if your dog had an accident on the communal staircase/hallway. You would never get the smell out of the carpet.. If you managed to get the dog outside how would you clear up a pool of liquid poo on the pavement at 2 in the morning and then again at 4 and then at 6. Just leaving it there isn't acceptable. I had not grown up with dogs, I had no idea how much work a puppy is. I was a teacher and we got our puppy at the start of the summer holidays. I was there all the time. We had a trainer who came to the house every week. She trained us and then returned the following week to see how we were getting on with training the dog. My children were 9 and 11. They played a very active part in the training. They also spotted when he started to circle (needed to go to the toilet) so there was a lot of positive reinforcement and not many accidents. I was absolutely shattered by the end of the first month. It was as much work as having a baby. I shall never forget standing on the grass at 4 in the morning whilst he sniffed about. He would start to rotate and I would think thank god, here comes a wee. At the crucial moment he would smell a smell, stop rotating and bugger off after the smell. I shed quite a few tears about it all. He liked the taste of our 1930s plaster walls and ate a big chunk out of the corner when I popped down the road for a doctors appointment. He ate the bottom of a kitchen cupboard door when he was teething . The kitchen needed replacing so it wasn't a disaster. It still wasn't brilliant. It's an absolutely huge commitment. You can't leave the dog in day care or home alone all day and then go out with friends in the evening. You live in London there is so much to do and see that you can't take a dog to. When you have children you won't be able to do a lot of those things for quite a while. Enjoy what you have now. Your boyfriend isn't ready for children. A dog is every bit as big a committement as a child.

YABU. IMO it amounts to animal cruelty.

Rather doesn't seem fair on the dog at all. And the coordination if your DHs hours and yours and day care will be a nightmare. Plus a dog in a flat? Just no!

Absolutely no way. If you don't have time to look after a dog don't get one- my mom recently took in a dog that was bought during lock down by a family that didn't have the time for a dog. The dog now has a number of issues such as shadow chasing, struggles to be around people, can get aggressive- all because he was kept outside or in a kitchen all day alone. Don't be selfish- when your life is in a better balance and you can look after a dog without it being left alone go for it.

I'd get a dog as long as you're planning to use daycare...I don't see the issue with that if it's a good one.

Only thing I'd say from experience of dogsitting is that it's a pain to manage regular toilet breaks for a dog in a flat. I ended up going on 4 walks a day to make sure they had a regular chance to go. Not ideal in the early morning or late at night/bad weather.

I havent read the whole thread but have read enough to know most people are saying dont do it.

I have a dog in a flat and work pretty much full time as does DP.

Points to note.

We both wfh almost all the time. We might go into the office one day a week but never at the same time.

We can take him out during the day.

We play with him throughout the day for short periods, work allowing.

We have a very large balcony.

We get a fresh grass patch delivered once a week for him to pee and poo on. We trained him to go there but it was a bit painful at first! Plenty of accidents. It costs us about £140 a month at the moment so not cheap. Hopefully less once he gets the hang of going outside.

We have a (mainly concrete) roof garden. Which we hardly ever use.

We have loads of green space and places to walk him within feet of the front door.

He is rarely alone. In fact he hardly ever needs to be alone - we have engineered leaving him alone in order for him to get used to it if it becomes necessary. But we're old and happy with dog friendly pub trips if we go out together.

We chose a breed that is well suited to apartment living.

It hasn't been easy! Like with any puppy. But it's well worth it. We love him very much, we think he's happy. We have supportive family and friends who could look after him if needed.

We wanted a dog and thought we could offer one a happy home and didn't want to wait for the house and garden we can't currently afford.

Don't get a dog as your partner is against it.

It's wrong to bring a pet, any pet, into a household when one of the householders does not want it.

Therebare a lot of downsides and difficulties to having a dog in your circumstances. I don't think your DP is being unreasonable in his objections

BUT I wouldn't have got the dog if dp didn't want it. Definitely needs both of us to look after him, not least because dp is happy to stay home with the dog while I continue my hobbies and interests! (DP is a home bod)

For those comparing doggy day care to nursery..

Yes, a good daycare should be comparable.

