To think MN has it all wrong re proposals?

[alfayruz]

Inspired by a thread the other day, but also a general observation on here, I was thinking ... whenever anyone posts on MN about waiting for a proposal from their DP, you can guarantee hundreds of posts along the lines of ‘just propose to him....’ AIBU to think this is ridiculous because -

1. Nobody in actual real life does this

2. Having to propose to a man would be a massive turn off anyway so what is the point?

3. Even if you could still muster some kind of sexual attraction towards him, the bar is set at rock bottom before you even start - so why would you expect any initiative or effort from him on any other occasions or general life going forward?

AIBU?

What I really don't understand is the idea that women should just sit passively waiting for the man to decide he wants to marry them and ask, and should have no say or agency in one of the biggest decisions of their life. That marriage is entirely in the man's gift to bestow.

I agree. If marriage is important to you, then bring it up. I can’t imagine sitting around silently fuming at not being proposed to, but not feeling like you could possibly mention it.
Pretty much every long-term couple I know has discussed and agreed on marriage before a proposal has taken place. And having agreed on it, the women wouldn’t have then just waited around forever for him to decide the timing.

YABVU
You need to work on your regressive attitudes.

My sil proposed to my brother.

My best mates chatted about getting married, agreed they should so booked a date, as did my parents!

I honestly do find it ridiculous that so many women sit about pining for a proposal and not just talking to their partner about it, I really don’t think anyone I know irl has ever done that - I find it a really old fashioned concept.

Imo it’s only on MN that people don’t have grown up conversations about marriage.

I disagree. Once you have kids and live together then it’s not so much a proposal that MN is suggesting, it’s an adult conversation initiated by the woman. And in that situation it should be happening.

The bigger issue is that the fundamentals of relationships have changed a lot in the past 40 years - but mainly in a way that benefits men. So women are contributing much more financially but the mental load childcare and housework are generally not being shared equally. We need to recognise this and work towards changing it. Part of this is not waiting for a proposal if you are in a vulnerable situation.

YABU
I know lots of people including myself who didn’t wait for the man to propose.

Oh and I find it utterly ridiculous when couples get as far as buying a ring together but insist on ‘a proposal’ - years ago someone I worked with did that and I virtually laughed at her in surprise at the ridiculousness of the situation

I proposed to my husband when I was 25. We were and still are equal partners in our marriage so it was done in the spirit of that I suppose. I proposed on a Saturday afternoon in the living room of our rental flat as I knew he wouldn't like the 'pressure' of everyone watching if we were in a public place.

It surprises me how feminism goes out the window in society with marriage proposals. A woman should feel she can ask as much as her husband also should have feel he can. Not waiting around like some sort of princess. If you know what you want then seize the day.

I agree with you, OP. A man using initiative is attractive and vice-versa.

Just because the idea of proposing yourself does not seem appealing, it hardly follows that you are ‘sitting round passively.’ I don’t understand this argument. You know the person you are with and can usually gauge attitudes to this kind of thing - like anything else. Most couples would have talked about the concept of marriage in the broadest sense, like “would you ever want to get married” - just like you might talk theoretically about having children, or where you might want to live, all sorts of aspirations etc etc. But that’s not the same at all as the advice to ‘sit him down at the table and book the wedding.’

@Bonheurdupasse

YANBU. It’s performative “feminism” for show.

😞 THIS.

It’s a little misleading.

Most couples I know discuss marriage as a concept and both agree they would get married to one another one day, then the man is left to do the actual proposal but usually with a fake ring which the couple then pick out a real one together.

On MN though you’d be engaged once you agree you would marry one another, which just doesn’t happen IRL in my experience.

But then, on MN you’re a grabby materialistic bitch destined for a short marriage and long unhappy life if the budget for your wedding is more than £12 and you wear anything more than a bin bag to get married in

I proposed to my wife.

Why does the man have to do it in hetero couples? Are you really saying it would kill your attraction to him if you proposed to him?

What?

