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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

What to think! Guy I am dating told me something?

550 replies

Musinglife11 · 17/02/2022 19:03

Went on a third date with a guy. He is nice and we connect well. I just felt comfortable around him.

He told me a few years back he was arrested and investigated for attempted rape. He was accused by an ex as revenge. He was investigated for 6 months, but charges dropped ( no further evidence?). He said it tore his life apart as he couldn’t work and nearly suffered a breakdown.

Said it was a revenge accusation. It didn't happen, but he wanted to be honest. He showed me emails from the police saying no further evidence. He said she got investigated for false allegations but police decided not to charge.

I spoke to a friend who is a police detective and he said it will most likely be false as it was investigated very quickly as these things can take up to a year or more.

How would you feel being told this? I am undecided as he seems really nice and was broken telling me. But it has made me slow things down, as it was very serious allegation that got investigated!

OP posts:
Feedingthebirds1 · 17/02/2022 23:48

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ChameFangeNail · 17/02/2022 23:48

Why did he even tell you OP? Three dates is very early to be getting into that kind of past history. I can’t imagine why he put it front and centre of conversation so early on in your dating unless he was testing boundaries and/or ‘getting ahead of the story’ with his own version.

The steak facts are that statistically he is much more likely to have raped his ex and swerved the charges because only about 3% of reported rapes actually result in charges brought and, of that 3%, less than 1% result in a conviction.

If he was genuinely innocent and nothing came of it he need not mention it at all as it’s a non-event, no? Just a nasty episode that’s not worth dwelling much on.

MrsBerthaRochester · 17/02/2022 23:49

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Lunar27 · 17/02/2022 23:50

@Musinglife11

Lots of replies and conflicting information. Still undecided.
As a man, I've read enough to be horrified by the underreporting of rapes and the woeful conviction ratio. Given this, statistics would suggest that the best course of action would not be to walk but run away as fast as you can.

He might be innocent and your perseverance could be rewarded but now you know, do you want to wait and possibly find out or experience the worst of what this man has to offer?. It wouldn't be your fault but the potential trauma would be devastating.

cuno · 17/02/2022 23:51

@saraclara

Why bring emotions and biases into it by making it about "your son and daughter", you really want me to trip up don't you?

No, I'm saying that because in all the talk about relative numbers, a lot of people are losing sight of the fact that we're talking about real people. Both male and female victims are individuals, not featureless members of a herd. A life ruined, either by rape or by a false accusation of it, is no more or less ruined because of the numbers of others in a similar position.

No I don't lose sight of this at all because I know what most men are capable of and what they do to us. Far more women are having their lives ruined by these men than the minuscule number of men who are falsely accused of rape. And the damage to a rape victim is worse. Men get away with rape all the time even when rightly accused, and they carry on with their merry lives most of the time without consequence. I find it telling though that if you had a male relative accused of rape you would assume he was falsely accused. I hope you aren't responsible for safeguarding any children, because I find your attitude a concern.
seaniboy · 17/02/2022 23:58

[quote Awalkintime]Every woman knows someone who has been sexually assaulted or raped yet no one knows a rapist.
www.tiktok.com/@drjesstaylor/video/6957991478945778949?is_copy_url=1&is_from_webapp=v1&lang=en[/quote]
Problem is that allows men assulting males of any age be more underground driven by shame.

Imagine a police officer son assulting a same gender, there's a higher chance the female allegation will be investigated.

The problem is highlighted by woman in a manner it's gender exclusive, it's not, most men never try take action, that's why rates of male are lower reported than they should be.

Assualt of any kind is such, gender needs to be removed from it in some context other than directly on court date if you are lucky to get that far.

As for police, I don't think male officers should be handling Domestic abuse or sexual crimes at all in positions of power, certainly not the heads of these up units.

Another massive problem with domestic abuse is the lack of mental health training on for life mental health issues, a police officer should be able in the heat of the moment attandance be able to recognise the main things of bipolar, schitozophrenia and narcassist behaviour patterns with repeat offenders the way school teachers were once the best Social Workers, now first contact police/schools have no adquete training on these to highlight, take action and stop cycles.

A police officer should be trained and able to spot a behaviour that may be mental health and have facilitates outside NHS MH for assesment by another independent (non profit!) body.

As for kids, equality doesn't start at home it's starts by a teacher and school being inadequate. We still have no dentists or child behavioural specialists in our schools like it's 1922!

If we don't give our kids the best care under a 5 day week of intervention then it's hardly surprising the state of society, school is educational but wheres the education that teachers get from a onsite child behaviour specialist where a auditory, mental health or otherwise is picked up asap, and then not dealt with by a NHS Trust exclusively after 1 or more visits months apart.

