School "lost" my vulnerable ADHD/ODD son today!

[3Daddy31982]

Head was nice to me. That in itself isn't normal. She said XXXX played a game with us today. I was a bit lost. Turns out they'd lost him for quite some time. He'd hidden in cupboard. Other child told us they'd been out shouting his name. Class children were also searching for him!

He has ehcp and meant to have a one to one. I've previously not been happy with TAs not watching him.

He also came out in huge sobbing tears.

When he'd calmed down he told us noone found him. He didn't want to go to assembly and they'd said he had to. He said he was on his own! Which he must have been if they didn't know where he was.

Gut feeling is he isn't safe at this school. Felt that way since Sept when my Dad went to pick third child up and saw him solo and unwatched.

@caringcarer

They should have rang you after he was missing for 10 minutes. What if he had hot out of school and wondering around alone? He is clearly not safe there. Look for other options.

But he didn't get out of the school. All schools are locked during the school day, so he couldn't have got out of the school. He was hiding in a cupboard.

@LetHimHaveIt

No-one should be arguing that a 1:1 TA should be deployed elsewhere. But they also shouldn't be expected to have eyes on the child every second: the ECHP money pays for a supernumerary TA, not a superhero. It's bloody exhausting looking after a child with ADHD and/or ODD. I was kicked, shoved, evaded, threatened, sworn at - and for the same money (fractionally more than minimum wage) than the 60-70% of TAs in my school who had classes with no pupils with additional needs at all. Extraordinary that parents who won't have eyes on their child every second at home, expect us to - and we probably have them for more weekday waking hours. Do you follow your ODD kids to the loo? Do they not play in their rooms without an adult present?

Actually my child doesn't play in her room alone as she can't safely. She is autistic/adhd rather than ODD. She isn't allowed upstairs without me.

We had an accident recently and school referred it to MASH as I should have had my eyes on her and the split second meant she injured her head. It was a complete accident but yes I was very clearly told I absolutely can't let her out of my sight and ideally within grabbing distance. School implement arms reach too.

She has never hurt her TAs. Never sworn or been abusive. She is a runner and school have never had her in the position they don't know where she is. School split her full time 1-1 between two TAs, one AM and one PM to avoid burn out.

And I definitely have her far more waking hours.

@LetHimHaveIt why did you take on the role?

The ableism in your post is painful.

Far too many posters in this thread seem to think it's such a simple thing assembly. Assembly is often an issue for many children with additional needs as they are busy, lots of bodies and lots of sensory overwhelm.

What is a simple request to you is an exceedingly difficult request to many.

Not to disagree, I understand your point. But these children grow up. What do we do? Because we are getting an increasing number of uneducated young adults who can’t obey or adhere to any societal expectations. We are running out of people to work with them to help them. Parents throw them out at 18. They want a council property to be left alone to spend all their money on drugs and alcohol and eat from the foodbank. A lot become the drug dealers for their local area. They are incapable of any job. They can’t get up in the morning, they can’t speak to people, they lash out, they think the world should revolve around them, they are used to professionals being seen as the enemy and they get aggressive to get what they want. They are utterly miserable.

I don’t disagree that everyone is not the same and we should do all we can to ensure that everyone has successful outcomes. But it’s not working and we are overwhelmed with young adults with these diagnoses from childhood and their future is very bleak. It’s not helping and it’s getting worse. It’s frustrating because all these measures in childhood aren’t taking into account what do they actually do when they grow up? They are human beings who deserve better.

I work in a primary school op. Does your son have a full time 1:1? I ask because higher needs funding doesn’t often cover a full time TA salary. At my school there are periods, at the end of the day/assembly times when ther is no 1:1 and the teacher has 30 chn including a child with Sen. I’m a cover supervisor and have had similar situations. It’s crap and I’ve felt sick at times but have no choice. Good luck, I really wish state school provision was better for children like your son.

@WonderfulYou you have no idea how the scenario played out so why are you assuming you do? 😆

@dorkfink

It was in response to the above asking how I can assume what happened.

I've just read on another thread you've clarified that your son is given 17 hours of one-to-one at school.

How is this divided? Was the time at which he ran off to hide a time where he was (or should have been) supervised one-to-one?

I'm not based in England, we don't have ECHP so I don't know how the certain number of hours thing works in reality. Does 17 hours mean he is unsupervised (or not one to one at least) the remainder of school hours? Is he only at school those 17 hours each week? Do the school provide full time one to one, but only get funding for 17 hours?

Send an email to your LADO (it's local safeguarding).

Dear Xxxx,

My son x has an EHCP which clearly states he has 1:1 for xxxxx hours a week.

On Friday x was upset ashes verbalised he couldn't manage assembly and the school insisted he should go.

I would like a full investigation into why he wasn't listened to regarding his needs (safeguarding his mental well-being) and then able to be lost and children and staff searching for him when he's meant to be fully supervised.

