To wonder is it worth it??

[Namechangeroo1234]

DH and I just had a bust up over what's best.

We have 2 DC. We've explored them going into private education. We can't afford it alone. I applied for bursary. Got a small one, very grateful but we'd still struggle. Parents have offered to release funds from their house. Which does make it doable. However we'd be tight for cash for next 12 years. We wouldn't be able to save/holiday etc.

We only have 1 secondary school nearby, and it's really got a bad rep, bullying is rife and the teachers struggle. somehow they've dodged Ofsted for last 8 years, apparently because the became an academy?!?

Our choice - sacrifice a financially comfortable life for a while- and give children a good educational experience.

Or live comfortably, afford the children experiences outside of school, but they attend an awful school.

DH thinks private. Aibu to wonder if it's really worth it?

[quote ddshocker]@TatianaBis which then leads me to think will the DS also stay in farming (which they usually do!)...at which point I would think private education would be wasted!
[/quote]
Yes you're along the right lines with farming!
Whilst that's common that the children would inherit, it's actually me that's the farmer not DH!! - it's certainly not the case that we would expect either of our children to take on the farming side, especially given neither are keen, they love it here but they have different aspirations, its totally their choice.

Thank you for constructive replies, there's been some interesting perspectives giving us food for thought!

That makes sense.

If your parents are considering taking an equity release mortgage - bear in mind the roll up interest is compound and will eat into their equity. Plus if they need to move house at a later point (however much they want to stay put, the house may become unsuitable for their needs later on) they will have to pay a redemption fee to redeem the mortgage.

In 12 years the original loan could easily double.

You can get equity release mortgages where you pay the interest annually but they would need the funds for that on top of the loan.

I really really don't approve of private education but that said. Remember there's more to private education than school fees,
Trips
Uniforms (usually v expensive)
Sporting equipment

But most importantly the way your kids will feel.
My friend was in a similiar position to you & sent her daughter to private school. The differences in class, affordability, presents, lifestyle was overwhelming. Her daughter 'felt' poor. Her parents just couldn't afford the expecnsivr school trips. Think £2k on a ski trip & all the gear to go.

It made her quite withdrawn, embarrassed to have friends over etc basically affecting her self esteem. Remember this is an 11/12 year old, so of course not rational, but it's how she felt.
she removed her mid second year.
Best thing ever.

Please can I just reiterate having had DC at private schools and having worked in a Prep School when making your decision to ignore all the comments about your children being the poorest children at private school. It really isn't that significant. Just like at a state school there are children whose family are very affluent and there are children with nothing it isn't a big deal. Where I worked there were children on full scholarships and others whose family had a butler, nannies etc. It really didn't matter. The parents who owned quite serious country houses bought uniform from the second hand shop.

@user1497787065

Please can I just reiterate having had DC at private schools and having worked in a Prep School when making your decision to ignore all the comments about your children being the poorest children at private school. It really isn't that significant. Just like at a state school there are children whose family are very affluent and there are children with nothing it isn't a big deal. Where I worked there were children on full scholarships and others whose family had a butler, nannies etc. It really didn't matter. The parents who owned quite serious country houses bought uniform from the second hand shop.

Can I iterate to ignore this message. Every single school is different. This is just one persons opinion of one school. Read all views, take an overall view & make your own decision. Every single opinion given is just that, an opinion, anecdotal. Some by personal experience. One staff member of one school is certainly not qualified to tell you to ignore other opinions or thoughts. 🙄

Fwiw my opinion is to try state school, safe in the knowledge that if it isn't working for your little one - you can move them to independentS

It's hard to go the other way.

I have worked in education all my life (state and private schools). All my children went to state schools and have done well in their lives - careers, own homes etc.

All the research indicates that the influence of school on a child is only around 15-20%. This is why it is so difficult to effect change in children whose home circumstances are chaotic or dangerous. However much you support them at school, their world outside has a greater influence. This works both ways OP. Your local school may not be the best but it's likely your children will still thrive there with the support of their family and community.

I also think that it's a mistake for your parents to release money from their home to pay private school fees. That will seriously disadvantage them later in life. And what if your children go through private school, you all scrimp and save for years, then your kids decide they want to become an actor or a train driver or a ski instructor? Will you all still feel that it was worth the sacrifice?

If you can honestly say that you will allow your children to be who they want to be despite all the 'sacrifices' then perhaps go ahead but remember, it's their lives and their decisions and they won't 'owe' you for all the things you've denied yourselves.

My aim had been to go private for secondary school, but it wasn’t viable. Having thought and thought about it, it seemed better to go for the state option and have money for extra activities, treats and some holidays, with the option for tutors if necessary.

Obviously, I don’t know what the difference would be had they gone to a private school, but they have managed higher education and had some good experiences too.

What would be really difficult, in my view, would be to go private and thrn have to change to state, if it became unmanageable.

I'd go private. I went to a rough state secondary and I did well academically and now have a good job, but I was like a fish out of water at school and I wasn't happy there.

My sister wanted to be a doctor (she's very bright and had an offer to study medicine at a top uni) but fell in with the wrong crowd at school, messed up her A levels and ended up being a nurse. Don't get me wrong, being a nurse is a difficult and important job, but I am 100% sure that if she had gone to a private school she would be a doctor now.

