To have a child knowing they’ll spend 4 or 5 days in nursery?

[mvmvmvmv]

AIBU to have a child knowing they’d likely be in nursery 4 days a week after my maternity, and likely going to 5 days a week by age 3? Is it unreasonable to have a child knowing they will need to spend so much time in nursery? Is it cruel?

We have zero family nearby, and family finances mean we both pretty much need to work full time (one of us could drop to 4 days for a year).

I don’t want to use a nanny or au pair as I’d want my child to have social interaction with other kids. There are v few childminders near us so unlikely to be an option. The local nursery is very good tho.

@navydear

I'm sorry but there is not one single positive that I can think of for a child to be in a crèche before the age of 3. A child of 1 or 2 years does not even play with other children, they just play along side them. Taking a child from their sleep at all hours of the dawn to bring them to a service to be cared for mainly by young girls, who, let's be honest are mostly tired and hungover of a Monday morning, is nothing but cruel. How can this substitute the love that child should be receiving from their mother all day. One on one attention and the feeling of being nurtured and loved is what these babies should be receiving, not dropped into a room of god knows how many other toddlers of the exact same age with all the very same needs and demands. It's bonkers if anyone thinks that this is natural. I can't imagine my little girl spending 10 hours of the day in a business. Where is the lazy hours of cuddling on the sofa, the long hugs and kisses, the listening ear of a mammy while listening to their stories over and over. I know people don't have choice but instead of trying to pretend that this is all okay, maybe start fighting for change so mothers can afford to be at home with their babies untill at least school age. These years are so formative, yet you hand your child over to experience things, see and hear things that you have no control of, these years shape your child's future and you are not there to ensure it is shaped by the best way possible.

Mostly young girls who are hungover? Where do all the 'old' ones go when they get too old to be nursery nurses then? Old women just 'poof away with you!'

Why mothers? Why it is just a mothers job to be at home with the children? Why should a mother give up a career or job she enjoys to sit and be lazy on the sofa cuddling, kissing and hugging? Is it only a mother who loves her children enough?

I can think of a few good reasons children go to nursery. These are pretty key things. If you can't fathom any reason at all why a parent would need to use paid childcare then you live a very sheltered and privileged life. And to your ignorant comments about love, children who go to nursery are still loved! They are not loved less just because their parent has to fucking work to afford to live! Or are you another who thinks that people earning under a certain amount shouldn't be allowed to breed?

Your misogyny and ignorance is showing.

@navydear

I'm sorry but there is not one single positive that I can think of for a child to be in a crèche before the age of 3. A child of 1 or 2 years does not even play with other children, they just play along side them. Taking a child from their sleep at all hours of the dawn to bring them to a service to be cared for mainly by young girls, who, let's be honest are mostly tired and hungover of a Monday morning, is nothing but cruel. How can this substitute the love that child should be receiving from their mother all day. One on one attention and the feeling of being nurtured and loved is what these babies should be receiving, not dropped into a room of god knows how many other toddlers of the exact same age with all the very same needs and demands. It's bonkers if anyone thinks that this is natural. I can't imagine my little girl spending 10 hours of the day in a business. Where is the lazy hours of cuddling on the sofa, the long hugs and kisses, the listening ear of a mammy while listening to their stories over and over. I know people don't have choice but instead of trying to pretend that this is all okay, maybe start fighting for change so mothers can afford to be at home with their babies untill at least school age. These years are so formative, yet you hand your child over to experience things, see and hear things that you have no control of, these years shape your child's future and you are not there to ensure it is shaped by the best way possible.

If a woman has two children, you're saying she should stay at home for at least five years.

You don't appear to be suggesting that the father should do this, just the mother.

Do you think that expecting all women who have children to sacrifice their careers and earning potential, forego several years of pension contributions and be financially dependent on their male partners is helpful in terms of equality between men and women?

What sort of message do you think that sends to their sons and daughters?

@MadameHeisenberg

Oh, I own it. I absolutely don’t ‘need’ to work in the sense that DH’s salary is more than adequate (we are both high-earning expats). That said, I think all healthy adults should work in order to responsible for themselves and contribute to society. I find it quite infantilising really that able-mind/bodied adults would rely on others for their survival. And If you have offspring, you have a moral duty to provide for them financially, whether you’re male or female.

