It's not WW3

[TheRealityCheque]

To wish people would stop conflating the Ukrainian invasion with WW3.

It's shite and completely unacceptable and my thoughts are with thee innocent people affected but it is not a world war and isn't going to become one.

IABU - WW3 is here
IANBU - it's a localised war.

Hungary's and Poland's PM was rather reluctant to condemn the Russians at a meeting with all the EU countries.

Ah, so being 'rather reluctant to condemn the Russians' is the same as being 'rather friendly with the Russians' is it?

Are you really stupid enough to believe that Poland would ever side with Russia against Ukraine?

Poland are being very restrained at the moment.

He’s also testing the response from the West. Plus he has China as an ally. I suspect he knows we can do precisely nothing.

This is pretty much all we need to know and here's a link to an English translation of Putin's address, I would say he's pretty clear about his distain for Western democracy and the threat he thinks it represents to the "correct" global order as he sees it.

en.kremlin.ru/events/president/transcripts/67843

@FatFredsFriedEgg

Ah, so being 'rather reluctant to condemn the Russians' is the same as being 'rather friendly with the Russians' is it?

Are you really stupid enough to believe that Poland would ever side with Russia against Ukraine?

Poland are being very restrained at the moment.

Who the hell are you to call me stupid?

@Undecicive

Hungary's and Poland's PM was rather reluctant to condemn the Russians at a meeting with all the EU countries.

Sometimes it's not wise to rattle the angry bear poking about in your geographical back garden.

I don't blame Poland and Hungary for opting for a restrained silence right now. They are also going to be called upon for immediate refugee assistance on a much larger scale than other EU nations in the immediate aftermath.

Who the hell are you to call me stupid?

Well I don't think you actually believe the lies you're spreading but if you do then I think you're obviously stupid.

Who am I to say it? Just someone with an opinion.

@TellMeMoreHellebore

you have a crystal ball then?

^ this Someone posted a thread a few weeks back about potential for a Russia to attack Ukraine and got a roasting. I guess all those posters are eating their words now. No one knows what will happen in future. There will be wars, whether local or not. We keep breeding, the Earth isn’t getting any bigger. We need another planet to destroy.

@Willyoujustbequiet

He's a madman with nuclear weapons.

This could quite quickly escalate into a world war and you're wholly naive if you think otherwise.

This.

His next step to test the West will be attacking a NATO country.

@Alfredsothermistress

I think you are being incredibly naive OP.

It will not stop with Ukraine. Russia (Putin) will push forward into Eastern Europe, and into NATO nations, which will mean that under the guidelines of NATO, other NATO nations are compelled to act.

Then it will be WW3

The actions of the west at this moment in time is not to protect Ukraine, but to try and attempt that pushing forward to happen.

I fear that the outcome of all of this is inevitable. Putin is insane. He is fighting a war he can not win, but he will take nations down with him.

Sorry, but that is completely delusional. It WILL stop with Ukraine.

Putin loves his image as a madman - he is not. He is cold and calculated. There is no way he will invade a NATO member.

By the time he is finished fighting a guerilla war in Ukraine (who won't roll over) his forces will be decimated.

Putin loves his image as a madman - he is not. He is cold and calculated. There is no way he will invade a NATO member

Completely agree. We too all love the idea that Putin is crazy but he isn't.

And while we are thinking of history, the only nation to use nukes in war is the USA. I'm more worried about how they respond tbh.

It WILL stop with Ukraine.

Let's hope so

Regardless of Putin is crazy or not what he is and always has been is power hungry.

A victory rarely stops there we know this from history

@FatFredsFriedEgg

Who the hell are you to call me stupid?

Well I don't think you actually believe the lies you're spreading but if you do then I think you're obviously stupid.

Who am I to say it? Just someone with an opinion.

What lies am I spreading exactly? These countries were both part of the Warsaw pact originally, NATO or not, I'm not sure they'd get/want the support. The Western world never really bothered with Eastern Europe, as long as it's far, we send our sympathies (understandably... nobody wants a war, some just don't have that choice).

It WILL stop with Ukraine.

Unless China decides to take this as a precedent for invading Taiwan.

What lies am I spreading exactly? These countries were both part of the Warsaw pact originally, NATO or not, I'm not sure they'd get/want the support. The Western world never really bothered with Eastern Europe, as long as it's far, we send our sympathies (understandably... nobody wants a war, some just don't have that choice).

