To think it’s ok to do ‘well enough’ at gcse’s

[Laughingstock91]

DS is doing well in school- I don’t know what his predicted grades are yet as he’s in year 9 and the school don’t do predicted gcse grades as they take the (sensible I feel) approach that it predicted grades too early on can cap achievement. I like this approach.

DS is doing well by their markers but gets very stressed by pressure. And the pressure seems to come from the get straight A’s & A* that seems to be hovering about - not from the school nescrssarily- but from an expectation in his peers that anything less is a failure. It drives me nuts! I got 8 GCSE’s grades a-c, did 3 Alevels grades a-c and then went to Uni and got a 2:1. I really want DS to pass his GCSEs and be able to go on and study but I don’t want him to feel ridiculous pressure to try and get straight A grades (or 9’s or whatever the modern day equivalent is.

But is that ok? Am I failing him by not pushing him? A friend with a child in private school where they get pushed to achieve straight A’s thinks I am letting him down but not saying he should aim for that! I just want him to do as well as he can but to not go mad with the stress of it all.

Aibu?

Sorry just wanted to clarify as my last sentence came out as a bash at graduates and that's not what I intended. I meant more that once were in the world of work your academic background doesn't need to hold you back. If anything that need to never stop working and never rest on your laurels I certainly got as a Tryer made me incredibly good at my career choice.

@Mamamwmwma

I think the UK is the only country who formally tests children at 16. It makes no sense to me that universities care about what level a child was performing at when they were 15/16.

Unis have gone down that route due to the sheer number of applicants getting top grades at A level. They need some measures to choose which applicants to offer places to. If they get 1000 applicants from students, all with expected A or A* grades, but only 200 places on the course, how else do they select, other than by considering GCSE grades. (In a perfect World, they'd read the personal statements, and do interviews, but that's no longer possible given the sheer number of "equivalent" applicants).

Part of my role is in grad recruitment for my firm, the number of cvs that I see where kids have done well but not stellar at GCSEs and the go on to come out with first class degrees always surprises me.

At interview and selection they tend do better, with a more rounded approach.

Of course you need the grades, but the 10 a* or 9s aren't the be all and end all.

In my opinion if a child can put in reasonable effort( in my opinion that is going to school, paying attention in class/ doing all homework) and maintain a good balance of activities, sport/hobbies free time etc, then they can afford to up their game when needed and give their best in exams.
If a child is aiming, or being pushed too high for their natural abilities, then often they will burn out at one point or another, because it isn't sustainable in the long run and this is obviously distressing for them and feel they are letting themselves and others down.

He will need to get a certain number of points from his GCSE results to get into sixth form, and he will need to get a 7 or higher in each subject he wants to take at A level.

My kids are both bright but I had the same conversation with each them that failing a test or failing an exam is not the worst thing they could do, and that, providing I can see they have worked hard and done the best they can I will not be disappointed in them. DS was really surprised by this (he's year 7)
DD is 15 and has just got 8s and a couple of 9s in her mocks. During a recent parents eve a few teachers suggested she could improve from an 8 to a 9 if she worked on x, y or z or revised more on whatever subject...and then as an afterthought ...but 8 is still a very good grade. I know they are saying it to encourage and inspire her, but i know she will feel pressure that they are perhaps expecting more.

She felt very stressed doing the exams and while of course I encourage her to work hard and do her best, I want her to also know there will always be another path if on the day something goes wrong.
Exams, in the main, are being able to recall a selection of facts and info at a particular point in time within a defined timescale. If you don't perform well in that specific hour and a half or however long, then you fail.

I had MH problems leading up to my A levels and ended up sitting some of the exams in hospital (a teacher brought the exam papers and sat with me while I did them) and not doing the others at all.

I'm sure if you'd asked my teachers at GCSE what I would end up doing rheyd have been sure I would have done A levels, uni and probably have a much better paid job than I do now. I didn't go to uni, I did something that didn't really use any of my GCSEs and I'll never earn what MN thinks is a decent salary but it wasn't the end of the world that I didn't do A levels or go to uni.

@SarahAndQuack

I know many would like to believe this is true because it reflects well on them...but I just don't think it is.

YY.

Unfortunately, some children will find GCSEs a huge battle, and even the most brilliant teaching and involved parenting - and very hard work from the child - won't guarantee they do particularly well. And other children will coast through and conclude (as children do) that all this rhetoric about the need to work hard and knuckle down is nonsense, or that they're special because it doesn't apply to them. Neither of those are emotionally terribly great outcomes.

This is why I hate the 'you have to work hard to get results' line.

I agree. I think these days it's more a matter of working smarter than working harder. You can read loads of books and memorise loads of dates and facts for, say History, but you won't get a good mark if you don't understand the marking scheme, don't know how to construct a balancing argument essay, don't understand bias, etc.

It seems modern exams are more about exam technique etc., rather than learning facts and endless reading. I think that's actually better as we all have unlimited facts at our fingertips via our smart phones and laptops, so softer skills like contrasting, bias, research, evaluation, etc are more useful these days, but I don't think that all parents/teachers (for younger age groups) are fully up to speed so perpetuate the "work hard" myth.

