To not want DF to bring her baby everywhere?

[DijfunvKd]

My friend lives a few hours away from me, and visits the area I live in fairly often. She had her first baby last year. When she visits, it's always with her DH.

Now she's had the baby, she will contact me asking if I want to meet her and the baby for coffee or lunch, and I always go. She will also ask if I want to go for a drink or nice meal one evening, and so I find a date on which I'm available. However, I then get messages to say she'll have to bring the baby because she'll need breastfeeding, or there is no one else to look after her etc. So we end up having a quick coke in a child friendly pub, or they both come to my house.

I don't mind the lunches with the baby, and do the expected 'isn't she cute?' (she is), 'is she eating/sleeping well?' small talk, but I find it extremely boring and do it to be polite and supportive. I don't want to repeat the same conversation on the evening.

DF will always say 'baby will be no trouble while we're out, she's very placid', but it inevitably becomes DF talking to the baby while I sit and make the expected cooing noises, and then she needs to leave early to get the baby to bed. If she had no option but to bring the baby to socialise then that would be one thing, but her DH goes off for hours with his friends, child free, well into the night, and I can't understand why she can't do that. If it was because she simply didn't want to leave the baby, then why ask if I'd like to go for a drink or nice meal in the evening?

During her pregnancy she was claiming nothing would change, that she'd still be going on holiday with friends and leaving the baby with her dad, and I thought she was deluding herself with that, but now that the baby has arrived she's swung hard the other way, which is her prerogative, but AIBU to think that her expectation that she brings the baby every time we see each other is ridiculous?

For information, the same happens when I visit her too, although that is less often because she visits friends and family where I live and stays with her parents.

Fuck me there are some insufferable people on this thread.

OP YATNBU at all.

Maybe there is something wrong with me, but I craved the odd night out away from my 2 when they were babies, BF or not. It might have only been for a couple of hours, but having time away and not having to listen to people drivelling on about babies was such a tonic. I love my kids, but I love my sanity too.

I vividly recall one NCT night out without babies, a couple of precious hours where we as 7 women could actually chat about things other than the fact we all procreated in the same month! It started off as expected with everyone twittering on about feeding/nappies/poo etc. I suggested we move the conversation on and each tell the table 3 things about ourselves, oe of which was untrue and guess which was the untruth.

It was brilliant..we had such a laugh, got to know each other a bit more as individuals, not just mothers. We all went our separate ways saying what a great night it had been, and were all home in time to get our boobs out for the evening feed.

Bosh.

If you go to her house and she's then available until 10, won't that mean that you actually get some baby-free time @DijfunvKd? Presumably she'll go to bed significantly before 10?

I know you really want to go into town, but this could be a good test to see if she really is interested in your life remotely. Because she won't have the baby to talk to half the time. If she still won't talk about anything else, then I'd give up on her.

@StickyToffeePuddingAndIceCream

You've not revealed if you've had kids, you harped on about omitting whether you do so everyone doesn't say, youve clearly no idea. If you have kids then you mustn't have breastfed as you'd realise how hard it is to leave a 6 month old who is ebf for the evening. Your friend probably wants to go on your childfree evening but then the logistics of having to pump milk and store it for the evening and the stress of leaving a ebf baby is obviously too much so she changes plans. Maybe you are much older than your friend and you have totally forgot how it was, who knows? You need to find some friends who don't have babies either way.

Sweet mother of God, could you - and many others on this thread - be more condescending? I am one of these 'exclusively breast fed babies at 6 months mothers' twice over and I had several evenings out alone in between feedings and managed not to treat my friends like shit. How the OP's friend is treating her is a series of choices, not some immutable law of nature.

@saraclara

If you go to her house and she's then available until 10, won't that mean that you actually get some baby-free time *@DijfunvKd*? Presumably she'll go to bed significantly before 10?

I know you really want to go into town, but this could be a good test to see if she really is interested in your life remotely. Because she won't have the baby to talk to half the time. If she still won't talk about anything else, then I'd give up on her.

I won't be going to her house, she stays with her parents when she's here. She wants to come to my house. When she does that, she usually leaves at 10 to go and put the baby to bed.

I thought the same as you - the first time she asked I thought 'great, takeaway, couple of wines, the baby can be put down to sleep here presumably early on', but that's not how it worked out.

YANBU. At all. You are simply asking that your DF not continue to change evening plans to go out for 'adults-only' drinks into an hour in a child-friendly venue (or your own home), cooing over her baby.

OP, I am increasingly frustrated at reading posts accusing you of being either childfree/a child hater/an unsupportive friend, by posters who don't appear to have RTFT - or even just OP's posts - so goodness only knows how @DijfunvKdmust be feeling!