You're right, the Western world never really bothered with Eastern Europe. We stood back when Germany invaded Poland. Nobody from the West ever commented on Russia invading Hungary. And of course nobody gives a damn about Ukraine now.

I'm sure you're actually aware that the people of Poland and Hungary have detested the Russian government for longer than either of the countries have actually existed. They were not part of the Warsaw Pact by choice and they don't want to be in Russia's sphere of influence again.

Are you really that stupid or you being paid to spread misinformation?

@heronsinflight

It WILL stop with Ukraine.

Unless China decides to take this as a precedent for invading Taiwan.

And sadly the rest of the world will treat it the same as Syria. A war in a far off country where nobody need be too concerned. Not that I agree with that, but that's how it will be reported.

War in Europe is however always taken more seriously because of its economic political power and how close it is to our front door.

Putin isn't rational.

Putin started this,with Georgia and S Ossetia, he then progressed to Crimea, now Ukraine. Why do you think he will stop? He will flood the Baltic States with Russian speaking 'refugees', and then send in peace keeping forces to 'protect' them. He will foment insurrection. It's all out of the hybrid warfare playbook, and makes it difficult for NATO to respond.

It might be the start of WWIII, or at the very least war in Europe again. It is certainly the start of a shake up to the world order as we know it. How far do we let him go before we either arrange his permanent exit from this mortal coil, nuke Russia, or put boots on Ukrainian soil? Remaining supine and bleating about sanctions that will not hurt doesn't seem to be an option this time.

Looks like those of us who wanted Dh's friend once spending and HM Forces to be maintained at a reasonable level were right. I hope David Cameron is feeling like a right idiot now.

@merrymelodies

Putin isn't rational.

He is, he's portrayed as a "mad man" but he isn't.

He will have planned and prepared for the sanctions he knew he was facing. He's planned this invasion of Ukraine, you don't amass 190,000 troops with an objective overnight.

He's cold, calculated and his goal is to reunite the Soviet Union that's left to grab back.

Ukraine was in a weak position and has been since the 90's it's been pro Russia, pro Europe, pro Russia, pro Europe in it's very short history. It had no NATO membership, no allied membership and was a sitting a duck, so Putin calculated his hunt for the duck.

He's not stupid, he's power hungry and imperialist but not irrational. Stupid and irrational people do not become high ranking KGB officers and then a world leader. He knows what he is doing and he know just how far he can push it.

I agree he is no longer rational

We know what has happened to Alexei Navalny

And sadly the rest of the world will treat it the same as Syria. A war in a far off country where nobody need be too concerned

Taiwan's GDP is about 10(?) times that of Syria and they hold an important position in both the Pacific Rim economy and the world's tech supply-chain. We'll all notice if they have problems.

@FatFredsFriedEgg

What lies am I spreading exactly? These countries were both part of the Warsaw pact originally, NATO or not, I'm not sure they'd get/want the support. The Western world never really bothered with Eastern Europe, as long as it's far, we send our sympathies (understandably... nobody wants a war, some just don't have that choice).

You're right, the Western world never really bothered with Eastern Europe. We stood back when Germany invaded Poland. Nobody from the West ever commented on Russia invading Hungary. And of course nobody gives a damn about Ukraine now.

I'm sure you're actually aware that the people of Poland and Hungary have detested the Russian government for longer than either of the countries have actually existed. They were not part of the Warsaw Pact by choice and they don't want to be in Russia's sphere of influence again.

Are you really that stupid or you being paid to spread misinformation?

You silly dodo, I'm Hungarian, of course I know nobody wanted them over in the last 50 years, I'm also aware of our current PM going to bed with Putin for years whilst trying to get kicked out of the EU.

@Undecicive I wonder if he's waiting to see how far Putin will go and then blame that on Hungary itself "defending"/"freeing" certain territories in a neighbouring country. Unless they already agreed to split them.

Only slightly paranoid.

You seem very certain of something that you just can't be certain of. History teaches us that shit stuff happens all the time. What makes us exempt?

I am not saying WW3 will happen and I think the balance of probabilities is that it won't happen but to dismiss all concerns about it as ' ridiculous' and ' scaremongering' is pretty politically tone deaf and not a all a reasonable stance