Can new mums really not ask 'how are you?' anymore?

[Curiousbananas]

Tell me mums. Does having a baby really and truly mean you completely lose the ability to ask a very close friend 'how are you?' and make space to hear the response, even just occasionally? Can you be so very sleep deprived and focused on your child that you simply can't muster any interest in your friends anymore? Are we friends of new mums just expected to have a one sided friendship because you're a mum?

For context...
I have a couple of very close friends who have recently had babies. I've been a dream friend, I've batch cooked, I've had the babies so they can sleep, I've checked in on my friends mental health, I've bought gifts. The works. Babies are approaching 6-7 months old. Every minute of time together since babies were born has been on their terms, at their homes, and I have been so understanding of this as they've been adjusting. BUT I'm starting to get fidgety. I've also been through a personally shitty time in the past 6 months, miscarriage, bereavements etc and I want my friends back. Is it totally unreasonable of me to expect that I should be offered more than a "hope you're doing ok" every now and then? Can my friends truly not cope with the effort of directly asking me 'how are you?' like they used to, and inviting me to respond? Am I unreasonable to start to expect a 'would you like to come over for some dinner and a catchup whilst partner watches the baby so we can spend a minute just the two of us?' Or 'fancy going for a walk? Or a coffee?'

I am pregnant again right now, the last of my close friends to have a baby and I'm wondering, will motherhood make me suddenly, inexplicably, completely unable to show genuine interest in my friends and their lives when it hits me?

Am I being unreasonable to expect that friendships should continue to be semi two sided after the initial adjustment is over? Hit me!

[quote SecretSpAD]@MabelsApron have seen your posts on other threads and just want to send you [/quote]
That’s so kind of you, thank you.

The world does not revolve around babies and those who have them. And plenty of people are capable of being parents and good/unselfish friends at the same time.

If you read through this thread you'll see a lot of people saying they value their friends but were absolutely at the hardest point in their life in terms of energy levels and struggling to function... and people saying they are selfish and think the world revolves around their baby, and that it's too much of an ask for their friends to have to wait that period out.

People who are struggling to function and people who are entitled and genuinely think people SHOULD only be focused on them and their babies are totally different things that are being massively conflated on this thread.

I didn't think the world revolved around me or my baby on any level and I didn't expect anything from my friends in terms of my pregnancy or baby, I was just going through a really difficult time and was basically sleepwalking whenever I saw them, it took all my energy to even be there and I did all I could not to show it, but it might not always be enough. Thoughtlessness might unintentionally occur.

Nobody is obliged to put themselves out to be compassionate about that but it really feels like the accusations of being uncaring are pretty backwards on this thread. Most people are not doing this because they are genuinely selfish and entitled. They are just half asleep.

I remember the first year. I struggled to remember the start of a sentence once someone got to the end of it! I walked around in a foggy haze of sleep deprivation - like being in a bubble. I am not sure if I was able to still be a good friend. I can’t remember, but if I wasn’t it wasn’t a lack of care or empathy. It was sheer exhaustion and fogginess. I remember barely being able to finish a thread of a conversation too. I was a changed woman!!

It’s so hard. Me and my friend had babies at the same time, I thought it’d be all coffees and baby groups but she just went under. She seemed to find everything so hard, feeding, lack of sleep etc. She never once asked how I was - she had support from husband who did night shift feeds and would still moan to me that she was tired (I exclusively breastfed a baby under duress as he refused a bottle and woke every 2 hours until he was nearly 6 months). I was pissed off she never asked how I was but looking back she had full ok post natal depression. She went back to work when baby was 5 months old as didn’t want to be at home with her anymore. It’s hard but it can be so over whelming for some new mums and they honestly can’t seem to focus on anything but themselves.

I remember one friend coming to see me when baby was a few weeks old (she had older kids) she looked at me and said “go to bed” and looked after the baby whilst I slept. She’s the only friend who did this and I’ve never forgotten. Your friends are still there they are just a bit lost, they’ll come back and be thankful for all you’ve done

One day when you have a child of your own you will understand. There's no ill will on your friends part, they are now living a different life, one that you will never understand until you become a mother

@MissMaple82

One day when you have a child of your own you will understand. There's no ill will on your friends part, they are now living a different life, one that you will never understand until you become a mother

@MissMaple82 omg how patronising!!

@MissMaple82

One day when you have a child of your own you will understand. There's no ill will on your friends part, they are now living a different life, one that you will never understand until you become a mother

(not envy)

I have to say I agree. Thinking of how to even reply to what's app messages takes more brain power than I could ever imagined when I get less than 4 hours sleep.

@MissMaple82

One day when you have a child of your own you will understand. There's no ill will on your friends part, they are now living a different life, one that you will never understand until you become a mother

I have a child of my own and I understand that they’re shit friends.