How many of these women who are happy to judge and sacrifice other women’s careers in favour of SAH, would encourage their sons to do the same? Not many, I’m betting.

How sad that, by implication, you don't think that a mother who stays at home to look after her own children is contributing to society.

It is hardly child neglect to have a child in nursery 4 or 5 days weekly. People have to work and earn a living. We arent in the 1950s any longer and life is very expensive these days. It is only people living in a bubble will think any different.

Taking a child from their sleep at all hours of the dawn to bring them to a service to be cared for mainly by young girls, who, let's be honest are mostly tired and hungover of a Monday morning, is nothing but cruel.

Ah yes, because everyone who earns under 30k a year is a feckless, irresponsible waster who doesn't care about their job and spends all weekend, every weekend binge-drinking.

I genuinely believe that DC are better off being cared for by nursery staff than their sole influence being a Parent who is ignorant, judgemental and apparently so insecure that she feels the need to make offensive and completely unfounded generalisations about an entire profession to justify her own choices.

So you chose to be a SAHM and it worked well for your family? Good for you. That doesn't give you the right to insist you know what's best for other people's children. It's incredibly closed-minded to assume that any child whose day to day life looks different to that of your own DC must be disadvantaged, un-loved or neglected in some way.

For the record, my own DC have never been in childcare 4-5 days a week but I don't think for a second that gives me the right to judge the Parents of those that are, or the staff who care for them, because I'm not a judgemental twat.

Taking a child from their sleep at all hours of the dawn to bring them to a service to be cared for mainly by young girls, who, let's be honest are mostly tired and hungover of a Monday morning, is nothing but cruel.

LOL, I’d rather them be looked after by the young yet fabulous workers at my kids nursery than a judgmental person such as yourself

Taking a child from their sleep at all hours of the dawn to bring them to a service to be cared for mainly by young girls,

Firstly, I never had to wake my child up to take them to nursery. What time do you think people are leaving the house?
And secondly, the childcare professionals were nothing short of amazing

@navydear

I'm sorry but there is not one single positive that I can think of for a child to be in a crèche before the age of 3. A child of 1 or 2 years does not even play with other children, they just play along side them. Taking a child from their sleep at all hours of the dawn to bring them to a service to be cared for mainly by young girls, who, let's be honest are mostly tired and hungover of a Monday morning, is nothing but cruel. How can this substitute the love that child should be receiving from their mother all day. One on one attention and the feeling of being nurtured and loved is what these babies should be receiving, not dropped into a room of god knows how many other toddlers of the exact same age with all the very same needs and demands. It's bonkers if anyone thinks that this is natural. I can't imagine my little girl spending 10 hours of the day in a business. Where is the lazy hours of cuddling on the sofa, the long hugs and kisses, the listening ear of a mammy while listening to their stories over and over. I know people don't have choice but instead of trying to pretend that this is all okay, maybe start fighting for change so mothers can afford to be at home with their babies untill at least school age. These years are so formative, yet you hand your child over to experience things, see and hear things that you have no control of, these years shape your child's future and you are not there to ensure it is shaped by the best way possible.

Most tired and hungover? That's fucking insulting to professionals who work hard and care about their jobs.

“I'm sorry but there is not one single positive that I can think of for a child to be in a crèche before the age of 3. A child of 1 or 2 years does not even play with other children, they just play along side them. “

This is also just bollocks as well. Both of my girls have developed real and lasting friendships at nursery well before 3. A good nursery provides so much benefit.

It's absolutely disgusting and insulting for real victims of abuse, to relate 'children in childcare settings' to child cruelty, abuse and neglect. Any poster that has used the words cruel/neglect to describe this situation, hang your heads in shame!

I've only scanned the last few posts but the bits they've quoted have really annoyed me.

1. There are more grandmothers than teenagers working at my DC's nursery. The students they do have are kind, caring and enthusiastic.

1. At nursery my DC get a huge range of experiences that it just wouldn't be possible to replicate at home, as well as growing with other children in a way we just wouldn't be able to replicate. They also feed them much better than I would! I'm in no way saying that nursery is superior to home. But it's not inferior.

1. I worked hard through school, college and professional qualifications until my mid 30s. Why I should suddenly change personality and wish to stay home for a few years (7 years between my eldest being born and my youngest starting school, btw) when no such pressure is put on my husband I have no idea.