I would certainly either stick to only making daytime plans for now, unless you feel it's the right time to put your foot down, and hold her to your arrangement by gently encouraging her to arrange for her DH or DPs to stay in with the baby. Whatever you decide, I think you've been a lovely friend to this lady and I'm sure she really values your friendship.

@LuckySantangelo35

What’s with all the patronising ‘how old are you OP’ ‘are you very young OP’ questions? OP I completely agree with you and it would be frustrating for me too. You are willing to accommodate what works for her at this time, she is then suggesting something different and then cannot follow through meaning you’ve had to cancel plans, keep an evening free etc, which isn’t fair

Absolutely this.

Oh and the 'you obviously don't understand anything about being a mother' posts. So patronising and rude.

It's perfectly reasonable to expect someone to be honest about what they can do. The occasional change of plan may be inevitable if the baby is ill or something but not as a regular thing.

And not all mothers are permanently glued to their children, although it's fine if they want to be, and don't expect others to feel the same. Some mothers, however, actually find that having some sort of a social life makes them better parents!

6 months is really young, and they might not even sleep or only sleep on her! If the baby wakes up whilst she is out and wants fed, only the mother can do that if the baby is breastfed and won’t take a bottle. In this case the father can do very little. I was also completely clueless about this until I had kids. Sleep regressions, feeding, separation anxiety. I think she is being just a bit too ambitious with organising evening plans when the baby isn’t ready. Give her space and time, unfortunately yabu

@DijfunvKd

Thank you to everyone who's actually taken the time to read and understand my posts.

I replied to her saying that I was looking forward to going into the city, and could her mother not look after the baby? She replied saying her mother is busy and that if she had left the baby she could only stay out for two hours, but she can stay out till 10 if she and the baby come to my house.

I said I was looking forward to going out, so why not have lunch tomorrow or Sunday instead. She has replied saying she has plans for both and DB really wants to see her Auntie Dij. I haven't replied to that yet.

I'd respond. "And I really fancy a grown-up evening with nice food and wine. So I'll be doing that alone/ with another friend. It's a pity DB wants to see her Aunty Dij and won't get to this time, but then we don't always get to do what we want, do we?"

And she presumably knows this, so why make plans that don't involve the baby if she's unwilling to leave her with anyone else?

Because she's still a human being in her own right? Having a child doesnt mean she no longer needs or wants social contact with other adults

You would be better off just meeting her for a 'quick' coffee during the day and forgetting about evenings.

I cannot believe how many people are spectacularly missing the point. The OP doesn’t have a problem with the baby or the feeding, or for just meeting for lunches. It’s the fact her friend arranges an evening out, then at the last minute says she has to bring the baby, or come over instead. If you’d planned a night out with a date day, and they guy says, or sorry, I can only see you for a few hours, you’d be rightly pissed off. Most people plan a full evening out, not an hour, and I would also be annoyed. To be honest it has nothing to do with the baby (why arrange in the first place if you can’t do it and the OP is happy to meet for lunch), it’s that she’s promising one thing and at the last minute changing it. She’s probably arranging it as her husband is out that night and doesn’t want to be on her own at home. I would just only agree to meet her for coffee or lunch from now on.

I read your first post as you wanting to see your friend without a baby whereas she doesnt or cant. Its perfectly understandable that a mother and a baby are one unit that doesnt easily separate which is why they usually dont do it unless there is a need for it /and by "need" I mean situation like going the the doctors or going shopping for stuff you need/.
Its absolutely irrelevant how naively she may have imagined how her life will change and she will think about going out.
If the problem is that she says she will have an evening free baby and then she doesnt for whatever reason as she doesnt feel she can leave the baby then she might be feeling pressured into having a babyfree evening and not comfotable enough to say so or not being able to realise so.
With a baby of 6 months your life is/can be all dictated by the baby and the care it needs. She might need a bit more of an understanding friend as she might be still overwhelmed by the new life to the point of not being able to tell you what she is capable of and what she is not. Perhaps you can try to engage her in a conversation and gently ask her what she would like to do and what of that she actualy is able to do.

God no, baby free time is essential, even dogs are distracting

@OfstedOffred

And she presumably knows this, so why make plans that don't involve the baby if she's unwilling to leave her with anyone else?

Because she's still a human being in her own right? Having a child doesnt mean she no longer needs or wants social contact with other adults

This makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

She doesn't want to leave the baby, but she's got the right to make plans without the baby, and cancel said plan, just because she has the right to make the plan? What?

