Who the F**K still thinks voting Tory is a good idea.

[beachcitygirl]

Just that really. Sociopathic Patel refusing visas. In a time where we need leadership & empathy & intelligence there's a ducking idiot at the helm & Rees~Mogg making a fortune with insider trading.
Who the hell will admit to being so sociopathically selffish & grabby to still vote Tory?

30m plus people work in the UK, vast majority full time, they pay taxes, NI, VAT, Council tax, fuel taxes, insurance taxes, you seem to be implying on those on high salaries work hard?

We ve low productivity because of a lack of R&D, Investment and that far too many people work very hard only to stay poor and struggle, often on in work benefits.

As for supply and demand... thats very weird, we ve no shortages of CEOs but we have for Carers, Nurses, OTs, Physio's etc etc yet they are on little more than the NMW, some are on it, my DD used to be on around £50 per week more as a degree educated AHP, than someone on a carers wage, she had to pay student loan repayments & parking.
She earns double this now in Aus, works less hours too.....where do you think she feels most valued? and btw the cost of living there is nothing like double compared to the UK.

Companies look at a wide range of things a country can offer, not just taxes which can change very quickly. Germany has higher business taxes than the UK... and our CT is comparable to the home of hi tech, the USA.

Very clear post @Alexandra2001 and very useful.

Enterthewolves
Just putting this here. If you vote Tory this is on you:

Keeping benefits as low as possible has always been deliberate, a so-called legitimate means for ministers to divide the undeserving sick and poor from “hardworking families”.

"hardworking families" - that sounds like a quote from Keir Starmer's conference speech.

More than 1 million UK children experienced destitution last year, study finds

Only the Guardian could publish an article on destitution where the featured family has a selection of photographs from a recent family holiday in the background.

@Clavinova You welcome having 1m destitute? seems like it.

For those of you that find the Guardians choice of photos too distracting here is a link to the Joseph Rowntree foundation report -

Destitution is when people cannot afford to meet their most basic physical needs to stay warm, dry, clean and fed.

Our new report reveals a shameful rise in the number of people experiencing destitution in the UK.

Here are the key findings 🧵

Around 3.8 million people experienced destitution in 2022, a 61% rise since 2019. ⬆️

This included around 1 million children, an 88% rise since 2019. ⬆️

The no. of people experiencing destitution has more than doubled in the last 5 years, while the no. of children has tripled.

x.com/jrf_uk/status/1716716758029967480?s=46&t=Uw4lJNwxFZFnX0Xs3doHYg

Clav would scale an Everest of Tory shame just to get to the worm cast of over a decade of history of a Labour misdemeanour.

I only posted this to give them yet another chance to mention Keirs Beer.

The no. of people experiencing destitution has more than doubled in the last 5 years, while the no. of children has tripled.

Positively world beating.

Isn't that the point - the Tories have presided over a rapid rise in the number of people in destitution - people used to be able to afford ordinary life, now they can't.

There are loads of people who could afford holidays before the Tories got to work ruining the economy.

@Clavinova that’s your takeaway from the article? That the family who are featured don’t look poor enough or miserable enough? Maybe re-read the article - the family, due the main wage earner getting cancer, have recently experienced a significant downturn in their financial wellbeing. The lack of a safety net, caused by the government who have been in power for the last 12 years, has resulted in them living in poverty.

This.

And @Clavinova has links to Tory HQ so just ignore them.

Ffs @Clavinova. You have no shame.

Again, hats off to @beachcitygirl's thread for showing us who still thinks voting Tory is a good idea.

Enterthewolves
that’s your takeaway from the article? That the family who are featured don’t look poor enough or miserable enough?

Poor and miserable - that's my previous understanding of 'destitute'.

Maybe re-read the article

Yes - you missed out; They had personal debts
That's not the government's fault - they should approach their loan provider/credit card company/Citizens Advice Centre for help.

Tatumm
And @ Clavinova has links to Tory HQ

No I haven't!
Are you a Labour activist?