@alfayruz

is this the 1950s?

Every thread. Every time.

Well, you’ve said yourself that ‘no one does this’. They do. Clearly you’re a time-traveller, or your entire social circle is weirdly limited to people with certain ideas about gender roles.

Just because the idea of proposing yourself does not seem appealing, it hardly follows that you are ‘sitting round passively.’ I don’t understand this argument. You know the person you are with and can usually gauge attitudes to this kind of thing

But your thread is about MN advice, where generally the person posting is saying “why hasn’t he proposed yet?? and is being a little passive - hence the advice they get is to bring it up themselves.

I think that there is a bit of unreasonableness in as much as there is no reason why a woman can't propose.
I was going to, but he asked me first.

“Why does the man have to do it in hetero couples? Are you really saying it would kill your attraction to him if you proposed to him?”

Yes it would 100% have killed my attraction for my husband if I’d had to propose to him.

🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂😂🤣😂😂🤣

“I really want to own a house. I’m not going to ask DH if he’ll start looking for one with me, god how embarrassing. If he wants to buy a house with me he’ll ask me, I’m not going to beg. It sucks, loads of my friends are buying houses, their partners asked them, and here I am still waiting.”

Or

“God I can’t wait to be a mum. All I want is a baby. I wish DH would suggest we start ttc. If he wants one I know he’ll ask me, I hope it happens soon as we’re not getting any younger. No of course I’m not going to bring it up, how awful to have to ask, he’ll tell me when he’s ready and I won’t embarrass myself by bringing it up”

Are those as sensible an approach to big life events which will impact on both parties as deciding to get married?

@alfayruz

Just because the idea of proposing yourself does not seem appealing, it hardly follows that you are ‘sitting round passively.’ I don’t understand this argument. You know the person you are with and can usually gauge attitudes to this kind of thing - like anything else. Most couples would have talked about the concept of marriage in the broadest sense, like “would you ever want to get married” - just like you might talk theoretically about having children, or where you might want to live, all sorts of aspirations etc etc. But that’s not the same at all as the advice to ‘sit him down at the table and book the wedding.’

The majority of Mumsnetters in this situation already have children and live with the bloke.

That's what makes the whole sitting around thing ridiculous and the grand proposal a bit fake.

I don’t really understand the other way around.

How can you discuss getting married, decide when it might be, even discuss what kind of ring etc and then expect a “surprise proposal”? I don’t get it.

I reminds me of those over the top Instagram/TikTok proposals where there is a proposal choreographer.

YABU. Massively so. Why does a man have to do the proposal? I genuinely don't understand. Simply because it's tradition? Because he has a penis?
I proposed to my DH. I decided I wanted to spend the rest of my life with him, so I asked. He said yes, and we've been very happily married for 11 years.

@alfayruz

“Why does the man have to do it in hetero couples? Are you really saying it would kill your attraction to him if you proposed to him?”

Yes it would 100% have killed my attraction for my husband if I’d had to propose to him.

Why?

We just decided to get married while in bed. (22 years ago)

@alfayruz

“Why does the man have to do it in hetero couples? Are you really saying it would kill your attraction to him if you proposed to him?”

Yes it would 100% have killed my attraction for my husband if I’d had to propose to him.

"Had to" ?! In what circumstances would you be forced to propose?!

Must be a weak attraction then if it can't even stand up to making life decisions jointly!
FFS !

To me, everything you're saying is really a type of game playing.

Really wanting something and hinting it and getting upset about not being asked at a certain time but not actually saying why, is game playing.

If your sexual attraction to someone is dampened because it's you rather than them that suggests arranging a future event, then I'd suggest the attraction wasnt very strong in the first place.

I know my brain works a bit differently to others and people who think more romantically may think differently. But from my point of view, I wanted to get married, I knew he wasnt that married, i didnt propose but we discussed getting married and decided together. Which has kind of set the tone for our marriage, to discuss and decide together based on what works best for both of us...and I can't see how that's a bad thing