Who the F**K still thinks voting Tory is a good idea.

[beachcitygirl]

Just that really. Sociopathic Patel refusing visas. In a time where we need leadership & empathy & intelligence there's a ducking idiot at the helm & Rees~Mogg making a fortune with insider trading.
Who the hell will admit to being so sociopathically selffish & grabby to still vote Tory?

@Ramalamadingdongs

So people are genuinely happy to see the tories stay in power because of trans people? I can't really get my head around that. You're part of the problem here.

Yes. Because if Labour win the next election then it will be open season on women's toilets, prisons, refuges, representation, sports etc. That would represent such a fundamental change to society and also my life that I could never vote for it.

Honestly I have no idea. They’re so incompetent it would be funny if it didn’t have massive consequences for the country.

And after a decade, “Labour would be worse just trust us” is just bollocks.

But still, if someone is still willing to vote Tory after everything that they’ve done, there’s no arguing with them.

@Aderyn21

Ramalamadingdongs Not because of trans people but because of the threat to women's rights. The mantra twaw is so open to abuse and is incredibly dangerous for women and children.

Yep and if people can't understand why that's important and why it means they won't vote for a party who will bring in changes that will put women and children in more danger, I'd say they're pretty stupid.

@Ramalamadingdongs

So people are genuinely happy to see the tories stay in power because of trans people? I can't really get my head around that. You're part of the problem here.

@Ramalamadingdongs It's about women's health and women's actual lives. It's about far, far, far, far more than mere 'trans people'. It's a whole ethos that in practice renders women unable to participate in society and to live in isolation. It has a flow on effect to every area in a woman's life. Every area. Please don't reduce it to just trans people. It is so, so, far far, far more than that. It affects every aspect of a woman's life. Minimising the effects doesn't help.

It's over 2 years till till the next election, a lot can happen in that time. Pointless to decide now.
There could be a different Labour and/or Tory leader and god knows what else could happen. Expect the unexpected.

I am a Tory voter. Doesn't mean I think Boris Johnson is not an absolute knob.

I admire Jess Phillips and Angela Rayner.

Can't really warm to Priti Patel.

@iCouldSleepForAYear I know more than two people who only voted Labour because Russell Brand said they should.I don’t actually think that says anything about the intelligence of Labour voters, just something about those individuals. I do wonder if they have followed his anti-vax stance as well.

That is your very simple solution. Don't vote. Don't participate in the election. Abstain. Boycott. If a women's suffrage movement pushes for a national boycott, Labour will eventually collapse. And then change will happen.

Not going to happen. Not enough women understand the threat, and many don't care to engage. Your views are very valid but I'm afraid you're operating in a bit of a vacuum. You (and those who are equally convinced) will shun Labour and weaken the vote, while the Tories sit back and smirk. For years and years. And don't delude yourself that, given another term, the Tories won't capitulate to the TWAW agenda when they see there's money to be made, which they will.

I'll vote Labour becasue of their stance in other areas of policy while continuing to let my MP know that they're on notice to address all the issues you're so concerend about, because I understand those issues and agree with you. But I cannot be instrumental in the Tories getting as much as another second in power.

The recent elections/ the referendum in 2016 show that a large proportion of people are indeed thick/ uneducated/ ignorant/ incapable of rational thought or even reading well-publicised factual information/ critical thinking/ have no grasp of economics, politicis, law, geopolitics, etc.

Fucking hell. It must be lovely to be so much better than the hoi polloi.

The fact that a lot of vocal labour supporters seem to have this attitude lately is part of why they are struggling.

@Ramalamadingdongs

So people are genuinely happy to see the tories stay in power because of trans people? I can't really get my head around that. You're part of the problem here.

I suggest you go and read a few of the threads in FWR to discover exactly what the issue is. It's not trans people. It's the assault on women's rights.

@iCouldSleepForAYear You can't even remotely compare Donald Trump's America to the UK. Not even remotely. In this galaxy in several lifetimes. They are completely different and England has checks and balances with it's Westminster government that America does not. Comparing America with UK/England is absolutely absurd to the extreme.

The English, and Rangers supporters it seems

When will it end? When will you learn? They’re not even sorry ?

The Conservative party has been in power since 2010.
Were we even discussing TWAW and safe spaces then? Maybe, I could have memory failure but it certainly wasn't the issue it is today.
This has all happened under a Tory government fgs.
I am politically homeless currently but please take a moment to look at what's happened.
No-one is stopping this erosion of women's rights except women.

A lot of skilled working classes vote Tory. Tradesmen are actively having to turn work down right now, there's a lot of work out there. There wasn't under the previous Labour government. Labour did not care about a huge chunk of our workforce. They thought it was more important to bring in cheap un-skilled workers and send our darlings to university, it was heavily looked down on to take on an apprenticeship.

I have never understood why people assume that their opinion is the only/right/good one.

I think you can assume that most people want what is right for their country, and everyone in it. They just have different opinions on what is the best way to get there. Perhaps someone who votes Tory believes that the Tory party will promote and help businesses to create jobs in their community. That is not a thick or selfish thing to want. That is perfectly reasonable.

And maybe the Tories won't actually fulfil that promise, but at least they promised it in the first place!