Inequality breeds comtempt, that's what we teach kids.

There no independent body for behaviour specailist at each school training teachers, evaluating kids and holding police, councils & NHS to account.

Child abuse happens because we live in a 1930s system, that effects equality and how that child may develop in every way into a adult, even a rapist adult.

saraclara · 17/02/2022 23:59

I find it telling though that if you had a male relative accused of rape you would assume he was falsely accused

That is absolutely NOT what I have said.

Have you even read my posts?

All I have said is that one can't assume that a man is guilty, simply based on the fact that lots of other men get away with rape.
In this case no evidence was found, and following investigations, the police intended charging his accuser.

Fireflygal · 17/02/2022 23:59

he seems really nice and was broken telling me

How long ago was this accusation? Also have you ever suffered abuse before? His "broken" would concern me as even if innocent do you want to take this on?

saraclara · 18/02/2022 00:01

Far more women are having their lives ruined by these men than the minuscule number of men who are falsely accused of rape.

And again, what do those numbers have to do with this one man? You are proving my point with everything you say. You are judging individuals based on the statistics of a group.

cuno · 18/02/2022 00:01

@seaniboy

It's SEX not GENDER. And no thank you, I will not be removing this issue from sex and making this a gender neutral debate, 99% of sex offenders are men. The problem is men. Women can and do commit sexual offences, no-one is denying that, but it is a rarity and not supported by the patriarchal society we live in.

Hellorhighwater · 18/02/2022 00:03

Not a position I would like to be in. I urge you to get OBJECTIVE information. At this point, I assume you only know what he has told you. He has presumably, for example, only told you he has a job with enhanced DBS. That’s something you could check, no? Because if it turns out that some things he has told you are not true, then that would make things clearer.

I wouldn’t stick around myself. I agree that false accusations are a terrible thing, and it’s deeply unfair that they can ruin a man’s life. It’s a problem that needs to be solved. However, solving it should be of much lower priority than reducing the vastly greater number of women whose lives are ruined by being raped or assaulted by men, in a system where it is virtually impossible to get a conviction. It is not your problem to make the unfairness on him personally, or the falsely accused generally, go away. It is your problem to keep yourself safe personally and keep the number of assaulted women down generally by not becoming one. If he’s innocent and you bail, he’s still innocent, still falsely accused and still dealing with it. If he did it and you bail, he’s got fewer victims by one.

cuno · 18/02/2022 00:04

@saraclara

I find it telling though that if you had a male relative accused of rape you would assume he was falsely accused

That is absolutely NOT what I have said.

Have you even read my posts?

All I have said is that one can't assume that a man is guilty, simply based on the fact that lots of other men get away with rape.
In this case no evidence was found, and following investigations, the police intended charging his accuser.

The alleged rapist told this woman that police intended charging his accuser. They didn't though, did they? You're very gullible to take a man's word on this considering the statistics.
seaniboy · 18/02/2022 00:05

@ShiroMiso

My ex was arrested for raping me. I dropped the charges a few months later whilst he was on bail because I was too broken to stand up in court. I just wanted it all to go away.

He could easily be using the fact I dropped the charges to reassure other women that he's not a rapist and it was a false allegation.

However he is a rapist and it wasn't a false allegation.

I wouldn't continue to see him OP it's just not worth the risk. Best case scenario you will always be wondering "what if it's true" and the worst case scenario.. well, he could end up hurting you.

I would leave it there. It's early days and you don't need to see him again. Make something up. You're not in the place for a relationship etc. You're moving away.

If it's not true then I feel very sorry for him but even so, it's not worth the risk.

In this situation you ask the GP for a 'solemn of conscience' to delay a court case for as long as you need as your mental health comes before a court/perpetraitor.

It's Scottish, but given England and the Commonwealth is the Scots law system you will have it under a different name, that's what England done, it changed some names and made it English for the empire as Scots had the better legal system.

cuno · 18/02/2022 00:07

@saraclara

Far more women are having their lives ruined by these men than the minuscule number of men who are falsely accused of rape.

And again, what do those numbers have to do with this one man? You are proving my point with everything you say. You are judging individuals based on the statistics of a group.

