DH has suggested division of childcare/housework unfair...

[ooooopsididit]

Just that really!

DH works full time, from home until recently, but is now back in the office two days per week.

I am a SAHM of two nursery age children.

Both children are at nursery four half days and one full day per week.

DH and I split the morning get up and ready routine, and bedtime routines between us.

The housework is also split about 50/50, although I do more cooking and all laundry.

I also do all lunchtime pickups of DC.

For the complete picture I do have a little cleaning job of about four hours a week, but I could give that up if I wanted the extra time back.

I thought this was fine but DH his just said he thinks it's a bit unfair... I suspect he may be right.

AIBU to expect this to be fine
YABU to split this way as he works full time

@ooooopsididit is there any chance of you swapping so he is the stay at home parent and you go back to work? or you both go out to work part time and SAHP half time?

@BurntO

The childcare split sounds fine IMO, you both made babies and 50/50 for wake ups and bed time sound good, it’s important for kids to have both of their parents doing this and for all of you to have that time together regardless of work commitments.

I think you should be taking over more of the chores 100%. 50/50 isn’t fair.

I agree about parenting being 50:50, but it's also valuable for kids to see that everyone has responsibility for chores too, so I don't think she should do 100% either.

@ooooopsididit I don't think it matters about 'fairness'. I think it is wonderful that you are both pulling your weight equally with regards to caring for your family and your household (albeit you do the laundry and more cooking). Please do not change this, imo it is almost impossible to change back again.

I wonder where your dh is coming from on this. Does he think that these menial tasks shoud be yours? Is he looking for an easier life? Is he thinking that he would be laying in bed / sitting watching the TV while you do all the morning and evening tasks with the children. If you're putting the dc to bed, why would he not just have a quick hoover round? If he's putting the dc to bed, why would you not do the same?

If I see that the dishwasher needs to be emptied, I do it. So would my dh. If the sink is grubby I'd clean it. So would my dh. Neither of us would notice it and then leave it to the other person as their 'job'.

This is about supporting each other for the long term. There might be couple of years when there is imbalance but what is your life going to look like overall? There were years when I earned more than dh, there have been times when he earned more than me. But if you look at the long term, what are your joint plans?

I think the bigger question is about YOUR plans for the future. When dc go to school, what are your intentions? A return to work? a new career? an increase in hours in your current job? Or will you remain as SAHM?

If you plan to remain substantailly as SAHM, then maybe take on more of the responsibilities, but if you intend to work in the next couple of years then you should find another way to approach this. You could use your time to gain additional qualifications, or to volunteer and get experience.

Discuss what life might look like if you were both working - would you have a cleaner, would you have to pay for wrap around care? What is the cost and value of that?

@ooooopsididit

I'm asking if it's a fair division of housework and childcare between us, as he works full time and I'm a SAHM but we split everything 50/50.

He seems to think not. I hadn't really thought about it until he pointed it out.

It's not.

You have 4 half days and 1 full day to yourself ... you should be getting the bulk of the household chores (tidying, cleaning, laundry, cooking, mowing the lawn, etc) and shopping done during those hours to free up weekend time for both of you. You'd still have plenty of time to yourself.

Weekday evenings, most of the heavy lifting should already be done before he gets home, and bedtime routines and cleaning up after dinner should be shared.

Weekends, most of the heavy lifting should still be under control, so sharing childcare, alternating lie ins, and cooking shared.

I've had periods of being a SAHM - currently am now (although trying to establish own freelance business). We have 3 children - 2 in school and 1 who has just started with a Childminder 2.5 days a week. So similar situation. Tbh my aim is to get everything done so DH doesn't have to do anything. Although he has 2 jobs so has much less time here. I don't want us to be rushing around doing chores when we are together and DH works hard and is tired. I plan my time carefully so I can set up my business and get everything done.

Tbh I think YABU. However I do know how the says fly by, particularly when you do a lunchtime pick up and somehow you seem to lose time, so it can feel like you are very busy and no time to fit it all in. Sit down and come up with a robust routine which allows you to fit everything in. I think DH is right.

Some may think it’s unfair but as an ex sahm we always split housrwork 50:50 except for the actual care of the children. He also did drop off every day and I did pick up.

