AIBU with my 13 year old daughter?

[GeekyGirl42]

Had to work late one evening this week and daughter said she wanted this evening. So I worked whilst she got on with her evening (I WFH). She had a shower, and came to say goodnight.

I finised work around midnight; when that happens I like to unwind in the shower... Except this evening after 30s it went freezing cold. I squealed. My daughter came out of her room and shouted at me for waking her up.

I told her (this is not the first time by any means that this has happened) that she must remember to think about whether she's used the hot water up, because I don't mind as long as I know to put it on again. It is ridiculous that this would be necessary, as is just the two of us and the tank is massive.

She went bonkers.... Threw stuff around the room and shouted at me. I told her that if she was going to keep arguing with me about whether she should have been more mindful about the hot water, then she can choose between taking another shower now or loosing her phone for a day.

She went to take another shower and when she realised how cold it was she said she couldn't do it. So I told her to be more thoughtful next time, and that tomorrow she will have to have her shower at the gym after her tennis lesson.

She went nuts. She hates me and wants to live with her Dad. I've sent her a text saying that I am hurt by her unkind words and that there are consequences for saying things like that to people... In this instance, she'll find that I've taken back half of this week's allowance.

AIBU? I am so sick of the shower being cold. And she's been really horrid the last few days... I feel like she's walking all over me

She had a shower then came to say goodnight .....

Would this have been a good point to say "If you've used all the hot water please switch it on for me as I want a late shower"?

This sounds rather cruel and demeaning to me. Your dd uses all the hot water, you scream and wake her up after midnight and then make her take a cold shower as punishment (or lose her phone for a day). I'm not surprised she was angry. She is 13 and will be distracted and forgetful. You are the grown up.

Take a freezing shower or lose your phone?! Really ? Why did you make your daughter take a freezing shower ?!

@Nschotschi

At that age my daughter's standard response was "Sorry, I forgot". And as annoying as this is, it's perfectly normal. Their brain is literally too busy at this age. You can either start to put the hot water back on after your DS had a shower or swap, so that you have a shower first. Being rude to you needs to be addressed though. She needs to learn to treat you with some respect. The way it worked for us is when my kids started being mean I calmly told them to take a breather and rethink what they were going to say. Then I left the room. Usually they came to me a short time after and were able to express their feelings in a much calmer way. As a rule in our house, pocket money was never used as means of punishment. They got a set amount each month. They didn't have to earn it and it wasn't taken away. Good luck! It does get better!

I don't suppose you put your DC's in a cold shower as punishment though. It does get better but I think in this instance OP has to stop screaming and teach her daughter how to show respect by showing some herself.

and then make her take a cold shower
Why did you make your daughter take a freezing shower ?!
I don't agree with how op acted but not let's pretend she forced a naked teenager under a freezing blast of water. She gave an ill advised ultimatum, daughter put her hand under the cold water seemingly fully dressed and said it was cold.

@SpidersAreShitheads think you’re missing out the bit “I shouted at my mum for daring to wake me up and then threw a massive tantrum and proceeded to throw things around the house…that’ll teach her to dare express her own needs and feelings again!”

The OP's daughter was being massively rude and downright aggressive and a tired mum lost it and chose to show her a direct consequence (i.e. try that cold shower for yourself).

So it’s ok that the adult with balanced hormones ‘lost it’ but not the 13 year old child with out of control hormones?

Surely it’s up to the adult to model good behaviour?
How can a 13 year old be expected to be rational and calm when her parent isn’t?

It’s not fair that a child is expected to act more mature than an adult.

In this situation OP was 100% in the wrong.
That doesn’t mean she’s a terrible parent or that she’s raised her DD to be awful - it just means she should examine her parenting choices to see if she can improve them, like we should all be doing.

Urgh OP you do sound like my mother…

Hi, OP -

I have a fairly child-centred outlook but did not expect the thread to go this way. I sympathise with you both. I am mainly here to join @DrSbaitso in referring you back to the great post from @AlexaShutUp and also to highlight the thoughts from @Nietzschethehiker.

But unless your DD has special needs you haven’t mentioned I also think 13 is old enough to be responsible for leaving the next person a reasonable amount of hot water.

