To think most people treat friends like they're disposable?

[IcecreamOnTheDaily]

I'm a person who has always valued really close friendships. Regardless of whether I've been single or not, my close friends are extremely important to me and I'm willing to put in the work to be consistent and reliable and there when they need me - if I'm particularly busy I'll still ensure to check in when I can and be there even if it's not super-convenient for me. Some of my friends I consider closer than my own family.

We often get told relationships take work and effort, but I'm finding increasingly that people don't apply this principle to friendships. It seems like a lot of people only want friendships on their own terms and purely at their own convenience - talk to me only when I feel like it, I'll reply only when I feel like it. It's socially acceptable to distance yourself from friends and fade them out of your life without any explanation, and if you feel upset at this, you're labelled 'clingy'. We're seemingly not allowed to have any expectations from friends, let alone articulate them. I find this especially strange given that many friendships last far longer than romantic relationships and our close friends may know us just as well, if not better, than our partners!

Of course, the same principle applies to friendships as romantic relationships, that no one should put up with toxic or abusive behaviour. I also get that people change and circumstances can impact our ability to be present as friends. But I do struggle with the idea that there is zero commitment in friendships and that people are happy to let them 'drift' or distance themselves without any explanation, even where people have been in each other's lives for decades. I have a best friend who is currently distancing herself from me without explanation and it is bloody hurtful, just as hurtful as previous break-ups even.

I hear you and agree. But I think most people now have very little energy to spare. And I think there is always one person in a friendship who makes more effort, sadly.

Sometimes the balance in a friendship is unequal in the way it wouldn't be in an exclusive relationship though. I have a lovely colleague who is very kind to my children and great fun to see for coffee but who wants to meet up more than I can manage. I know she considers me a good friend. Whilst I really appreciate her friendship, I happen to be at a stage in my life where I have lots of friends of this closeness (hasn't always been the case), two children under school age and a near full time job - I just can't commit to the friendship in the same way she seems to want.

Yes, often people are in different life stages. I had DC young so have more time now but my friends of the same age had then later. So understandably they have less free time. These days instead of scheduling and rescheduling a million times, I join group events such as book clubs or walking groups.

I agree and can especially see it after the lockdowns. I think lots of people lost friends during the pandemic and now I find myself in a situation where I mainly have contact with colleagues and my children.

It’s a very different life to when my children were small. At that time we had so much contact with friends met at school - wider family etc. Now that my kids are teenagers life has really changed for me, become much more isolated really. And work is exhausting, two of my kids are in exam years, everything feels stressful. Add to that the fact that I’m divorced and we kind of live like hermits really.

But I agree that losing a friendship is very painful and not understanding why makes it worse. I think I’ve become much more cynical and hardened.

I lost two friendships during the lockdowns one was a real falling out but never really explained, the other one was just a loss of interest on the other person’s part but came as a shock. Plus now I seem to have fallen out with two neighbours who crossed my boundaries several times by parking their car on my drive without asking - so that pleasant relationship has gone because I see them completely differently now. Life kind of feels sad.

That saying, friendships are for a season, a reason or for life, I’ve been trying to think of that. But I think it’s really true that often friendships are conveniently related to the circumstances that you’re in at that time.

I missed the last line of your post, OP. Obviously a long term friend who distances herself from you with no explanation is very hurtful.

I also agree with the previous poster who talked about group events. I’ve been thinking that I want to immerse myself in community more. It’s really not the right time at the moment though. It’s a plan for the future.

On the other hand we are pack animals and it’s so important for us to be community - and I think this is where a lot of loneliness and mental health issues obviously stem from.

@IcecreamOnTheDaily have you been able to ask your friend why she is distancing herself?

Is this a bad thing though? People shouldn't be tethered together if it no longer works. It is painful bit often it is easier to drift than have a massive fallout/ showdown with someone.

I do have sympathy though op...lots of my friends have drifted over the pandemic.

Hmm I am not sure on this one.

My best friend is like a sister. She is actually now my sil. However, out relationship works because no one gets offended if the tiger doesn't check in or message back immediately. We both appreciate that between kids, work, studying and commitments they all bring that its not always possible. We both know that if one can't do something or cancels there's good reason. We know what we mean to eachother and that's the basis. We don't question how much the other means to each other. We know.

However, when my mum died and called her, she dropped everything and turned up. We both know if the other calls its probably important and answer. And when she has needed me, I have dropped everything and gone.

I think often friendships fail or fade because people gave mismatched expectations. And that's not always the fault of the one that's not in touch so much.

I think finding the right friendships for you can be just as difficult as finding a romantic relationship that's right for you. You need to get on and be on the same page regarding how a friendship works.

I think there are two things, there are those who don't really value friendships. See them as something you have when young but no longer need once coupled up for example. Because they don't value them they don't really care about drifting.

I think you also get those who do value their friends in their heart but don't get that friendships need some nurturing. They don't get that if they don't make the effort it withers and dies. I think this type can feel hard done by when a friend gives up on them but they struggle to see their role in it.

What life stage are you and your friends at OP? Most of my friends have similar circumstances to me - one or two tiny children, demanding jobs, relationships to sustain with our own families. It’s pretty much understood that the friendships have to be low-stakes right now, we just don’t have the time or headspace for a big commitment. I also wonder if it could be linked to your values - I would never say my friends were closer to me than my family or might know me better than my partner, as you do. My relationship with my best friend since childhood is on much more of an emotional/family-type level, but that’s easier because we’ve already done the work of building a very close relationship and she also lives elsewhere so there’s no expectation of a frequent time commitment to sustain it.

