Men should have the right to not want a baby

[user57639206]

NC as I've been shot down a few times in real life for having this opinion.

I find it bizarre that women can decide that they don't want a baby and opt for a termination (just to clarify, I completely agree with this. It's her right to choice) but when a man decides now isn't the right time, right partner or whatever the reason - he's labelled a arsehole, good for nothing or irresponsible.

Surely if a woman has the right to say "no, not right now/not for me" a man should have the same right? Without being labelled or judged!

I've seen it a few times in real life, be it from a one night stand or a not so serious relationship. The woman wants to keep the baby, the man says he doesn't (but doesn't suggest an abortion), and he's thrown under the bus.

I know there is a big difference in some sense because obviously, the woman goes through all the physical changes/trauma of having a baby - but when are men then taken to court for CA or have knives shoved in their backs for not wanting a baby?

AIBU?

Of course, they do! It's called wearing a condom or not having sex. Doh!

@BobLep0nge

All of you who support the rights of a father to walk away from their child, would you be ok with a man impregnating 100 women in a year and then claiming he didn't want to be a father? What if he does the same the next year? And the year after? Do you truly advocate that a father should have the ability to wash his hands of hundreds of his children? (Far fetched but perfectly possible)

Bit pointless really, fathering 100 children is very unusual and not something that happens often

It's not just a small blip in finances for a few months, its a financial commitment that he didn't want for many many years.

And he knows what to do to ensure that doesn't happen 🤷‍♀️

One man can father many multiples of the number of children a woman could abort. And with none of the physical and mental repercussions of abortion. And that's the kind of society you want to foster.

No, I want them to either be forced into paying for the children they’ve agreed to have, or have the right to admit that they won’t be good parents and opt out, the same way women can.

We can’t do anything about the biology, but either way women know the risks of sex the same as men do. The risks for men and women are different, but as adults consenting to sex, we should be able to accept and deal with that.

All anyone is saying is that the man should financially support his child.

Actually, BOTH parents should (and do) support the child. This is the risk you take when you choose to have sex.

I'd also add, that if a man gives the woman the responsibility of birth control, then he accepts the risk she might decide to have a child.

or have the right to admit that they won’t be good parents and opt out, the same way women can.

So if they want to opt out and father 109s of children, that's then fine according to you.

It's not comparable to the choices women can make, so stop pretending it is. There is no situation where women could procreate 100s of children and then leave them to it with societies blessing, which is what you're asking for for men.

"No, I want them to either be forced into paying for the children they’ve agreed to have, or have the right to admit that they won’t be good parents and opt out, the same way women can. "

But it's not and can never be the same.

How hard is this to understand?

A woman gets pregnant : she doesn't want the pregnancy, she aborts. No one's calling her a arsehole, irresponsible or awful.

You must live on a different planet.

There's still a massive signal around abortion. Generally women do not talk about then openly. They may tell very close family/friends often not even them.

Women who gove children up for adoption tend to be seen negatively too. Some may be sympathetic; mostly they are regarded as irresponsible, cold unnatural, odd, unstable, at best to be pitied etc.

(And for that matter on the other side of the coin, women who procedd with pregnancies as single Mum's esp. if the result of casual, not committed situations; are often judged quite harshly too ..... (in fact single mothers are generally judged harshly regardless of the circumstances seen as a benefits drain, seen as irresponsible, inferior etc).

I’m really not, and just because it would be physically possible for a man to impregnate hundreds of women, it’s unlikely. It certainly wouldn’t make the situation there any worse than it is now, it would put everyone involved in an unwanted pregnancy in a much clearer position.

Quite honestly, I’d be behind enforced sterilisation in cases when men or women have proved they can’t be responsible for their sexual choices, but I doubt that would be popular!

*massive stigma

@WindyState

"No, I want them to either be forced into paying for the children they’ve agreed to have, or have the right to admit that they won’t be good parents and opt out, the same way women can. "

But it's not and can never be the same.

How hard is this to understand?

It’s not hard to understand.

Why is it so hard to understand that there is still space for making men’s and women’s choices more equal in the event of an unwanted pregnancy?

@WindyState

"No, I want them to either be forced into paying for the children they’ve agreed to have, or have the right to admit that they won’t be good parents and opt out, the same way women can. "

But it's not and can never be the same.

How hard is this to understand?

Exactly.

You can't force abortions.

And if they created child, they need to at least pay towards the child'a welfare.

They already opt out of the vast majority of child rearing burden.

If a woman "opts-out" then there is no child to pay for and look after.

If a man "opts-out" there is a child to pay for and look after.

The choice and consequences are not and never will be equal.

Why is it so hard to understand that there is still space for making men’s and women’s choices more equal in the event of an unwanted pregnancy?

You can only do that at the expense of the child's right of support or the mothers right of bodily autonomy.

So on what grounds should consequence-free shagging be prioritised above those? I'm all ears.

They can abstain have non penetrative sex, use condoms (98/99% effective if used correctly), have a vasectomy, they have no right to penetrative sex.

Sex is ultimately for reproduction, we use it for pleasure, but the of reading the pleasure exists is to encourage reproduction. If the woman is not psst menopause there's a perpetual rhsk of pregnancy. Its not rocket science, think with your big head instead of your little one, men.

Oh and in my experience, the vast majority of men who co created unwanted pregnancies weren't using condoms.