Maybe she would like to help you find a solution instead of having one imposed?

If not and given money is tight, at this stage I would be warning her of the need to divert ££ from tennis lessons etc for that electric shower. But only if true.

the 13 year old was wakened by her mother, she was already awake

Yes. At midnight. By her screaming. Which, I’m going to guess wasn’t just a cold squeal.

But unless your DD has special needs you haven’t mentioned I also think 13 is old enough to be responsible for leaving the next person a reasonable amount of hot water

And as a 13 year old, will still make mistakes.

The OP's daughter was being massively rude and downright aggressive and a tired mum lost it and chose to show her a direct consequence (i.e. try that cold shower for yourself).

Nobody is denying that the Ops daughter was being a bit of a brat when it came to throw in shower gel bottles around… But essentially forcing her to stand in the cold shower as punishment isn't on. Yes she was given a choice, but what teenager is going to choose to lose their phone. Punishment should never be physical. The daughter is a 13-year-old girl, the Op is a grown woman.

Would this have been a good point to say "If you've used all the hot water please switch it on for me as I want a late shower"?

Yep. This is how it works in your house.

@SpidersAreShitheads

Alternative perspective:

"Mum was working tonight so I spent evening doing my own thing, had a shower and went to bed. Just as I was dozing off, Mum screamed in the shower and it nearly gave me a heart attack! I woke up in a right panic and wondered what the hell was going on, until I realised that Mum was having one of her tempers again about the shower. She’s always having showers late and banging around in the bathroom when I’m trying to sleep. When I’ve got school the next day, it’s really disruptive.

I was a bit grumpy but when I went in the bathroom she moaned at me again about not telling her to put the hot water back on. But I really don’t think I took a long shower, so I’m not really sure when the hot water needs to go back on or not? It didn’t feel like a long shower to me, and mum is always saying there’s enough hot water for four people to shower so I don’t really know why the shower went cold so quickly for her.

I tried to argue my point but mum was really annoyed, and in the end she said that because I answered her back, I either had to have a freezing cold shower now or lose my phone for a day. Obviously I chose the shower. However, it was so cold I couldn’t stand it and had to get back out again. It seemed like a really mean punishment and way OTT. Who makes their child stand in a freezing cold shower as a punishment anyway?

Mum was very patronising at this point and then told me that I couldn’t have a shower in my own home tomorrow! Apparently I now have to shower at the gym! How is that even fair - it’s my home too?!

I’ve had enough of her moaning and her moods so I told her that I want to live with dad. I thought that might make her realise how unhappy all of this is making me, but in typical mum style, all that did was prompt a text making it all about her, as per usual. She won’t talk to me about how I’m feeling or why I want to live with dad, and instead is just docking me half my pocket money.

I shouldn’t have reacted the way I did but she is literally punishing me for expressing my feelings. Apparently telling her that I’m unhappy living with her “has consequences”.

I’m so fed up and she won’t even take me seriously. I’m going to talk to dad as soon as I can. "

You knew she'd had a shower. You say she keeps using all the hot water - but chose not to put it back on for a blast to make sure there was enough for you. That's on you.

She was moody but you handled it badly, and now you're docking her pocket money because she said she wants to live with her dad. Childish and spiteful. You're not coming out of this well at all.

She's only 13. Unless you learn how to communicate better, these are going to be long and painful teen years for you both.

Yup

@Quackpot

You woke her up, no wonder she was cranky. She's a new teen full of raging hormones. You should have apologised. What's your excuse?

Cold shower won't kill you.

A warm shower that goes cold is very different to “A cold shower” from the get go.

Being a teenager is no excuse for throwing stuff about and being ill mannered.

That’s just bratty.

Was just wondering OP is working a 16 hour day a regular thing? You say you work full time so is this late finish on top of your usual hours? Do your work regularly expect you to work to midnight? No wonder you were tired and maybe didn't react in the calmest of ways. Being a single parent and dealing with a heavy workload is hugely stressful not to mention you say your mum has dementia too. That's an awful lot of pressure on anyone. I wonder if there's anything you can do to ease the work situation?