That said I do think, especially with newer friends, we need to be realistic about how convenience is going to be a major factor in whether a friendship is going to work.

I agree with your thoughts on friendship and while they might jot be the focus now if they work the should be nurtured. Children leave home , parents get old and husbands leave so having friends around can become very important but I find that’s just not a shared opinion. There used to be a site diwsicated to friendship and their break ups and how in some cases it was like a marriage breakdown or a bereavement . When a close friend starts to go cold it’s incredibly upsetting. I have had it happen to me and we did talk about it and things seemed better for a bit. Not sure if it was the new now long term man but I stopped being the instigator of nights out and now never hear from them .

As a person who has lost a lot of friends in the pandemic ( not to Covid, just drifting away), I found this article really moving. The title is "It's your friends who break your heart."

www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2022/03/why-we-lose-friends-aging-happiness/621305/?utm_campaign=Dod%2075_HFD_Clickers%20%28WnBs5S%29&utm_medium=email&utm_source=HFD_Clickers_All&_kx=XzNCbn73X07iMsTEXC68g_8ILxAhmzStDzv7Tf7dWgQ%3D.VWgGrd

Idk. I'm not happy for my friends to drift away, but sometimes things in their life mean they want to and it's unfair not to let them go. Two of my closest friends of years have gone through a. Breakup this year and their partners were my partners best friends (that's how we all met). They find it hard coming to my house, seeing me, hearing about my partner because it reminds them of their exes.

Not my fault but I can see why it upsets them. The other suffered a death in the family and has pulled right away.

I can't force them to stick around no matter how much I reach out. It's sad but sometimes life means friendships fade away.

I'm torn too.

It's never nice to lose a friend but equally you can't force someone to keep up a friendship if that's not what they want to do.

I would struggle with friendships that required lots of checking in and regular/daily contact. It's just not something I enjoy and I actually find it quite stressful.

It's not that I have no commitment to my friends, more that I'm juggling lots of other things too - work, family, hobbies, my own relationship and other friendships - and I need time to myself too.

I think some people have different expectations of friendship - that's okay but it can mean that one person often feels rejected or hard done by as a result.

I may be getting too invested in this thread:) but here is an excerpt from the Atlantic article I linked. I am 50, so it speaks to me. I will go away now.

"When you’re in middle age, which I am (mid-middle age, to be precise—I’m now 52), you start to realize how very much you need your friends. They’re the flora and fauna in a life that hasn’t had much diversity, because you’ve been so busy—so relentlessly, stupidly busy—with middle-age things: kids, house, spouse, or some modern-day version of Zorba’s full catastrophe. Then one day you look up and discover that the ambition monkey has fallen off your back; the children into whom you’ve pumped thousands of kilowatt-hours are no longer partial to your company; your partner may or may not still be by your side. And what, then, remains?"

Hmmm not sure I agree. Although I haven't made a close friend in decades tbf! All my good friends are very old friends. I have about five really good friend and everyone else is an acquaintance really. I would never treat these acquaintances as disposable which sounds awful, but equally, if we lose touch I'm not devastated iyswim.

But the part of your op where you say that you think friendship is all "at their convenience". I think that's true, but not a bad thing? We are all busy people and sometimes a chat isn't convenient. I see various friends every few months and chat on the phone or WhatsApp more often. If one of them and bad news or any news though I would of course drop what I'm doing to talk to them or go to see them if they wanted. I have done exactly this before and they have done it for me too.

They aren't "my family", but they're very good friends. My dh and dcs are my priority. Then my dad and brother. My mum and grandma when they were alive too. Friends would definitely trump cousins, aunties and uncles for me though, as I barely see the extended family.

@changeyourname11111 I asked her and she said it was nothing, that she just forgets to reply and I should just pull her up on it. Since then it's only gotten worse and if I don't contact her we go ages without contact and she'll never initiate an in-person catch up. I have some friends who are forgetful when it comes to texting but when someone who used to call or message almost every day it's pretty noticeable. Plus, she's active on other groups and replies on there, just 'forgets' to reply to mine...

@MiddleParking We are in our 30s so this is definitely the age I know people are snowed under with kids, work etc. I totally get that and I'm not expecting the midnight phone calls we had back in our teen years! But this friend has no DC (I don't either) and is also a childhood friend who I've known for many many years - we had years of living in separate countries but always made time for each other. Her pulling away seemed to coincide with when she got into a relationship, which really hurts, because it feels like I was a bit of a filler that she no longer needs. I've been in a relationship for years and still very much valued her friendship.

And I really look forward to my 50s when I hope to spend much more time with my good friends!

I agree. I put in a lot of work into my friendships and find it's not reciprocated.
If someone treats me badly though I just cut them off. I'm too old to be giving chance after chance.

I also agree that no one should be forced to have a relationship that they don't want to have. But people seem to put little effort and thought into maintaining friendships and then will say that they 'drifted' apart, when it's obvious that any relationship where there's minimal effort isn't going to survive.

I also feel sad that people will distance themselves without explanation - I feel like if you've known someone for many years and been extremely close and you decide you actively don't want them to be present in your life anymore, do you not owe them at least something? My best friend and I talked just about every day - that's a pretty significant relationship to distance yourself from without any warning or explanation. Sometimes relationships mutually will tail off because both people are busy and that's fine if both people are happy with it, but a unilateral decision to distance yourself can be really hurtful (as I'm finding). At least in a break-up people get explanations most of the time!

The majority of my friends have been with me from primary school, secondary school, college, uni, jobs, etc. whilst a couple have drifted over the years, all of my friends, like myself, put effort into maintaining our relationships

Cutting people out with no explanation is ghosting and that is a horrible thing to do.