This has made going back to work 1000% easier than friends who took on far more of the childcare and housework, they are now trapped because the system works for their OH and they can’t go back to work without their OH taking more responsibility (which they wont).

So personally I think women make it hard for themselves when they take on too more than 50% housework and childcare outside of their OHs working hours.

@MissMaple82

Sounds fair to me. Childcare IS a job!!

It's not really a job for you when your children are in nursery for one full day and 4 half days a week though, is it? That's just free time to yourself, whilst nursery do the childcare.

Yes OP, its really not a fair split. You must know that.

I work 16 hours a week, i do all drop offs and pick ups 4 days a week and have one child at home full time. To be honest, theres not that much for dp to do because by the time he's finished work, I've already done it all. We split mornings and bedtimes and everything is 50/50 on week ends. I do 90% of the cooking but thats probably because i enjoy it

[quote mathanxiety]@TrufflesAndToast, one of the really interesting things about lockdown and wfh, according to 90 percent of my friends who worked from home, was the amount of work they managed to get done daily when they didn't have colleagues around them all the time to gab with.

You would be surprised how all the chit chat adds up and how much inefficiency is built into the office workday.[/quote]
That’s a bit patronising! I and many others work on a time billed basis. The more work we get done in our hours the better - but we don’t have a set list of tasks that once they’re done we can stop and put the washing on. We work our hours (or more) and bill that time to clients. Working from home can make us more efficient but it doesn’t always mean we work fewer hours.

I agree with @venusandmars that as a team it's not really about divying up and making everything exactly 50:50. Would he leave the bathroom a mess after having used it just because he thinks he's reached his percentage of jobs? Would you?
As a partnership life is about helping out and pitching in. It definitely should not be you doing it all just because he works full time. What kind of an example would that be for your DC? How long does he see that carrying on for before you start resenting cleaning up after him.
Maybe have a sit down and discuss what he thinks should be happening and take it from there. I'd say 70:30 or even 80:20 but him still doing wake ups and bedtimes with you

You should both end up with the same amount of downtime.

When I was a SAHM to a very high needs child, that meant DH did almost 100% of the cleaning and cooking in addition to working full-time and he still had more down time than me (and yes we tried having him take over some of the child duties it turns out autistic babies are extremely stubborn). Our original life plan had involved me caring for our child while cooking meals and caring for our home with the remaining minimal evening and weekend chores split 50:50. Our goal never changed, we wanted to split the work evenly, but the definition of even has to be dynamic. As children grow and change, the division of labor needs to change as well. We now have a largely self-sufficient teenager. DH doesn’t need to do all the chores anymore. We keep meeting and reevaluating our split of labor. I work now so it’s a different dynamic, plus the tasks are different, but we still just have to keep meeting and working on it. It’s never settled. I’m not sure it ever will be. Once dd leaves the nest it might get pretty stable, but there will still be life stages and events that make us need to go over the schedule again.

@venusandmars perfectly put

@ooooopsididit.
I think you and your dh should agree what you’re both happy with.
What’s fair depends on each person’s pov .

I work 7.5 hours a week and do 99% of chores and dc related stuff.I think you are being a bit U

Yes @VirginMedium

I also know they’re not with you on the way home, or the way back to collect them… By your strange definitions that definitely counts as me time!

OP the fact that your husband’s salary is paying for the nursery time makes it even more bonkers that you expect to have that downtime to yourself instead of doing domestic work. You are really rude and disrespectful about what going to work means. If you think it’s all swanning off for lunch then why don’t you go and get a full time job and see how much downtime you get then.

If you’re as rude to your husband about his work, which is funding your life, I’m not surprised he’s pissed off with you. Honestly with every post you sound more lazy and unreasonable.

I think you need to do a bigger chunk of house work as anyone does who is at home when the others at work .
Apart from that sound a good set up he get's his drink after work you carve a few hours out to yourself when you have no kids

Childcare yes because he’s their parent too, except for him getting up and ready with them in the mornings! He’s got to go to work!

Housework no

I think it depends on how the housework time is split to be honest.