Being the parent of a 13 year old can be hard. It sounds like the situation escalated and as the parent you need to do the thinking about how you can alter your approach while making it clear things like throwing shower gel bottles are unacceptable. Have a look at authoritative parenting - warm, sensitive, sets limits and boundaries. Easier said than done when you're exhausted, I know. The point of de-escalation was when she stormed in and started shouting. That doesn't mean you can't have a calm conversation about the hot water, or have consequences if she forgets to let you know it needs to go on, but midnight when you're exhausted wasn't the time.

Your DD only spends 6 weeks a year with her father, which is not a lot at all. It must be hard for both of you.

We all struggle and get it wrong sometimes. There are things you can do to help yourself and her. If you can reduce some of the work pressure on you, I think you'd have more energy and feel more robust to be able to put some strategies in place.

[quote LuckySantangelo35]@SpidersAreShitheads think you’re missing out the bit “I shouted at my mum for daring to wake me up and then threw a massive tantrum and proceeded to throw things around the house…that’ll teach her to dare express her own needs and feelings again!”[/quote]
To be fair, I alluded to the fact that the teen was grumpy.

Also, I am struggling to believe that the 13 yr old "threw stuff around the room". The OP gave her the option of either losing her phone or having a freezing cold shower for not leaving any hot water, and docked her half her pocket money for daring to say she was miserable and would rather live with her dad. Given the dramatics of the OP, I find it a bit hard to swallow that she passively allowed her teen to chuck stuff around without any "consequences".

But that aside, let's be clear about this - no one on this thread has suggested that the 13 yr old has behaved well. Whether she was just dozing, was trying to go to sleep or was actually asleep, it's not much fun being woken or startled by someone screeching in the bathroom. The teen acted in a predictably teen way, and of course there needs to be communication that stropping around and grumping isn't the way to handle things.

But given the OP's behaviour, she's hardly got a good role model to demonstrate it, has she?

And while we're on the subject of waking people up, if the DD had woken the OP up by having a shower at midnight, I very much doubt you'd be saying that was OK. It's home for BOTH of them, and it sounds like it's lacking in consideration. The difference is the OP is supposed to be the grownup, while the 13 yr old is learning how to mature, and will screw up while they're figuring things out.

Would I put up with my 12yr old DD grumping and shouting at me? Absolutely not. Zero chance. But then I wouldn't suggest an ice cold shower at midnight as a punishment, nor would I deduct pocket money if she dared to tell me she was unhappy.

We actually had a really shitty situation with my DD the other week where she'd lied to me. I was so upset and disappointed. Really pissed off actually. And hurt, truth be told. We talked it out. No raised voices. What my DD did was far worse than forget to put the water on. There have been consequences. DD has lost access to something she prized above everything else. I'm not a walkover but I don't think any part of how OP handled this is OK. Raised voices just leads to more raised voices and ridiculous threats. Punishing the child because they dared to say they were upset. It's OK for the OP to tell the teen that what she said made her feel sad. Not OK for her to deduct pocket money because it made her feel sad.

Teens are complicated years and our children need us to be dependable and solid while they're wavering their way through life. If the OP's DD can't remember to put the water on, or can't work out what's a long shower and what isn't, the OP needs to come up with ways to help her, not just come up with harsh and punitive measures that really don't help at all.

@Justilou1

Fuuuuuuuuuck!!! Mum worked 16hr day. Place of work is irrelevant. It’s a long fucking day for anyone. Got in shower at midnight and it went cold. Mum made a noise. (Who wouldn’t?) Kid came into the bathroom. *Nobody has asked about this bit, and as I have three teenagers who also take hundred year showers, I can see that this might be an important point… Why did she?

13 year old kid WHO IS AWAKE AT MIDNIGHT and angry and upset at the world because of things happening in both of their lives uses this noise as an excuse to storm in and unload. (This is what teenagers do.)
13 year old has massive emotional outburst. Instead of admitting that she is angry and upset at everything going on in her life, she blamed the noise her mother made for “waking her up.” (Which she admits later was not true as she was already awake.)
Mum (who is knackered and freezing) is angry about the water being cold, and then also about the behaviour so attempts to reign teen in and demand accountability by offering two choices… 1) Loss of phone or 2) (undoubtedly said in sarcastic voice… we’ve all done it.) That kid could get in the shower and see how she likes it.