Due to this safeguarding concern x will be remaining home until I have a response and we have a clear plan of how this will be prevented from happening again.

for you and for ds. What a distressing situation for both of you

@YellsElls

Some situations you just can't move past, years back when my nephew was a toddler his nursery left him on the mini bus taking him between the nursery and his half day at the primary school. It was July, and that day happened to be the hottest day of the year. It had been high twenties even reaching 30. The whole situation was heartbreaking, he had been left for nearly two hours and was in a complete state. It could of been so much worse. The person responsible was fired but the trust was just gone so he didn't go back to the nursery. My sister said she would of spent every day anxious that he was on that mini bus screaming again.

You both need to feel like he is safe and protected, especially as he has additional needs.

There is a world of difference between that situation and the OPs where the child intentionally hid in a cupboard.

@TipperHendry

What do posters asking questions, think the bloody 1:1 is for?? Seriously? They’re employed FOR THIS REASON. And yes, accompanied to the toilet/assembly etc.

In many cases the 1:1 gets redeployed somewhere else, unlawfully, and then this is what happens.

I’d be raging, and on to the SEN department faster than you can say “judicial review.”

Or, like in our school, almost all the TAs are currently off with Covid, including 1:1s, and we have no extra bodies to offer up in school for them at the moment, and we can't get supply in to save our lives.

Those that are outraged and rightly so, please understand that this is how schools are funded. Higher needs funding can be £3k a year. It doesn’t cover a TA for 9-3.30.

@LunaAndHerMoonDragons

Some posters have very little understanding of how a child with SEN feels when overwhelmed. I know quite a few Autistic children, some of whom absolutely must be watched every moment of the day, including to the toilet and in the playground. I know children who abscond from school when overwhelmed and can't safely attend a school that isn't completely fenced, with tall fences and locked gates. Do posters really think having a stern conversation never occurred to their parents? Or that telling your child to answer when hidden and overwhelmed was a solution? If these things worked they wouldn't be in this situation.

An overwhelmed child whose hidden in a cupboard to escape and having a meltdown (not a tantrum) can absolutely be unable to leave the cupboard even though they want to be found. He might not have even been in a state to register the calling.

I hope you're DS is doing ok now @3Daddy31982 and you get some answers from the school on how this happened.

Agreed but as a parent the Op must know this too.

Meltdowns and anxiety are part of ASD child’s life. You can’t eliminate them any more than you can eradicate the “miserable” bits of of an NT child’s life. It’s life isn’t it. It’s how you learn.School is a safe space to do this.
Many teens with ASD are radically different their childhood selves, calmer and more moderate.

He was in the school building? He was deliberately hiding, he wasn’t lost. I’m not sure where paedophiles come in to it? I think you need to review the EHCP if they can’t cope with him but it’s possible all they need to do is review procedures and start locking all cupboards. A child needing constant supervision would need 2:1 support as it’s not feasible for 1 person to provide

@WonderfulYou I've worked in schools too but again I don't know how you know the exact circumstances, the school layout or the details of the plan to assume again but crack on.

@Tropicaltutu

The ableism in your post is painful.

Far too many posters in this thread seem to think it's such a simple thing assembly. Assembly is often an issue for many children with additional needs as they are busy, lots of bodies and lots of sensory overwhelm.

What is a simple request to you is an exceedingly difficult request to many.

Not to disagree, I understand your point. But these children grow up. What do we do? Because we are getting an increasing number of uneducated young adults who can’t obey or adhere to any societal expectations. We are running out of people to work with them to help them. Parents throw them out at 18. They want a council property to be left alone to spend all their money on drugs and alcohol and eat from the foodbank. A lot become the drug dealers for their local area. They are incapable of any job. They can’t get up in the morning, they can’t speak to people, they lash out, they think the world should revolve around them, they are used to professionals being seen as the enemy and they get aggressive to get what they want. They are utterly miserable.

I don’t disagree that everyone is not the same and we should do all we can to ensure that everyone has successful outcomes. But it’s not working and we are overwhelmed with young adults with these diagnoses from childhood and their future is very bleak. It’s not helping and it’s getting worse. It’s frustrating because all these measures in childhood aren’t taking into account what do they actually do when they grow up? They are human beings who deserve better.

The bit that is often missed is the teaching of the children to learn how to self identify and self manage what they need.

So mine is 7. She struggles with low level chatter noise so can struggle with classroom noise. At the moment we as adults will make sure we have her ear defenders and identify if she's getting a bit jiggly and we intervene. However, we are also slowly but surely teaching her to recognise herself when she's finding it a bit tricky so that then she herself can put the measure in place so she doesn't get overwhelmed and the unwanted behaviour doesn't happen. She has recently reached the point she can verbally say that it hurts her ears so now we are trying to encourage the link to then grab her ear defenders or ask if she can take a quick walk around the daily mile loop.