1. The women who work at our nursery are fantastic. They should be valued for their experience, expertise and nurtering. That they are paid such shit wages (especially in comparison to male-centric careers with similar levels of qualifications) is a huge failing of our society, with clear roots in misogyny.

1. Alas, no waking our baby to get to nursery. I fucking wish, haven't needed an alarm clock for a long time.

I think @navydear needs to get their head out their arse and leave to safety of their 4 walls to see what really goes on in the real world

Wow who are these babies that are being woken at dawn for nursery? Both mine have always arisen long before us and usually practise singing around daybreak alongside the dog. I have a coffee machine on my bedside table.

The you hungover girls. Now then. Key person is a mum of 2, 2 in the same nursery as our toddler - different room. Former key person - grandmother of 4, aged 59 - absolute legend. I credit her single handedly with toilet training my older one and teaching him all sorts from phonics to kindness. Manager - grandmother of 3. Deputy manager - fellow mum of toddler - we were pregnant together. Somehow these people appear rather normal and not drunk on Monday mornings.

But what do I know.

I am just a Professor.

@navydear

I'm sorry but there is not one single positive that I can think of for a child to be in a crèche before the age of 3. A child of 1 or 2 years does not even play with other children, they just play along side them. Taking a child from their sleep at all hours of the dawn to bring them to a service to be cared for mainly by young girls, who, let's be honest are mostly tired and hungover of a Monday morning, is nothing but cruel. How can this substitute the love that child should be receiving from their mother all day. One on one attention and the feeling of being nurtured and loved is what these babies should be receiving, not dropped into a room of god knows how many other toddlers of the exact same age with all the very same needs and demands. It's bonkers if anyone thinks that this is natural. I can't imagine my little girl spending 10 hours of the day in a business. Where is the lazy hours of cuddling on the sofa, the long hugs and kisses, the listening ear of a mammy while listening to their stories over and over. I know people don't have choice but instead of trying to pretend that this is all okay, maybe start fighting for change so mothers can afford to be at home with their babies untill at least school age. These years are so formative, yet you hand your child over to experience things, see and hear things that you have no control of, these years shape your child's future and you are not there to ensure it is shaped by the best way possible.

I'm assuming you are a SAHM. How lucky you can afford to be. Ideally I'd like to be at home but my son loves nursery. Always smiling when he goes in and gets so many more experiences than he would if at home with me. We have plenty of times for cuddles and stories thanks. We spent a couple of hours today just reading his baby bear book and cuddling. He's not in nursery 24/7.

navydear
I'm sorry but there is not one single positive that I can think of for a child to be in a crèche before the age of 3. A child of 1 or 2 years does not even play with other children, they just play along side them. Taking a child from their sleep at all hours of the dawn to bring them to a service to be cared for mainly by young girls, who, let's be honest are mostly tired and hungover of a Monday morning, is nothing but cruel. How can this substitute the love that child should be receiving from their mother all day. One on one attention and the feeling of being nurtured and loved is what these babies should be receiving, not dropped into a room of god knows how many other toddlers of the exact same age with all the very same needs and demands. It's bonkers if anyone thinks that this is natural. I can't imagine my little girl spending 10 hours of the day in a business. Where is the lazy hours of cuddling on the sofa, the long hugs and kisses, the listening ear of a mammy while listening to their stories over and over. I know people don't have choice but instead of trying to pretend that this is all okay, maybe start fighting for change so mothers can afford to be at home with their babies untill at least school age. These years are so formative, yet you hand your child over to experience things, see and hear things that you have no control of, these years shape your child's future and you are not there to ensure it is shaped by the best way possible.”

What a load of tripe.

(I was a SAHM)

Your characterisation of nursery workers is offensive. My eldest daughter is an highly qualified nursery professional and better equipped to work with little ones than most parents.

Where is the lazy hours of cuddling on the sofa, the long hugs and kisses, the listening ear of a mammy while listening to their stories over and over

Ummm in the evening?
Really you spentc10 hours a day doing that ? Baby didn't have a nap? You didn't put her down to sort the washing or go on mumsnet? ha ha

Where is the lazy hours of cuddling on the sofa, the long hugs and kisses, the listening ear of a mammy while listening to their stories over and over

You must have a strangely docile child if they are willing to sit on the sofa with you for ten hours a day being cuddled.