@OfstedOffred

And she presumably knows this, so why make plans that don't involve the baby if she's unwilling to leave her with anyone else?

Because she's still a human being in her own right? Having a child doesnt mean she no longer needs or wants social contact with other adults

Being a human being doesn't give you the right to bore other people to death.

Quite prepared to be shot down here (as I usually am on this type of thread) but I think this mummy martyrdom is a relatively new phenomenon, and a result of the long maternity leave everyone takes now.
It's normalised by a lot of posters on MN, who seem to think that unless you spend the first year of your child's life permanently attached to them and 'enjoying the baby snuggles' , you are somehow less of a parent.
Maternity leave used to be a lot shorter and four month old babies were routinely in childcare then. I am not saying that was better than it is now, far from it, but the current assumption that a baby can not be parted from its mother until six months at the earliest or that mum and baby will dissolve if they are separated is rubbish.

@katepilar

I read your first post as you wanting to see your friend without a baby whereas she doesnt or cant. Its perfectly understandable that a mother and a baby are one unit that doesnt easily separate which is why they usually dont do it unless there is a need for it /and by "need" I mean situation like going the the doctors or going shopping for stuff you need/. Its absolutely irrelevant how naively she may have imagined how her life will change and she will think about going out. If the problem is that she says she will have an evening free baby and then she doesnt for whatever reason as she doesnt feel she can leave the baby then she might be feeling pressured into having a babyfree evening and not comfotable enough to say so or not being able to realise so. With a baby of 6 months your life is/can be all dictated by the baby and the care it needs. She might need a bit more of an understanding friend as she might be still overwhelmed by the new life to the point of not being able to tell you what she is capable of and what she is not. Perhaps you can try to engage her in a conversation and gently ask her what she would like to do and what of that she actualy is able to do.

She quite clearly is comfortable enough to say so, because she does say so, just after the plans have already been made.

How can I be more understanding?

@DijfunvKd

Thank you to everyone who's actually taken the time to read and understand my posts.

I replied to her saying that I was looking forward to going into the city, and could her mother not look after the baby? She replied saying her mother is busy and that if she had left the baby she could only stay out for two hours, but she can stay out till 10 if she and the baby come to my house.

I said I was looking forward to going out, so why not have lunch tomorrow or Sunday instead. She has replied saying she has plans for both and DB really wants to see her Auntie Dij. I haven't replied to that yet.

I said earlier on OP, you are not at all unreasonable. Some of the patronising stuff that is being posted on here is definitely not MN at its finest. Fair play to you for your patience.

That nonsense about a six month old baby wanting to see auntie Dij would finish me. I think you are being extremely reasonable. I would stick to my guns if I were you. She wants everything her way, full stop. How convenient that her mother is busy and that she has plans for lunch on both Saturday and Sunday.

Sending you a virtual

Good lord her reply! The thing is that she’s not going to change once the baby gets older.

Maybe she actually likes having her baby around! Maybe babys dad is a d##k an refuses to look after his child.

YANBU to be annoyed by the changing plans and to be bored by constant baby talk! However…….
YABU to expect that a new mum is going to be the same as she was before she had the baby. It’s just not possible, practically or emotionally. Hopefully, once the baby gets older, she’ll be less obsessed and will be dying for a fun night out with her old friends! Hang in there OP, it won’t be forever!

OP just stop making evening plans with her for a while.

She’s all wrapped up in baby world at the moment, which is lovely for her, but you don’t want to be involved in baby world - which is perfectly fine, meet up in the day for short periods if you still want to see her, or just pull back for a while.

Make plans with your other friends.

One of my friends has a 10 month old baby who breast feeds to sleep. My friend will bring him to the pub, feed him to sleep and then he sleeps in the pram whilst we catch up with a glass of wine. I don’t mind at all, if I want a more grown up night out then I go with a different friend.

@needmoreshinys

but her DH goes off for hours with his friends, child free, well into the night, and I can't understand why she can't do that.

From my armchair detective position, based on this one sentence, I would wonder if there is more going on in her relationship, the dad not stepping up for example, not wanting her to go out.

Or is it possibe that she just doesnt want to leave the baby and didn't realise how much her life would change

I second this I have 2 friends that have awful partners that do as they please but will not look after there off spring ever.

@Pigeonsdontliketrucks the OP is quite clearly not expecting that.

I think the crux of the issue is how much does being a new mother mean that you can be a complete dick to other people?

And it appears 60% of people seem to think as much as you want - oh and you should also be annoyed if they don’t then check in to make sure you are feeling comfortable in your dickishness