(And good on your parents for helping out, that's so kind.)

Definitely not worth it if you’re going to have to give up living a life for the next 12 years!

Can the grandparents pay fees directly? There maybe tax advantages to this as well a number of dc at private school are paid for at least in part by grandparents..
Its very common however you need to make sure there's enough for all the years...
Or make sure they are maximising their gift allowances..think its 3k a year to an individual
If they have that much money they can cover the costs of any care they should be able to get financial advice as the best way to do it..
Our school fees went up every year so factor that in ...at least 5%
With child with sen it depends on the private school how they are with managing that....

I'd look at moving to an area with a good secondary school that I wouldn't need to limit myself for over a decade for them to attend

@Namechangeroo1234

Unfortunately - moving isn't an option. We're quite rural, and love where we are. I just wish I had a crystal ball- I'd happily make the sacrifice if I knew it would genuinely benifit.

Private school won't do bursary and sibling discount for us.

Moving IS an option, you just don't want to

@LadyFyck moving is NOT an option. OP has already explained that house is tied to employment. Don't make assumptions without rtft

We were in a similar situation and have decided to put ours through private for secondary. It will require massive sacrifices on our part and we will have very little in the way of disposable income for the next 10 years. For me it feels a sacrifice worth making. Lots of my friends, who despite having much higher household incomes than us, have opted for local comps.
I spoke to some friends who I knew weren’t from wealthy backgrounds but who attended private schools, all of them were very grateful to their parents and none seemed to mine being the ‘poor’ ones.

Bullying is rife in every secondary school - some private schools can be the worst offenders. A colleague scrimped and saved to send her DD to private school and she was horribly bullied as it was apparent that her family weren't rich. Certainly behaviour in class was generally excellent, but outside of it, the children were almost feral at times. And there was way more drugs than at our local secondary as the kids could afford it and a lot were children of high flyers who basically used money as a way of not having to be there for their DC. I am aware that this is only some parents/DC but my point is, private schools are not Nirvana.

@user1497787065

Please can I just reiterate having had DC at private schools and having worked in a Prep School when making your decision to ignore all the comments about your children being the poorest children at private school. It really isn't that significant. Just like at a state school there are children whose family are very affluent and there are children with nothing it isn't a big deal. Where I worked there were children on full scholarships and others whose family had a butler, nannies etc. It really didn't matter. The parents who owned quite serious country houses bought uniform from the second hand shop.

I agree. Many of the comments about private schools here are not from people who actually went.

I went to independent school as did all my siblings, as do our kids. One sibling has transferred their kids from private boarding to state boarding due to Covid, but it’s a rural grammar so it’s fairly similarly to their private school in terms of intake.

There is a wide range of incomes in all private schools even today. I’ve not personally seen students targeted on the basis of wealth. There’s types of bullying everywhere.

I wouldn’t personally pay for private school at the expense of my parents’ equity though, even if they offered.

If they go down that road it would be more judicious financially for the parents to downsize now and release equity that way than getting themselves into a contract that will roll up until they die unless they buy themselves out.

I would stick with state schools, even with parents remortgaging you’ll still be stretched. You’d have years of it.

Private does not mean better, just remember that when making your decision. If you have scope to change career/ up your earnings to make it more viable, do it. Your kids will feel pressured and beholden to grandparents and you- do you really want to put that burden on them? The extra curricular stuff , party invites and socialising brings another layer of cost and expectation and possibly travelling miles from home away to collect and drop off

I think you need to be realistic about what the outlay will actually be going private as it's not just fees, the uniforms are expensive and extensive (all branded sports kit, bags etc), extracurricular activities are often compulsory and charged extra, you often have to purchase your own text books, there will no doubt be fancy school trips etc etc. It would be worse if you sent them private and had to remove them because you can't actually afford it.
Also, some private schools aren't that good academically.

Private doesn’t necessarily mean better but it does mean selective and more focused students.

The friends of mine who went to comprehensives - one was very badly bullied for being studious and they all felt relatively isolated as academic engagement and intellectual interest were not the norm.

Also, some private schools aren't that good academically.

Some are shite. I would choose a good grammar over a lazy private school any day.

We have considered all the additional costs in our forecasts etc. And we're pretty happy with the choice of school in terms of academic achievement but also all round character development, the real core of what the school values, and it does align with ours.
However, just now- I think we're going to try the state, really give it our best shot.

@Namechangeroo1234 - excellent - & I think if from 11 you will be able to tell if the school is working within a year or two - so much before public exams.

I do agree with others that there are private and private schools. Not all of them are Marlborough / Eton etc, Some can be not great in the sense of teaching etc - relative's experience. That said - I do think being the "poor person" can be a bit of a red herring. You don't have to go on all trips which many don't - i.e. the expensive ones and most schools have e.g. uniform sales which many parents make use of .

That said - I do think the right answer is to start them at the local school and see how they get on - and yes there can be tutoring - extra curricular stuff . I know not always popular here. I think using up so much money when you haven't experienced the place is a wee bit early ( my opinion) You have at least a couple of years to decide if you want / need to move them & as a PP said that is 2 year's fees you don't have to pay.

All best to you and DCs

I would go and have a chat with the teachers of the state school.
It may not be as bad as portrayed and you could always invest in extra private tuition if necessary.

@BasiliskStare Thanks!