Men should have the right to not want a baby

[user57639206]

NC as I've been shot down a few times in real life for having this opinion.

I find it bizarre that women can decide that they don't want a baby and opt for a termination (just to clarify, I completely agree with this. It's her right to choice) but when a man decides now isn't the right time, right partner or whatever the reason - he's labelled a arsehole, good for nothing or irresponsible.

Surely if a woman has the right to say "no, not right now/not for me" a man should have the same right? Without being labelled or judged!

I've seen it a few times in real life, be it from a one night stand or a not so serious relationship. The woman wants to keep the baby, the man says he doesn't (but doesn't suggest an abortion), and he's thrown under the bus.

I know there is a big difference in some sense because obviously, the woman goes through all the physical changes/trauma of having a baby - but when are men then taken to court for CA or have knives shoved in their backs for not wanting a baby?

AIBU?

I fundamentally disagree. Pregnancy is a potential byproduct of sex. Men should do what they can to prevent it, but they knew there was a risk going in. So they can face the consequences.

@Iknowitisheresomewhere

I am not quite sure I understand.

What about this scenario?

Man and woman want sex. Neither of them use contraception. Woman asks, before sex 'but what if I get pregnant - I know I could never have an abortion'. Man says - well, wouldn't be the end of the world, I want to have a family at some point. Man and woman have sex, woman gets pregnant.

Has the man now lost the right to change his mind because of what he said pre-sex? But someone who hadn't said that would be able to walk away post-sex? In which case you would need some legal remedy to decide who had said what?

And what if the woman would have had an abortion if she thought she was going to be a single mother, but the relationship continued until she was (say) 5 months pregnant. Does the man have the right to change his mind at that point?

The man lost his right to change his mind about supporting a child the second he had sex with the woman.

If he's mentally capable of understanding the biology of sex, then he's mentally capable of accepting the irreversible result.

@pollypokcet but that’s not his choice, men don’t have the.. ‘luxury’ of choosing a termination - they can only hope that the woman is decent enough to understand if they do not want to be involved with the pregnancy or child’s life they can accept that and raise the child alone. They should be forced to contribute if they’ve stated from the offset that they want no involvement.

@RedCandyApple

If you choose to keep a baby from a ONS or when the father says he doesn’t want to be involved you are have to accept you will be raising that child alone. You can’t then be angry when he sticks by his word.

If the man chooses to have an ONS then he accepts that the potential consequence is becoming a father.

Because he chose to have sex. Any resulting pregnancy is his responsibility.

Let's not throw logic out of the window. Unless it was rape, or he deliberately put a pin in the end of the condom, they both chose to have sex, and a resulting pregnancy is the responsibility of both.

Women have two acceptable options when it comes to what happens next. Men only have one. That's how it has to be, but yes, the woman holds the cards, and it's silly to say otherwise.

Nothing stopping men getting their ball pipes tied and then telling everyone they date that they have done so.

@gwenneh would you say the same to a woman who’s contraception failed? That the second she had sex was the moment she committed to a baby if she were to get pregnant and that abortion would be wrong and she MUST have and contribute to that child?

Women do get judged for abortions and for being single mothers, in fact in the case of single mothers I'd say that they get judged more harshly than the men who walk away.

(Most) men understand the possible concequences of sex with women as much as women do, they also understand (or should if they're having sex) that after conception, it becomes the woman's choice and if they are adamant that they don't want children then they need to take responsibility for their fertility before conception as that is the time they have full control over their ability to reproduce. If they choose to have sex at all, even protected (because nothing is 100%) then they are accepting that risk, and therefore no, shouldn't be able to walk away because they don't want children.

[quote FedUpOfLighteningCrotch]@gwenneh would you say the same to a woman who’s contraception failed? That the second she had sex was the moment she committed to a baby if she were to get pregnant and that abortion would be wrong and she MUST have and contribute to that child?[/quote]
Absolutely.

Contraception is not a gendered responsibility.

What you are actually advocating for is a man's right to consequence free sex being prioritised over the right of a child to be supported by the people who created them. So increase in child poverty so men can ejaculate with abandon. That's pretty sick.

@user57639206

At what point did I say she should be forced to abort? Maybe re-read and engage your brain?