Those numbers have everything to do with this one man because of statistics and the balance of probabilities! And wow, imagine clutching pearls at judging men accused of rape just to self-preserve and keep me and my daughter safe, I am not saying to go splash it all over Facebook. I am embarrassed for you.
saraclara · 18/02/2022 00:09

This is all getting ridiculous, @vino. I hope you never have to be in front of a judge who decides you're guilty of something because most people are.

saraclara · 18/02/2022 00:10

@cuno even. Nice autocorrect

saraclara · 18/02/2022 00:12

Anyway, OP. Given that this man has passed an enhanced dbs check, I'd give him the benefit of the doubt for a couple more dates. But tread carefully and see what else you can find out about this accusation. Then decide.

youvegottenminuteslynn · 18/02/2022 00:14

@seaniboy

It says so much about you that you've responded to a victim of rape with zero sympathy, not even a 'I am so sorry that happened to you' and instead quoted a course of action she could have taken through the courts when I'm assuming you haven't been through the ordeal of reporting a rape, witness statements etc so don't understand quite how patronising and condescending this is.

You don't get it.

Nobody is saying they don't feel terrible for individual men who are falsely accused. It must be absolutely fucking awful. Terrible. Life ruining. Genuinely one of the worst things I can imagine.

That doesn't change the fact that women should never, ever be vilified for not being willing to take a risk on someone who they know has been previously accused of rape if it means they feel uncomfortable seeing them again.

Women do not owe men the benefit of the doubt to the detriment of their personal safety. That's what it comes down to.

Believing that isn't mutually exclusive with also being able to hold great sympathy for men who are falsely accused.

cuno · 18/02/2022 00:19

@saraclara
It's ridiculous to make life choices and relationship decisions based on the level of evidence required in a court of law.

You can say I hope you never have to be in front of a judge who decides you're guilty of something because most people are and equally someone could say to you they hope you aren't raped and a judge decides you're guilty because a tiny percentage of women make a false allegation. What utter nonsense and drivel.

Oh and fwiw you can have an enhanced DBS and a legitimate rape allegation that could not be proven. Those aren't mutually exclusive and the DBS does not prove he didn't do it. Confused

Willyoujustbequiet · 18/02/2022 00:22

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cuno · 18/02/2022 00:28

[quote youvegottenminuteslynn]@seaniboy

It says so much about you that you've responded to a victim of rape with zero sympathy, not even a 'I am so sorry that happened to you' and instead quoted a course of action she could have taken through the courts when I'm assuming you haven't been through the ordeal of reporting a rape, witness statements etc so don't understand quite how patronising and condescending this is.

You don't get it.

Nobody is saying they don't feel terrible for individual men who are falsely accused. It must be absolutely fucking awful. Terrible. Life ruining. Genuinely one of the worst things I can imagine.

That doesn't change the fact that women should never, ever be vilified for not being willing to take a risk on someone who they know has been previously accused of rape if it means they feel uncomfortable seeing them again.

Women do not owe men the benefit of the doubt to the detriment of their personal safety. That's what it comes down to.

Believing that isn't mutually exclusive with also being able to hold great sympathy for men who are falsely accused. [/quote]
I agree, how horribly insensitive of him to say that. Navigating the legal system is traumatic in and of itself for victims, which is compounded by the misogyny that is rife throughout it so in many ways rape victims are set up to fail. It's no wonder many victims give up on the case, and who could blame them? And here we have it, a man (he confirmed in other posts he is a man, I am not assuming this) lecturing a rape victim on the right way to be a victim.

pucelleauxblanchesmains · 18/02/2022 00:31

@cuno So you don't believe a man can be falsely accused of rape, ever? Wtf?

cuno · 18/02/2022 00:32

[quote pucelleauxblanchesmains]@cuno So you don't believe a man can be falsely accused of rape, ever? Wtf?[/quote]
Can't you read? I said a minuscule number of women make false rape allegations. Multiple times. Why do you think I said otherwise?

Lunar27 · 18/02/2022 00:34

A DBS check is useless if a person hasn't been convicted. It's not a crystal ball so is only useful for flagging those who have already been charged with something.

It's just one part of a longer process when used for recruitment etc. so isn't a great indicator.

pucelleauxblanchesmains · 18/02/2022 00:36

And before anyone starts I'm female and a domestic abuse survivor, I just don't think "but women have it worse" is a fair or compassionate response to the instances when men are falsely accused of rape.

I also find, in general, the "why would anyone lie about rape?" thing baffling. People pretend to be the victim of crimes for all sorts of reasons, look at Jussie Smollett (or do we still have to believe him despite his being found guilty of lying by a jury, because other people do get away with hate crimes?)

I don't know if this man is innocent or not and after three dates it would be too much baggage for me to want to go on a fourth, but the attitude on this thread towards false accusations is disturbing, suggesting that even if a man is falsely accused he must have done something to deserve it. I hope you never find yourselves in court tbh.