[quote Grida]@iCouldSleepForAYear I know more than two people who only voted Labour because Russell Brand said they should.I don’t actually think that says anything about the intelligence of Labour voters, just something about those individuals. I do wonder if they have followed his anti-vax stance as well.[/quote]
They may have.

I also know a lot of people IRL who voted SNP because that's what their family has always done.

I know people IRL who still vote Republican in the United States, even after the January 6th uprising and everything else I've listed, because Fox News said they should.

Voting Tory is probably not going to address anyone's concerns about safeguarding loopholes being exploited. That's going to take more work than just complaining on the internet.

Abstaining from voting at all because you've been conned by "all parties are the same" is how you give rise to despots (or wannabe despots). And if you think that's ridiculous, well ... that is a bit thick. Because it truly demonstrates that you're not paying attention to recent events, let alone modern history.

Do posters think that Labour voters calling people thick for voting Tory is really going to encourage people to vote Labour?

I bit too but it's probably worth noting that a large number of the posts like this on Labour threads are from people with no posting history.

[quote Migrainesbythedozen]@iCouldSleepForAYear You can't even remotely compare Donald Trump's America to the UK. Not even remotely. In this galaxy in several lifetimes. They are completely different and England has checks and balances with it's Westminster government that America does not. Comparing America with UK/England is absolutely absurd to the extreme.[/quote]
No, it isn't. And no, they aren't.

Be careful what you wish for while you're dying on those hills.

I think you can assume that most people want what is right for their country, and everyone in it. They just have different opinions on what is the best way to get there.

Excellent nail/head interface there @grumpytoddler1

All political parties say they want a healthy educated population, good housing and care for the vulnerable, strong military defences etc etc (we can argue as infinitum whether any govt achieves this!)

The difference is the mode of travel and this is largely informed by different economic and sociological theories. No-one has the golden ticket to the “the truth”

@Aderyn21

I also won't vote for any party who says twaw. Am also viewing the left wing parties as more authoritarian than the tories right now - am in Wales where the labour 'govt' ran amok with stupid lockdown rules and the snp in Scotland have had some scary policies that show a complete lack of critical thinking. Kier Starmer is going to get splinters in his arse from all the fence sitting on women's rights and as for the Lib Dems, just no. It's a bit tricky to vote right now.

Did you know about this?

nation.cymru/news/wales-economy-first-in-the-uk-to-return-to-pre-covid-size-according-to-official-data/

A lot of skilled working classes vote Tory. Tradesmen are actively having to turn work down right now, there's a lot of work out there. There wasn't under the previous Labour government.

Are you kidding? Labour presided over the longest period of sustained economic growth since the WW2. Austerity turned the 2008 recession into a decade of low growth.

The labour shortage in the trades is due to the pandemic and Brexit.

The recent elections/ the referendum in 2016 show that a large proportion of people are indeed thick/ uneducated/ ignorant/ incapable of rational thought or even reading well-publicised factual information/ critical thinking/ have no grasp of economics, politicis, law, geopolitics, etc.

I'm not sure that belittling or insulting people is the answer. There is an awful lot of superiority on MN in general this thread. Calling people thick for making their political choices is not going to persuade them to vote differently. If I look back to the Brexit referendum, the amount of mail I received just , on the leave campaign (including an A4 letter from my dinosaur MP at the time) far outweighed any thing from remain. The only thing that came through the door from Remain was a poster to stick in the window (with no detail at all know why I should vote remain)

Of course I watched TV debates and read about it but if I'm honest I didn't really understand all the implications and I would think a lot of people voted (on both sides) with the same limited understanding.

Its taken 4 years of negotiations and along the way it seems that even some of those in power have been surprised by, or not expected some of the issues that have arisen, so asking Joe Public to tick yes or no on such a complicated policy was always going to be risky.

I know all the arguments in the FWR echo chamber. I used to be one of you. But actually when you step outside it you realise a lot of what gets said on that board is a result of the stalwarts winding each other up for years, rehashing the same arguments and patting each other on the back about how clever they are.

I say again, if you don't vote against the tories, who are doing more damage to women than anything else, you are the problem too.

By the way, a spoiled vote means fuck all. They don't get compiled and fed back to anyone. They get thrown away. All it means is that you've wasted your vote which women fought and died for. THAT is stupid.

@MrsPsmalls

I don't vote Tory. But this thread is childish and ridiculous. Half the nation votes Tory more or less. Are you really saying that half the nation are sociopaths? Grabby? Or maybe just a bit thick as they haven't had the insights that you have ?

A lot of voters in the UK panic bought toilet paper in lockdown.

Toilet paper. Not food.

Yes many of them are stupid. Cannot deny that fact.

But the parties in britain also suck big time. And Labour are clearly run by dumbasses too considering they haven't twigged yet that people don't like their anti women stance. I don't like any of the parties available. If I could take bits from each and form a new party, that would be my only option.

I think people like you OP calling people names or other posters calling people thick just make people more entrenched in their views.

Why not have a reasoned debate with people instead of just name calling? The irony is that all the name calling just makes you seem like the things you are calling others who simply have a different opinion to you.