Mine also always had lots of new stories to tell me, perhaps because he left the sofa and did fun things at his nursery. If yours is telling the same story over and over perhaps she is bored?

@navydear

I'm sorry but there is not one single positive that I can think of for a child to be in a crèche before the age of 3. A child of 1 or 2 years does not even play with other children, they just play along side them. Taking a child from their sleep at all hours of the dawn to bring them to a service to be cared for mainly by young girls, who, let's be honest are mostly tired and hungover of a Monday morning, is nothing but cruel. How can this substitute the love that child should be receiving from their mother all day. One on one attention and the feeling of being nurtured and loved is what these babies should be receiving, not dropped into a room of god knows how many other toddlers of the exact same age with all the very same needs and demands. It's bonkers if anyone thinks that this is natural. I can't imagine my little girl spending 10 hours of the day in a business. Where is the lazy hours of cuddling on the sofa, the long hugs and kisses, the listening ear of a mammy while listening to their stories over and over. I know people don't have choice but instead of trying to pretend that this is all okay, maybe start fighting for change so mothers can afford to be at home with their babies untill at least school age. These years are so formative, yet you hand your child over to experience things, see and hear things that you have no control of, these years shape your child's future and you are not there to ensure it is shaped by the best way possible.

This is just a bit odd... I don't know many kids willing to cuddle on the sofa for hours. How old is your DC? DS has been off nursery for 3 weeks with COVID and chest infection. He's desperate to get back!

Also the comment about not having control is slightly concerning... yes I have control over what childcare my son goes to but I don't micromanage every activity.

It has been proven many times that staying at home until school age is actually detrimental to a child's development

@cafedesreves

Also the comment about not having control is slightly concerning... yes I have control over what childcare my son goes to but I don't micromanage every activity.

It has been proven many times that staying at home until school age is actually detrimental to a child's development

Can you link to studies or articles about this, this thread has made me feel crap that I have to put my 1 year old into nursery to o back to work. I looked around for ages and I'm really pleased with the one we've chosen but it's not being at home with mummy is it

nellly
Please don't feel crap. Lots of us have done it and our children thrived! All the research shows that it's not detrimental.
We're all just doing our best! ❤️

My kids went full-time and yes there were days when it was hard to leave them but they are grown up now (early teens - early 20s) and neither has needed therapy due to full time nursery. They were so well prepared for schools compared to some other classmates at school who had never attended any nursery / daycare.

They also have happy memories of their time there.

I don't think most DC 'love' going to nursery at a young age (younger than 3) - they invariably would prefer to be with their parents, it's a biological imperative.

My DS really didn't like nursery - when he was very little (13 months till about 2.5) he didn't seem to dislike it, but once he was able to properly articulate his feelings he made it very clear that he didn't like nursery. We looked at getting a nanny but couldn't find one, so we reduced our hours at work so he only went 2 days till he started at the pre-school attached to the school. On the 2 nursery days DS was in tears at drop off, even though he'd settle quickly it was clear he didn't want to go and wasn't happy. It still breaks my heart

Hopefully your DC will be fine at nursery, some are and some aren't, but I'm just warning you in case your DC turns out like mine and really doesn't like it - it's SO hard and upsetting.

@nellly here is a report by the Sutton Trust

www.suttontrust.com/our-research/a-fair-start-equalising-access-to-early-education/

Of course, what's really important is finding the right childcare. For some kids that will be childminder, others nursery. My son genuinely really enjoys it and I know it's right for him.

Speaking as both a mum who is a SAHM (though not by choice, I literally can’t work right now because of, ironically, lack of access to childcare) and someone who has worked in nurseries- it’s fine.

This thread has highlighted how some users honestly think childcare workers are lazy, unintelligent glorified babysitters and unfortunately just showcases the lack of respect for the workers.

We do real work and develop real bonds with the children in our care. I took a break from childcare to do other work because you put a lot of yourself into it and I was finding it emotionally draining.

If your child goes to nursery 4-5 days a week, they will be with people who are actively tracking their development and looking for ways to encourage it, people who have literally signed up to care for your child- and they do, in my experience, actually care.

It’s fine.