Destitution has [risen] across the UK, but particularly in London, Wales and the West Midlands.

Labour are in charge of Wales and Sadiq Khan could do something about the foreign nationals in London who have no recourse to public funds.

One in 10 destitute households included working adults

Nine in 10 destitute households therefore don't include working adults - not much hope here then;
Sir Keir Starmer repeatedly stressed that a Labour government would be “once again on the side of working people” and would “govern for working people” as “the party of working people”

Yes - you missed out; They had personal debts
That's not the government's fault - they should approach their loan provider/credit card company/Citizens Advice Centre for help.

How do you know they haven’t? That’s not going to put more money into their account, is it? The heartlessness is absolutely mind blowing.

They had personal debts that were manageable - as do most people, mortgage, credit cards - until an unexpected illness stopped them working. I’m sure they have contacted their creditors, but that doesn’t wipe a debt.

People can’t work due to illness, frailty, disability and caring responsibilities (which save the state a huge amount of money) but you aren’t considering any of that.

Would you like us to leave people in hillsides to die?

I used to vote according to underlying ethos of a party but that's so blurred now. You have labour party members whose children are in private schools and thought Corbyn was too left. Then you have Tory party policies taxing everything that moves... It's so muddled now. Then bizzarely everyone gets fixated on cars ...yes the Tories were bleating on about ULEZ while Rome burned but Labour at a local level is fixated on treating car owners like the devil incarnate too.

Enterthewolves
They had personal debts that were manageable - as do most people

You have no idea whether that statement is true or not - lots of people have personal debts (spent on holidays/cars/clothes/phones etc.) that are not really manageable even if they are working.

Enterthewolves
People can’t work due to illness, frailty, disability and caring responsibilities (which save the state a huge amount of money) but you aren’t considering any of that.

Sir Keir Starmer repeatedly stressed that a Labour government would be “once again on the side of working people” and would “govern for working people” as “the party of working people”

Have you considered voting for The Green Party instead?

All the graduates I know at work have personal debts - primarily from getting a degree.

Really can't see what point is being made here.

I'm glad we have @Clavinova on these threads. Her absolute slavish devotion to the Tory party is a good reminder that lots of voters are like this (although, admittedly, her devotion is at the very far end). There are plenty of voters for other parties equality devoted to their flag regardless of how badly they perform. It's football team politics and I really wish it didn't exist. I can't help thinking we might be much better governed if it wasn't for voters like Clav (for either party) who will vote for their team regardless. If every voter was a floating voter and no seat was safe, I wonder how different parliament would look.

SerendipityJane
All the graduates I know at work have personal debts - primarily from getting a degree.

What happens to my student loan if I stop working?
If you stop working, or start to earn below the repayment threshold, your repayments will stop until you earn over the threshold.

Really can't see what point is being made here.

You seem quite naive if you are unaware that many people get themselves into unnecessary debt by spending on luxuries they can't really afford.

Kendodd
I'm glad we have @ Clavinova on these threads. Her absolute slavish devotion to the Tory party is a good reminder that lots of voters are like this (although, admittedly, her devotion is at the very far end).

Why would I vote for Labour now? I have dc at private school, live on the Surrey border, drive my car every day - and Keir Starmer thinks 1 in 1,000 women has a penis. I would never have voted for Jeremy Corbyn's Labour. I was quite keen on Nick Clegg in 2010 and didn't mind Tony Blair in 1997.

Have you moved from up north? I'm sure you said you lived there before.

Have you moved from up north?

No.

@Clavinova I’m not a slavish Labour voter and will vote tactically to ensure that a government gets in which is less selfish and harmful than the current one. Which would include Starmer’s Labour even if not by as much as I’d like.

You appear to be voting on self interest and fuck the poor, & disabled, fuck the environment and our children’s future - in fact fuck anyone that isn’t you. Fair enough, it’s a democracy vote for whoever you will, but know that we see you for what you are.