to refuse subsidised private school fees

[itsbritneybitch92]

My SO and I are turning 30 and are finally planning a family (as we’ve been together since we were 18!). We are not quite on the same page about state vs private education.

We are both in a well respected profession with competitive university entry requirements, 5-6 years of university study and a decade of further training and postgraduate exams. So we have both achieved very well in life. Our household income is high (we earn the same) but nowhere near enough to afford two children in private school alongside other necessities. We are in London.

I grew up in London a single parent family in a 1 bedroom council flat. My mum was a nurse and worked 6-7 days a week, even through school holidays until I was 18. I went to state schools.

My SO grew up in the largest detached house in the surrey hills that I have ever set foot in with a parent who is the CEO of a major finance company. You can imagine the rest from here.

As I grew up relatively “poor”, I like to work for things myself. I’m not a fan of handouts. If I want something, I save hard for however long, I see how I can make it fit into my budget. If my SO wants something, his parents will offer it to him. And why shouldn’t they? They’ve worked so hard to provide for their son. My SO never asks for anything though.

His parents recently helped us with a £350k deposit on a £950k house. I added £25k into this which was my entire life savings since I was born. I felt so uneasy with this at first but honestly his parents are amazing, they treat me like their daughter and I was grateful for this massive jump onto the property ladder for our future family. But SO and I agreed that this would be only handout from his family.

Now, his parents are offering a lump sum to cover 50% of private school fees for two children until university. We haven’t calculated how much this is as it varies by school but from what I have googled, one term can be £30k.

SO and I aren’t sure what to do. I want to refuse, SO wants to accept for a few years. He feels that a good education is guaranteed in a private school. I feel that we can find a good state school and supplement with extracurriculars and memories e.g. holidays etc. 50% of private school fees for two children until 18 for us will still be a massive stretch. Also it’s silly to put kids in private school then suddenly switch them to state school.

I don’t like the idea of our children growing up thinking that their grandparents paid for their housing and their education and also, my mother can offer very little. It feels unbalanced. I also really don’t want snobby kids.

Congrats on making what sounds like a brilliant life for yourself OP.

I think - kindly - you are overthinking this. It’s absolutely normal for grandparents to pay a chunk of school fees (if not the whole lot), they have built up cash reserves parents can’t, they don’t have the same outgoings, and they want to spend their money on their grandchildren’s future, rather than holidays or giving it to the tax man when they die.

You children aren’t going to give it a thought that your PIL helped out with house or school fees. it’s normal. They will see you and your partner working hard to provide for most of what they have. Neither are they going to think anything if your mum not contributing financially - they are kids, they will love their parents and their grandparents, not worry about who’s paying for what.

You won’t end up with snobby kids. Dickheads are evenly distributed through society. If you send them to a typical private day school they aren’t going to witness much extreme privilege anyway - the parents/grandparents will be making sacrifices to have their kids there. You are also overestimating costs - private day schools are not as much as 30k per year.

I can also tell you that if you and your DH both want to maintain your careers, having your kids in the private sector will be easier - better resources and smaller classes etc means they can cover more of the bases, and you can spend more of your time having fun with your kids, rather than fretting about school progress.

Whatever you do, this has to be something you and your fiancé agree jointly.

That’s a vast handout from his parents!
You were happy enough to accept that, seems daft to decline the school fees.
If principles were that important, you’d not have accepted the £350k.

Your in-laws are planning ahead and want to ensure their money is used to benefit their family. At the moment, you do not have children so can't make decisions about suitable schools but it sounds as though you feel it's important to have a response to their generous offer. Assuming they have access to a financial advisor, perhaps you and your DH could ask them to consider setting up a trust for your future children's education. Ask for it to be sufficiently flexible that it doesn't just relate to school fees so trustees could release money to cover the cost of specialist teaching (music, sport, academic, SEN etc.), residentials, membership of National Children's Orchestra or similar.