**Nobody forced the kid into the shower. She stood there and said it was too cold so she wouldn’t do it.

Kid - who does not want to lose her phone -throws a tantrum of epic proportion and throws the most hurtful threat that she can think of at her mother… That she wants to live with her Dad.

Mum sends a text explaining that she has found this hurtful, and that there will be consequences for her behaviour.

Later, Mum and Daughter discuss what happened and daughter admits that she was awake and already upset. Mum discovers that daughter is missing her father since the recent separation, and finds the new custody arrangement difficult and stressful. Child resents the time between visits and the inability to see friends during breaks.

Mum and DD talked it out. Obviously this was made possible because Mum is DD’s safe person.

Mum is very sensitive and understanding about this. Mum is also working 16hr days, juggling her child’s needs, a mother with dementia and newly separated.

Glad everyone else is a perfect parent all the time. Your medals are in the mail.

This.^^ Poor OP, you've had your arse handed back to you in spades by all the perfect parents on this board. I hope you and DD are able to get back on track today. We all have moments where things don't go according to plan, despite being adults, we are only human after all (you wouldn't think so from all the perfect parents on MN though!)

YABU - just put the water heating on if someone is having an evening shower and you want it later. As for squealing and waking her up - why? Of course she is grouchy is woken up - then you shouted at her. Just test the water before you get in then no silly squealing.

Would you be happy to repeat in front of her teacher that you made her get a cold shower at midnight?

Agreed, @BoredZelda, that not only do we all make mistakes but children including teenagers have a right to a high level of patience from their parents.

But that level is not infinite and the OP says clearly that this is a long-standing problem

JFC people. The kid was still awake. She only put her hand in the water, delcared it too cold and declined to shower.

For me? I'd be perfectly happy to say to anyone that me and my daughter had had a senseless barney in which she threw stuff round the bathroom and in response and in a flare of temper i offered her the most ridiculous choice of punishment.

And as i said upthread: parents and kids should regularly re-evaluate their relationships in terms of what each expects of the other in an age-appropriate way.

For OP and her DD it might go like: OP says sorry for the daft punishment she offered and that DD was quite right not to get in a cold shower. And that taking half the allowance was wrong and give it back.
And DD might say sorry for forgetting yet again to put the water on and sorry for overreacting and chucking stuff around the bathroom.
And then they talk about what it is that was really disturbing the DD (turns out it's half-term stress) and should they approach her father to rethink how contact with him goes.

No drama.

Who doesn't check the shower temperature before getting in? Even your daughter tried it before stepping in when it was cold, so why didn't you? I'm also of the camp that thinks running a shower at midnight is unfair when there's someone in bed presumably asleep (although you say she wasn't). It's all just a bit strange and OP sounds like she's taking her stress out on the daughter because 'life is crazy'.

@Brefugee

JFC people. The kid was still awake. She only put her hand in the water, delcared it too cold and declined to shower.

For me? I'd be perfectly happy to say to anyone that me and my daughter had had a senseless barney in which she threw stuff round the bathroom and in response and in a flare of temper i offered her the most ridiculous choice of punishment.

And as i said upthread: parents and kids should regularly re-evaluate their relationships in terms of what each expects of the other in an age-appropriate way.

For OP and her DD it might go like: OP says sorry for the daft punishment she offered and that DD was quite right not to get in a cold shower. And that taking half the allowance was wrong and give it back.
And DD might say sorry for forgetting yet again to put the water on and sorry for overreacting and chucking stuff around the bathroom.
And then they talk about what it is that was really disturbing the DD (turns out it's half-term stress) and should they approach her father to rethink how contact with him goes.

No drama.

This is very sensible.

and all this talk about OP being borderline abusive is daft

YANBU at all. Some of these responses are ridiculous and clearly from people who have never had to deal with a selfish teen. OR they are parents to the kind of entitled, rude, selfish children that I see in school every day. They're just too blind to see it.