Don't shoot your baby batter up someone's vagina and then act surprised there's a pregnancy,vand say you don't want it, it's somehow not your responsibility

You can't know their pill or whatever has been taken correctly, even then they can fail. Take responsibility for yourself.

[quote wanttomarryamillionaire]@BobLep0nge it can have a massive impact on his life financially. Being forced to had over a minimum of 15% of his wage for 18 years could mean the difference between being able to afford a mortgage or to have a family of his own when he is ready. It's not just a small blip in finances for a few months, its a financial commitment that he didn't want for many many years. [/quote]
If only there were a way that men could prevent the pregnancy they don't want in the first place, or they knew before that pregnancy could result from sex, leading to a child that they're required to contribute towards the support of for the next 18 years...... If only men had those options......
This is clearly a massive secret only kept by women and men have no idea that they don't have to have sex to survive or that contraception exists for them to use in their own right.

So on what grounds should consequence-free shagging be prioritised above those? I'm all ears.

This.

I don't know if it's been made worse by porn, but the assumption that everyone had the right to fuck without responsibility for the ultimate outcome of fucking (and should put the onus on the other person for effective contraception, which may fail even if they are responsible) is completely flawed, and at the root of this issue.

You can only do that at the expense of the child's right of support or the mothers right of bodily autonomy.

You can continue to insist that a child has a right to be financially supported by their parents, but it isn’t true.

It wouldn’t be at the expense of anything. At the point of the choice being made, there is no child to support and the mother is free to do what she wants with her body.

If only there were a way that men could prevent the pregnancy they don't want in the first place, or they knew before that pregnancy could result from sex, leading to a child that they're required to contribute towards the support of for the next 18 years......

If only women know this, then there would be no need for abortion clinics right?

Women equally don’t have to have sex and especially not with with a man who won’t wear a condom.

@FairyCakeWings

You can only do that at the expense of the child's right of support or the mothers right of bodily autonomy.

You can continue to insist that a child has a right to be financially supported by their parents, but it isn’t true.

It wouldn’t be at the expense of anything. At the point of the choice being made, there is no child to support and the mother is free to do what she wants with her body.

.... but then you have just cycled back to being happy with men happily shagging about with no consequences if you think that the decision to abort is solely down to the mother.

@FairyCakeWings

If only there were a way that men could prevent the pregnancy they don't want in the first place, or they knew before that pregnancy could result from sex, leading to a child that they're required to contribute towards the support of for the next 18 years......

If only women know this, then there would be no need for abortion clinics right?

Good lord above! I don't even know where to begin with this. I feel anything I say would be pointless though. Your logic is flawed and this comment takes the cake.

Yes let's do away with abortion clinics so all those women made pregnant through coercion or rape no longer have a safe option and are forced into continuing with a pregnancy that may have devastating consequences. And let's not forget the women who are forced into having an abortion by abusive men, let's leave them at the mercy of unsafe back-street hacks or that same abusive man who decides to beat the baby out of her because he wants consequence-free sex.

It wouldn’t be at the expense of anything.

That's bollocks and you know it. So men are allowed to father as many children as they like, wash their hands of them, and there's no adverse effects on the children, mothers or society?

Are you always this thick or is it just that you've dug yourself into this rabbit hole and now have to pretend to be 🤔

Those complaining it's so hard for the man- what about the woman on a single income! Doing all childcare and working!

I'm convinced those who are anti-responsibility are just fools who want to punish mothers because...?

@Rdsdadmum

My partner fell pregnant while she had the implant, so precautions were took but pregnancy still occurred - who's to blame here?

There are plenty of mothers out there who have left their child from birth and child has been raised by dad. I wouldn't be soo quick to pont the finger and judge these people, there are lots of different reasons and scenarios as to why this might happen. Perhaps abortion was too hard for that person didn't want to stop a life but wasn't ready for motherhood and knew that would be worse for the child. Should this person be labeled a dead beat or an arsehole? I don't believe so, so why should it be any different for a man?

Perhaps people are stuck in the past and believe that all dads are deadbeats because their old man wasn't around (mine wasn't) but that just isn't the case anymore. Times have changed but when it comes to fathers and their rights this has not changed very much at all and as fathers we are very much at the mercy of our baby mothers for contact and a general support network that should run both ways.

Women deliberately get pregnant to trap men (puncturing condoms, not taking their pill[this happened to me].) are the men who smelt a rat and moved on arseholes aswell?

I'm a father of two and am a massive part of my children's lives, however I don't judge people who aren't. My father was never around but I feel more fortunate that some of my friends whose father was around but awful because they didn't want to be there.

It's too easy to point and judge when you're stuck in your own little world without realising that there are soo many different scenarios to consider.

At the end of the day it should be a level playing field for both men and women, men have the choice to be there or not and women have the choice to keep or get rid, I don't feel anyone is in the wrong it balls down to what you want out of life and just because you had sex which everyone does shouldn't leave you at the mercy of someone

Hang on so your partner got pregnant while using the implant and someone else lied about taking the pill??

Are the 2 DC you have because of both those incidents?

Talk about bad luck.

I have the mirena coil implant. My DH and I track my cycle and even though the chances of pregnancy are extremely low...we either avoid "fertile" times and/or we use a condom.

Why didn't you use a condom in the times you mentioned? Doubling up like that would have prevented the pregnancy.