@MissMaple82
Also it’s interesting that the kind of tropes in your post don’t apply to men “a different life” “you won’t understand until you become a father” over heard them said to women loads but rarely to men…

@MissMaple82

One day when you have a child of your own you will understand. There's no ill will on your friends part, they are now living a different life, one that you will never understand until you become a mother

🤢🤢🤢🤢

You just can’t judge unless you’ve been in their exact shoes. Even other mums on here who’ve said they weren’t like that, you can’t judge because not everyone’s experiences of motherhood are the same. Some find it easier than others and some have easier babies than others or more support than others, some go through PND etc. you just don’t know. 6-7 months still seems early baby days to me I would say give it a little longer to get your friends back x

@Peaplant20

You just can’t judge unless you’ve been in their exact shoes. Even other mums on here who’ve said they weren’t like that, you can’t judge because not everyone’s experiences of motherhood are the same. Some find it easier than others and some have easier babies than others or more support than others, some go through PND etc. you just don’t know. 6-7 months still seems early baby days to me I would say give it a little longer to get your friends back x

I totally get what you're saying. But you're never in anybody's shoes and therefore by your logic we can never find anyone's behaviour unacceptable then.

I'm not trying to attack you with this. It's something I often wonder about myself.

Where do we draw the line then at what we find OK and what we don't ? If we can never decide on that because everyone's experience is different?

@Peaplant20

You just can’t judge unless you’ve been in their exact shoes. Even other mums on here who’ve said they weren’t like that, you can’t judge because not everyone’s experiences of motherhood are the same. Some find it easier than others and some have easier babies than others or more support than others, some go through PND etc. you just don’t know. 6-7 months still seems early baby days to me I would say give it a little longer to get your friends back x

Of course not, but I think by most metrics of expected behaviour in our society, it is NOT unreasonable to think mothers of 7 month old babies can think of someone other than their baby or themselves ie ask other people how they are.

There seems to be a very high number of women on this thread who were unable to string a sentence together, have a shower or socialise for a year. I'm not denying that can happen, or minimising the experiences of those people who genuinely fall apart, but so many mothers?

I know that you mean! There was no way I was not going to have a day without showering baby or no baby

@MabelsApron I’m really sorry for what you’ve been through

There seems to be a very high number of women on this thread who were unable to string a sentence together, have a shower or socialise for a year. I'm not denying that can happen, or minimising the experiences of those people who genuinely fall apart, but so many mothers

Well, evidently, yes!

@BobbinHood I so agree with this. Being a new mum was certainly challenging and a big life change, and of course my baby was/is my priority, but I just don't recognise some of the descriptions of motherhood on this thread. All the "ooh I couldn't string a sentence together, or have a shower uninterrupted, or think about anything other than the baby". Maybe in the first few weeks yes, but after that it was no problem to check in with friends and ask how they are.
I also do a sport and was back at my club when my baby was 4 months, and also retrained for a new job while on mat leave.
I'm not saying this to boast but just to show any mums to be reading this thread, that motherhood doesn't have to be this ordeal that makes you lose yourself and your whole identity.
Obviously it's another story if you have PND/a child with an illness or disability/are a single parent with no support. But if you're in a good relationship and have a healthy child then there is no need to martyr yourself.

I remember being really upset with a friend who said she couldn't come to my hen do as her baby (around 9 months) wouldn't go to bed without her. I thought she was being ridiculous and that her husband should just give the baby a bottle (obv I didn't say this to her)... A few years later, with my baby who refused a bottle and screamed blue murder the moment I left the room I realised I had been really unreasonable to judge her like that and that her baby was, rightly, the most important part of her life and I was in no position to have an opinion about it as I had no idea what it was like to have a baby. We have both survived our babies and are still friends.

but so many mothers?

Well, it's not as if I could share my mental narrative with anybody else at the time, was it? Much safer to admit it now when I'm immune to the 'well, I was absolutely fine, there's no excuse for being so incompetent a mother and human being' bollocks, instead of then, when it would have harmed my already fragile state potentially irrevocably. and given my ex another reason to batter me and grounds to try to obtain sole residence of the baby as I was clearly an unfit mother.

That's the point of this corner of the internet. We can say things anonymously that we could never admit publicly. Like those who post on threads to say that they deeply regret having children and wish they hadn't done it/don't feel anything towards their child but annoyance/fear/a compelling wish to run away.

They're not going to admit that in the school playground or doctor's surgery - it would cause more trouble and pain than bottling it up or waiting until it can be said where there is no danger of anybody ever knowing exactly who and where they are.