I do think there is a big tendency to say they can't help it due to their disabilities and then never teach them how to manage their own triggers which is often how you end up in the scenario you discuss. It is essential children are supported to learn how to manage their own triggers. We don't punish her for walking off or refusing to enter something like assembly, we work out why, support and teach it independently.

I am aware my DD is at an advantage she has had a diagnosis for years and so we have been able to do this from a young age before things are too ingrained but I do hope it means that she manages OK as an adult.

I mean every school i've worked in has large cupboards that dc can fit in locked but I know this is representative of all schools.

my DS attends a specialist SEN school that is designed for kids who may be a flight risk, the grounds are completely locked down during the day.. and they managed to 'lose' him for an hour on thursday because he was upset and 'hid' (not in a cupboard, just in an out of way place not immediately visible on general looking)

When he was in mainstream he needed a 1:1 and you have to careful about how its specified on the EHCP. 25hrs is lesson time only, it'd be 30+ if it includes breaktime supervision. DS managed to get away from his TA a couple of times by rabbiting quicker than she could follow, i never blamed her or the school, it happens.

If your child hid, then refused to come out when being called, then yes you can ask how he managed to slip notice, as that is definitely a failure on their part, however, his SEN is not an excuse for poor behaviour, there needs to be some level of personal responsibility for hiding for that long from the staff just because he didn't want to go to assembly.

I've had a good talk with DS about what happened thursday, and told him quite firmly that hiding from the staff isn't ever ok, and if he's struggling/feeling overwhelmed, he needs to talk.

As an afterthought, what my sons mainstream school did in the end was provide a small 'safe space' for him, which was actually a cupboard they appropriated into a calm room with soft lighting and beanbags, so if ever he felt overwhelmed, he had a specific place to go to.. it saved on him bolting to random places!

By all means keep your son home until you've spoken to the school, and made a plan for his safety going forward.. and do make an official complaint, but don't pull him out entirely, that serves neither of you at this point... you're better looking for a managed move with support if you genuinely don't think the school he's in is right for him.

@dorkfink Curious question. Because I enjoy paying my mortgage and utility bills, and feeding my kids. (And actually, I wasn't taken on as a 1:1, and when I started to do it, there was no uplift in pay). And I enjoy the job, as a rule: I'm good at it. I'm profoundly overqualified, but that's true of a lot of us. But then, my school nor the child's parents had unrealistic expectations of my sticking to the child like white on rice. I was there to support him in lessons, which I did to the best of my ability. As he really only wanted to play football, and talk about Monster trucks or fishing, this was tricky. Very often he'd tear up the sheets, or his book, or another child's book, or the nearest library book he could grab. But we usually managed to get something done.
And it's a jolly good thing there are people prepared to take on unattractive TA roles. Because what use is increased funding for 1:1 TAs if no-one will do the job? And there's a TA crisis, even in these straitened times. But still, I soldier on. You're welcome.

He only has 1:1 for 17 of ~35hrs per week. So around 50%

That is quite different to a child who has been given full time, arm's-reach type support.

Parents throw them out at 18. They want a council property to be left alone to spend all their money on drugs and alcohol and eat from the foodbank. A lot become the drug dealers for their local area

sorry are you saying this is representive of dc with SEND @Tropicaltutu?

Last year our school had over 30 applications from pupils with EHCPs. We felt we could meet the needs of 8 so accepted them. However the local authority did not accept our grounds for rejection so in the last intake we had 33 pupils with EHCPs. This means that we are struggling to meet the needs of many of these pupils as our school is unsuitable.
We do what we can but we can't make our school smaller, reduce the school population or have a 'school within a school' with different staff, curriculum and timetable.

@LetHimHaveIt I'm not sure why it's a curious question? It sounded like you weren't happy with the post & had some resentment.

I absolutely believe TAs should get paid more.

You're welcome.

For what?

God- my school has many children with needs like this. If a kid bolts they bolt. They can run and hide far more quickly than an adult can follow them. I have spent many an hour looking for children who have legged it.

@Mumofsend, if you had read all my posts you would know that I was referring specifically to ODD as a special need.

@polkadotcatears

I wish all these posters saying 'report to Ofsted' would spend a week in a mainstream class.

OP, your child hid himself because he did not want to follow the (reasonable) expectation of going to assembly. Staff were searching for him, calling his name. He did not come out.

He was not lost, or trapped. He hid.

Those staff members will have been beside themselves with worry.

You need to have a very serious talk with your child. As another poster pointed out, unless you address it immediately and clearly, he will think he can just hide to get out of something he doesn't want to do in the future. That might be trying on new shoes or visiting Grandma or getting on a plane, when you are meant to be supervising him.

I would ask the school to have a meeting, so you can write a risk assessment that includes what happens if your son hide to avoid school activities. You need to work together on this, not blame school for your son's choice.

Agree completely.

I don't think a lot of people understand what is going on in schools and how hard staff are working to keep things running.