.. ok you are overthinking woman!

They are not raising your kids because they help with school fees! And neither have you married well rather than done well for yourself.

Have some confidence and respect in your own achievements. Nothing can diminish those.

@oakleaffy

That’s a vast handout from his parents! You were happy enough to accept that, seems daft to decline the school fees. If principles were that important, you’d not have accepted the £350k.

Don’t be catty.

Say thank you.
Have a baby.
Look into the options available to you for schools and then decide.
You may feel differently about this once you have children.

You can have all these plans before having children but once you have a child or children your plans can change. Then certain things can happen or circumstances can change and suddenly you have to consider these.
One lady I know planned to send her children to local secondary school. Her child was bullied in their primary school and the bullies would go to this secondary school. Then this secondary school results are falling, subject choice is poor and extra curricular activities are poor. She can't afford private school so applies to a better school a few miles away and is delighted when her child gets in. Her other children will get into this school as well.
Some people would like to get their child away from a poor primary school or don't want them ending up in the local rough, poor secondary school but due to family circumstances are unable to do this.
My advice is wait till you have children, look at the local primary state schools and then make a decision on what will suit your child the best at that stage. I would definitely consider a private or boarding school at secondary school stage as many offer a better subject range, smaller classes and good extra curricular activities.

The £30k/pa school fees figure does seem a bit
Maybe the OP has plucked this figure from the ether to push home to SO/DH that it is a wild amount of money .
"We cannot possibly afford this so no point looking" end of conversation.

What are the schools like locally?
Are you in catchment ?
Yes I know Ofsted report can be out of date and schools can go from Outstanding -Good-Requires Improvemt but can also go the other way .

Why the secrecy?

Not sure I’d tell my kids this. I’d be concerned about them thinking they are beholden to them or owe them something.

It’s pointless thinking about this when it isn’t real yet. Get pregnant, get close to school age and then you and your partner can revisit the issue. You have no idea how you will feel when your kids are actually close to school age. Maybe you will live near a great state school, maybe you won’t, maybe your closest private school specialises in something your child has an interest in etc.

I suspect this is inheritance tax planning by your PILs, i.e. making gifts now which are then not taken into account as part of their estate on death (assuming they survive 7 years). That is very sensible (and recommended) planning on their part, and from your (your DH's) perspective involves receiving some of the money at an earlier stage when it would likely be more useful.

So from that point of view i see no difficulty in accepting cash gifts from them, However, i would only do so on a basis that did not give them control. So i would accept money for a house deposit so long as they did not then expect to be able to decide which house or where I buy.
Similarly, in relation to this gift i would not accept it if it enabled the PILs to dictate what school my DCs went to. However, if it turns out at the time that the state options available to you are not ideal for your DC for whatever reason, it would be great to have the possible fall back of private school - it is a nice luxury to have the ability to weigh up the pros and cons of different school options without money being a real factor.

So in your case i would accept this gift but only on the basis that the funds would be used towards private schooling if you decide that is the best option for your DC at the time and will otherwise be used for the benefit of their education even if they don't go to private school (e.g. extra curricular, tutoring, school trips, ultimately university fees).

You’ve bought a 950K house. Even with that chunky deposit and your savings, you’ve obviously got huge enough salaries to get a sizeable mortgage - you can afford to pay for your own children’s education.

A child can attend a decent state school and then attend private tuition as needed

But how can you guarantee your child getting into a decent state school? The better the school, the more popular it will be, so you need to ensure that you live practically next door to guarantee getting in - and what do you do if you get settled next to a good school and it goes downhill, as does happen quite often? Grammar schools tend to be very competitive.

You haven't even got kids yet!!

The money is being offered for now though so your point is irrelevant

Beginning to feel like I’ve married well rather than done well for myself.

Don't let your ego stop your DC from having a good education.