Just like those who are on the receiving end sexual violence, abuse and coercive control; they say it online first, rather than at the bus stop. The anonymity gives the safety to say the things that they thought they were the only person in the world experiencing or that made them a wicked, terrible person.

And amongst the 'well, I managed because I'm not a cunt' posts, maybe those who say 'I couldn't have done it, I wasn't coping at all' do some good, whether it's because somebody reading sees that it isn't a totally unheard of, freak thing that renders her unfit to ever see her children again, that she isn't responsible for irritating her partner so much he has to abuse her, that she is not alone with those feelings/inability to be perfectly groomed, bright eyed, happy and able to maintain all social connections - or because somebody who was feeling irritated with their friend thinks 'oh, maybe she's finding it much harder, I'll ease off/check in on her/ask her outright in a safe place if there's a chance she could be abused' because they hadn't realised just how many of us aren't in a position to be the fantastic sociable, supportive friend we used to be or want to be.

Because we're bloody good at hiding that we're not coping. The terror of having children taken away/being left/being beaten/put in hospital/whatever makes us be good at it. And maybe the only outwards sign is that we aren't able to ask if somebody else is OK.

[quote ChocolateDigestivesMmmm]@BobbinHood I so agree with this. Being a new mum was certainly challenging and a big life change, and of course my baby was/is my priority, but I just don't recognise some of the descriptions of motherhood on this thread. All the "ooh I couldn't string a sentence together, or have a shower uninterrupted, or think about anything other than the baby". Maybe in the first few weeks yes, but after that it was no problem to check in with friends and ask how they are.
I also do a sport and was back at my club when my baby was 4 months, and also retrained for a new job while on mat leave.
I'm not saying this to boast but just to show any mums to be reading this thread, that motherhood doesn't have to be this ordeal that makes you lose yourself and your whole identity.
Obviously it's another story if you have PND/a child with an illness or disability/are a single parent with no support. But if you're in a good relationship and have a healthy child then there is no need to martyr yourself.
[/quote]
Why are you translating "struggling" to "martyr yourself"?

I didn't martyr myself to anything other mothers didn't, I just struggled with it and felt shattered.

It does come across as quite boastful and dismissive.

People cope differently. I had a friend who kept making demands of me (wondering why I had not rung her etc) when I was really struggling - my child was about 5 at the time. Either she found it easier or had forgotten (hers are much older). If my friend had let me be I would have come back to her eventually. (and I still managed to do things like buy her kids birthday and Christmas presents in the gaps). I just had literally no time. My work was horrendous. DH's work was horrendous. We both had health problems. I didn't ring anyone for chats else except my parents and Granny. Even that was a stretch so if I got 5 mins those were the ones I connected with. 7 months old is nothing by the way. A blink on the adjustment-ometer.

[quote ChocolateDigestivesMmmm]@BobbinHood I so agree with this. Being a new mum was certainly challenging and a big life change, and of course my baby was/is my priority, but I just don't recognise some of the descriptions of motherhood on this thread. All the "ooh I couldn't string a sentence together, or have a shower uninterrupted, or think about anything other than the baby". Maybe in the first few weeks yes, but after that it was no problem to check in with friends and ask how they are.
I also do a sport and was back at my club when my baby was 4 months, and also retrained for a new job while on mat leave.
I'm not saying this to boast but just to show any mums to be reading this thread, that motherhood doesn't have to be this ordeal that makes you lose yourself and your whole identity.
Obviously it's another story if you have PND/a child with an illness or disability/are a single parent with no support. But if you're in a good relationship and have a healthy child then there is no need to martyr yourself.
[/quote]
"motherhood doesn't have to be this ordeal " makes it sound like those struggle chose to make it so or are doing it wrong. Better to say it is not always an ordeal - it is the luck of the game. But if it is an ordeal your family is inevitably your priority not your friends.

It is also possible to have a motherhood-ordeal thing going on without losing your sense of self. I struggled like mad but never did that. Probably because going out and single person typical stuff were never my things anyway. I could still read (often after being woken in the night) and my marriage was fine. I just could not cope with any extra demands on me. And I suppose I did mark time out for myself - half and hour here or there - and that was for me and did not include friends. Maybe (had they known) they would have resented that but they were my sanity bubbles and I defend anyone's right to take that time even though they have no time for old friends. One of my old friends understood and waited for me and one didn't.

[quote LuckySantangelo35]@MabelsApron I’m really sorry for what you’ve been through[/quote]
Thank you, that’s really kind of you.

Yanbu but it does depend on how sleep deprived people are, how their relationship is, how their mental health is following their pregnancy, so many factors. Also, pressure from other family members to see grandchildren etc. You sound like a lovely friend, I have tried to maintain friendships as before and love seeing friends without my kids but that wasn’t easy in the early days, I was completely exhausted.