However the bare minimum standards for a licenced day care would be the equivalent of nurseries mixing various ages and sizes of children, with a ratio of 1 staff member to 10 children..

Can you imagine 1 person trying to control 10 off lead dogs, or 2 people trying to control 20?

Imagine this nursery can boot your child out without warning on any day and tell you they can't come back next week.

Imagine the staff have done two weekends worth of training in a hotel function room in Enfield where the qualifying criteria to earn your certificate is 'pay the course fee and show up'.

That is potentially, dog daycare - a bunch of dogs running around in a fenced off lot, warehouse, barn or field. Potentially being exhausted, battered, bullied or bullying, from collection to drop off each day.

I'd be surprised if any mumsnetter would accept equivalent standards of care for their child and that is the problem - if you're reliant on daycare and it is crap, it is suddenly removed, your dog can't attend - then what?

If it were a child, you'd find a place, you'd have to take leave from work and stay home or find a relative or friend or or or.. multiple options.

If it is a dog, those are rarely options and you can't take that time off work - so, leave the dog home alone to scream and cry all day? That's what happens.

You said yourself your bf is more experienced in dog ownership - he’s saying it’s not the right time - listen to him.

Ah, OP. You sound like I imagine my DD will be when she leaves home. Her mental wellbeing is totally bound up in having a dog. I know she would not be without one for long.

I would say that if you had a puppy in a flat you could train it from the get-go to getting used to living like that. I am also in London (central) and there are dogs everywhere. Lots of them not even on leads, trotting along with their owners.

London is amazing for dogs - we have a dog park at the end of the road, plus near Battersea Park which is absolutely sweating with pooches at all times.

You can take your dog practically anywhere now (apart from the theatre probs!) I mean shopping - lovely whippet in Arket on Regents St yesterday - and Peter Jones in Sloane Square is heaving with mutts.

Anyway, I digress. There are also loads of dog walkers about - dog care is big business.

However you have two obstacles. One is you work really long hours and second is your bf doesn't want one and it's really tough to have a pup if one person isn't on board. You will fall out for sure.

Ah, I'm sorry though. You sound like you would be a lovely doggo mum!

Don't do it , it would be very unfair to the dog .

While I do think working people can have dogs, the hours you work/set up seems really unfair on a dog. Maybe if you were more traditional hours, out the home 6/7 hours maybe 8, with the support of daycare or a professional walker. But the thing is that lifestyle won't suit many dogs, many don't do well in daycare, many do have separation anxiety.

Remember too that once you get home you may not be able to then do a couple walks in the evening. The demands of both of your workplaces seem not in any way compatible with animals needs. It isn't like every night from 5-11 pm you will be there to walk, play, groom, etc.

Why don't you volunteer to walk dogs one day a week for an animal charity? That may help meet your need while ensuring a dog isn't being isolated and alone for long periods, which honestly isn't very fair.

A good question to ask yourself here is are my wants more important than another living being's needs. The answer is almost always, no.

Flipping Nora - hopefully you’ve fully taken onboard that your circumstances are not good for a dog.

But way to go re dissing a chunk of London!

Just when you think you have heard it all then you come upon this thread.🙃

I would recommend getting a cat .

If you're ttc in a few years I wouldn't recommend it. I have a 4 month old and 3 year old dog and it's been really really hard. Much harder than anticipated.

Read the thread, folks.

The OP has acknowledged, gracelessly to be sure, that getting a dog in the circs is not a good idea.

I’m glad you’ve decided against it.

I got a dog before having children (with hindsight I think we were trying to fill the child shaped gap in our lives) and honestly it’s my biggest regret. We have a house and work very flexible but he’s still more work and stress than the two children combined, plus the expense, the mess, the constraints - it really curtails our lives and I often feel bad for the children - we can’t do X, Y or X because of the dog.

I can’t get rid of the dog because I’d feel so guilty but if there was a guilt-free way out of dog ownership I’d take it like a shot.

Why did you buy a flat when you want pets and children?

Can you not raise a child in a flat? 98% of East Asia missed that memo.

The fact that your partner doesn’t want one is reason enough not to.