My point is if he doesn't want to have a child either at all, or right now, surely he should be allowed to walk away without a stigma? Just as a woman rightly can abort without stigma

You're a goady fucker aren't you?

If me absolutely don't want children all they have to do is abstain from PIV sex. Simple!

Condoms certainly aren't 100%, although they are pretty effective. So when a man has sex with a woman, he has to do a risk assessment around potentially becoming a father as a consequence of it, and make an informed choice whether to do so based on that. Because that is the only point where he can choose with regards to pregnancy.

I say that even though I'm actually pretty glad, for myself, that my biological father didn't want a baby and never had any role in my life. Because it means I have an uncomplicated father-child relationship with my (adoptive) dad. But it was, without question, bloody hard on my mum that he got to decide that. And I am incredibly lucky that she then met my dad.

@OneTiredMam

Condoms aren't 100 percent though....

pretty close if you use them properly

@RedCandyApple
Well if you are able to fully provide for your children without needing any financial support from their father great for you but not all woman are in that position.

@gwenneh so you’re against abortion and women’s bodily rights?

Contraception work by men, or taken by women have roughly the same success rate. There are cases where women are on contraception, the man have worn a condom for extra protection and that has still failed. What then?

It is never 100% fool proof. We’re talking about basic human rights. Not whether someone deserves to have their rights snatches away based on what they may or may not have put on the end of their todger.

Yes you are right. When it comes to pregnancy and the woman’s body the woman wants to get rid then she will of if she wants help then he should give it. If a man wants to have sex with a woman he should know these are the risks. One of the few things a man shouldn’t control.

Yet in many countries, a man will still have this control.

[quote FedUpOfLighteningCrotch]@gwenneh would you say the same to a woman who’s contraception failed? That the second she had sex was the moment she committed to a baby if she were to get pregnant and that abortion would be wrong and she MUST have and contribute to that child?[/quote]
The number of women just walking away I'm sure is much less than the men and the stigma associated with it much much worse!

Again, don't know which totally egalitarian society ya'll live in 🤷🏻‍♀️

Yanbu. There should be some thing that men can go to court for to absolve themselves of any responsibility for a pregnancy as long as they do it within the right timeframe. But it has to be a permanent choice so these men don’t get to change their minds and decide they want the child back later in life.

We should be striving for equality in rights as much as we can.

The difference is that a woman can 'shag about carelessly', not use contraception, have sex as often and whenever she wishes and 100% get to decide if she wants to have and raise a child.

OPs point is that the only choice a man has is celibacy if he 100% does not want to have and raise a child. Any sexual activity can result in pregnancy. If he is sexually active, then he has zero choice in whether or not he becomes a parent.

A woman does not have to make that commitment. She can have sex as much as she likes with or without any contraception or protection and still choose to not have a child or become a parent.

The fact is men have 0 choice.

When my male partner and I both wanted to have a baby, I had 0 choice over which of us would be risking our life to gestate and birth it. Boo hoo, life's not fair.

When you're having PIV sex with people of the opposite sex sometimes you just need to accept that your bodies are different and that sex and reproduction will not affect you equally.

Men whining about how this isn't faaaaiiir (and women complaining on their behalf) need to get a grip.

Men do have a choice not to have a baby. It's called a condom.

[quote Jakie7700]@RedCandyApple
Well if you are able to fully provide for your children without needing any financial support from their father great for you but not all woman are in that position.[/quote]
I don’t judge other women that claim, I’ve only explained why I’ve chosen not to.

So for a woman to walk away she has to go through an abortion? Whereas for a man to walk away.......well he just walks away. Not quite the same is it?

What you're actually saying though is that the man wants nothing to do with the child that is born and it should be fine for him to do that - the (almost) equivalent for a woman (but not because she'd still have to go through the birth) would be to have the baby and then leave it with the father and walk away. Do you think that woman should have no stigma?

@mikeyboo

It’s not an equal situation. There’s no way to make it equal. What we can do is choose the least worst option overall, which means woman aren’t forced to continue or terminate pregnancies, and children who are born receive financial support.

This

Oh hush!

Men have all the rights and more.

They DO walk away

They DO take zero responsability for contraception

They DO try to tell women what to do with their bodies

They DO ignore children they gathered (often multiple times)

They already have the rights you speak of with no consequences.