I was a SAHM. DS went to pre-school/nursery for half a day, three times a week from two and a half years old. Until then, like most SAHP, he was with me all day - whether that was parent and toddler groups or going to the supermarket.

From my own experience, before he went to pre-school, I would get DS ready in the morning as DH was out of the door at 6am. So breakfast, then out to a kiddie club, shops/park or playing at home. I'd do housework in fits and starts, depending on what needed to be done and what DS was behaving like. If he was having a bad day (teething, bad night's sleep, or just particularly clingy), not much got done quickly when he was a baby.

Most of the time the housework would be finished (probably not to the highest standards but you could see the floor and the bathroom/kitchen was clean) when DH got in, sometimes not if I'd had a rough day with DS. DH would take over playing DS whilst I ran a hoover round or he'd do it if I was tied up with a nappy change or feed or getting dinner finished. Everyone has days when work/the kids conspire to stop stuff getting done.

I'd do the cooking, DH would take DS for a bath whilst I did that until DS was eating with us. DH saw that as his male bonding time - as he put it - I think it was just an excuse to splash about in the bath. Then we'd eat and he'd wash up as we'd always split cooking/washing up between us - still do in fact. Bedtime was split to whoever had the energy for 'just one more story'! But both of us would make sure we did goodnight cuddles. Everything stopped for cuddles with DS.

But at weekends the housework was split 50-50. If a hoover round was needed and some ironing needed doing, one would do the hoover, the other the ironing. If a load of washing needed to be put on, whoever wasn't tied up would do it.

The only thing that changed when DS went to pre-school was that the house looked a little cleaner as I had time to do things properly rather than fitting it around DS. Mind you, by the time he got in I may as well not have bothered as we'd build train sets, put cushions out for jumping on or paint on the kitchen floor. And, yes, if I could fit in a cup of tea whilst watching a TV programme before I picked DS up, then I would. If what needed to be done had been done then any left over time was mine.

@LightfoldEngines

Childcare yes because he’s their parent too, except for him getting up and ready with them in the mornings! He’s got to go to work!

Housework no

But OP has already said DH does that because its the only time he spends with the DC.

Yabu. You're a sahm to children who are gone a lot. My DS is 19 months old, at home full time and I still do most of the housework. Splitting the childcare 50/50 is fine imo as that's also about the children having time with their dad.

It seems like you have 1.5 days but in that time you have to do all family admin, all laundry, shopping and bulk of the cooking. Once that is taken into account you probably have between a half day to one full day to yourself.

That doesn't seem that unfair to me.

When your DH is going for drinks with friends/colleagues, that probably amounts to his half day on his own. So, at most, you're 'discussing' a few hours of difference.

ooooopsididit

It's not a fair division of labour especially as it sounds like DH is paying for nursery when you're there to look after them.

It sounds like when he was wfh the nursery drop off was OK but now he is factoring in travel time to work maybe it's more stressful.

I don't know what job you did prior to children but it sounds different from my experience of being at work. Teaching is more demanding than being home with my own when they were toddlers. You can do lots of house jobs when they're with you - food shop, cleaning, washing can all be done while keeping an eye on them.

It might make more sense to put them both in at same time so you have more time child free.

Also if working is so easy why don't you go back to the office?

@AnnesBrokenSlate

It seems like you have 1.5 days but in that time you have to do all family admin, all laundry, shopping and bulk of the cooking. Once that is taken into account you probably have between a half day to one full day to yourself.

That doesn't seem that unfair to me.

When your DH is going for drinks with friends/colleagues, that probably amounts to his half day on his own. So, at most, you're 'discussing' a few hours of difference.

Exactly! We could definitely tweak some areas but I'm glad he has shared what he thinks.

Also I'm glad you understood what I was trying to explain in termS of our children's nursery hours!

They aren't both there four full days or whatever else has been mentioned.

Each child probably does about 15 hours and most over those hours are at the same time!

You have 4 mornings and a full day at home with no dc, of those 4 hours are working. There is no reason that all the housework can't be done in that time, if I was your dh I would also consider it unfair.

YABU I don't think the arrangement is fair on your DH. If he works outside the home full time then surely your job is all the housework with childcare roughly 50/50