People actually saying there's no point discussing this until the children are here, yet if the children were here and she and her DP were arguing about this the first question on the thread would be "You really should have discussed this before you had a kid..."

I think you need to discuss the whole lot. Marriage would be a sensible idea before you have children. Your DP is at a large advantage financially, and if you break up you and any children will probably have an easier time of it if you are married. Then, do you actually want two children? After that, education.

Also, try and drop your squeamishness and issues around money. It's just a tool. It doesn't have to be emotionally and negatively loaded. If his parents want to help, as long as it's not in a controlling way, let them, and enjoy it.

Another thing to think about if it's being given as a lump sum, is (a) what if inflation ends up putting [half] school fees above the value of the lump sum; and (b) are there any tax implications?

I work in an independent school. It’s very typical for grandparents to pay fees. I think, in your situation, I would accept the offer.

You say even 50% of fees would be a stretch for you to pay then no I wouldn't consider it. I'd rather be home more for kids especially teens than having to work to pay school fees

No schools are £30k a term… I would graciously say thank you, and then perhaps decide once you’ve actually had children / understand their needs (eg they may thrive in a smaller environment and if you have the funds to send them to small private, then great) etc. You may not be living in the same place, and if you are, are you happy with the local schools? Have you been round any privates? (Would be very early to look). I think I just wouldn’t worry about it at this stage.

I also really don’t want snobby kids

YABU for saying this, because it would be like me saying "I sent my DC to private school because I don't want kids with a chip on their shoulder". Just because a tiny minority people who use/went to state schools are inverted snobs with chips on their shoulders about "snobby" people doesn't mean they all are.

I can see pros and cons to everything else (though I'd bite their hands off if I were you, as school fees have been crippling me for the best part of 20 years now).

I think YA also BU for making such concrete plans about your children, maternity leave, childcare etc when you are not even pregnant. You or your "SO" might suffer from infertility. You might suffer from PND which means you can't go back to work quickly. You might suffer trauma while giving birth which has the same effect. You might have a child who is disabled and needs to be cared for 24/7. You might not get a place at a state school which is anything better than 'failing'. There are so, so, so many things that can happen before you get to the state/private discussion. If I were you, I would TTC first and take it from there.

@Beamur

Say thank you. Have a baby. Look into the options available to you for schools and then decide. You may feel differently about this once you have children.

I think this is perfect advice

Good luck OP

* They’ve basically bought us a house and they’ll effectively be raising our children*

I Regard raising my children a touch more than my financial contribution to their home and education

I'd feel uncomfortable but if I thought it was the best option for my children I'd take it and think of it as an early inheritance.

I see you haven't been back for a while but if you have children.. don't automatically assume that in addition to pregnancy and maternity leave, it should be you that downshifts to 3 days per week. The world is structurally stacked against you in terms of your long term earning potential, when it becomes clear that you will be having children you will see you husbands earning potential outstrip yours. His old boys network and his lack of uterus are already in his favour... even the odds and let him drop to 3 days per week. You are in one of the few career where you have the possibility to continue earning your high salary... don't trip yourself up and hand the race to your husband where you would be more in debted to him and his family. Also don't assume that your inlaws will provide childcare.. did wealthy CEO of a finance company actually do ant child care for his own kids? I would wager not. If his wife was a SAHM she has already sacrificed a huge amount for her husband and children, set her free and allow her to have quality time with her grandchildren rather than the groundhog slog of childcare where she will be told what to do by her son and daughter in law. You have two decent salaries... you can afford childcare. If your husband doesn't like the idea of nursery, he can stay home with them or get a nanny. Your mother has given you a fantastic set of opportunities .... show her the best possible gratitude by keeping all the advantages she has given you and be an amazing role model for the next generation which places women and men in the family on equal footing. Take the offer of school fees by all means but don't have them dictate how it is spent... let them work out what 13 years for 2 kids looks like and spend it how you want... cheaper schools... secondary only... split between 4 kids... whatever.