@whiteworldgettingwhiter

He will need to get a certain number of points from his GCSE results to get into sixth form, and he will need to get a 7 or higher in each subject he wants to take at A level.

That's not factually correct!

I only want my son to achieve what he needs to get to his chosen next stage. Look at what they need for the next step and aim for that. Our local 6th forms seem to want 5 gcses at grade 5 with higher grades in the chosen subject for some but not all A levels. Remember too that mental health is important. Gcses at the end of year 11 is not some sort of last chance, there are always retakes and alternative routes into most careers.

I agree OP, plus I think that it’s helpful to know your own underlying ability whilst working at the right pace for you. It will mean you’re more likely to choose the right path forwards, the right course and career. Rather than head off in a direction that’s actually really difficult for you especially if you go away to Uni and don’t have the same level of support and/or new interests.

I am exactly the same - I think everyone has gone completely mad! I have two daughters - one is top of everything and is gifted etc etc We don't push her at all she is just like a machine, and the other has always struggled academically and, although she is clearly very bright, is not going to score top grades at GCSE and she doesn't need to. We try to support them both in their different ways, and to help them both see that GCSEs are a really small part of their life journey and, as others have said, a stepping stone for whatever they want to do next.

I often feel like I am the mad one, surrounded by parents who seem to be losing sleep over their kids GCSEs and basically it seems doing the homework for them. I was super academic, but it was always clear to me that not everyone was and I don't know why everyone seems to be so obsessed by the grades their kids get at GCSE !

I'm in Ireland and looking at the system in England I'm horrified. Our gcse equivalent has no bearing whatsoever on our a level equivalents (you still move on even if you fail them!) they are literally just there to see what state you are at!

I got all C's in my junior cert
I got A's and B's in my leaving cert.

I did biology in my leaving cert and then went to college and did lots of chemistry as a part of my degree having never done it before.

@user1497207191 So kids are breaking under the strain because the GCSE system isn’t representative of actual ability and universities can’t be bothered to read personal statements, set entrance exams etc? What do they do with the fees they charge?

And the 1-9 system has made things worse. My dc has just sat his mocks and is disappointed with 7s. I told him not to be daft.

Always told mine to just do there best , mostly got all c's but ds is still off to uni to do a course he wants
And other ds at college enjoying his course
Not all kids are academic and capable of a grades but all kids are good at something, its just sometimes them finding out what that is

@CornishGem1975 - it certainly is for DD's sixth form.

@user1497207191 you can't compare percentages either as the papers are generally harder
My two were doing a lot harder work than i did in 80/90's

Average is all I can hope for for my 16 year old ds.
He has hated secondary school from the very start, had very bad school anxiety and refusal with little help from the school. I pleaded with them to help him as he struggled with his work.
I asked time and time again if he could be dyslexic but only in the last few months, in the run up to his mocks, he has had some assessments and they have agreed he is most probably dyslexic.
His grades are always low and at parents evenings the teachers tell me they can do little with him and he just appears disinterested.
BUT he is hugely practical, his favourite subject is DT and his DT teacher has been nothing sort of wonderful to him. She understands him (being dyslexic herself) and says he works so well in class and even comes up with ideas she has not thought of herself. But sadly he will struggle with his grades in this subject too as so much needs to be written work as well as the practical that he excels in.
He already has an apprenticeship arranged (in a practical subject) and I am sure he will do well but will I worry so much about his predicted grades and am concerned he will have to do extra GCSEs in college if he fails to get the rights grades needed.
Teachers, schools and the government need to acknowledge that not every one is academic and there is so much more to young people than their exam results.
You have the right approach. There is more to life than this. I know several people who have left school with nothing but have achieved so much during their adult life.

@user1497207191 thats also such a degrading comment to make implying that someone who has worked bloody hard hasn't worked as hard as previous years
My ds got similar results to me but are cleverer than I am
Its also like papers you could sit one paper and get an a but another one get a c as one paper has more that you know
An exam is just a snapshop of one small moment in time and its a shame we make such judgements based on this

[quote Mamamwmwma]@user1497207191 So kids are breaking under the strain because the GCSE system isn’t representative of actual ability and universities can’t be bothered to read personal statements, set entrance exams etc? What do they do with the fees they charge?[/quote]
Yes, that pretty much sums it up. As for Uni fees, you'd have to take that up with the Unis.

[quote whiteworldgettingwhiter]@CornishGem1975 - it certainly is for DD's sixth form.[/quote]
It's not across the board though - most want 5s with 6s in specific subjects. Some even take 4s.

[quote worriedatthemoment]@user1497207191 thats also such a degrading comment to make implying that someone who has worked bloody hard hasn't worked as hard as previous years
My ds got similar results to me but are cleverer than I am
Its also like papers you could sit one paper and get an a but another one get a c as one paper has more that you know
An exam is just a snapshop of one small moment in time and its a shame we make such judgements based on this [/quote]
So you're saying grade inflation doesn't exist then?

@user1497207191 well i hope they do read the personal statements as took my sons time to do his and also his £28 of hard earned money

I think the conversation about grade inflation never takes into account how much more accessible information is these days. If I wanted to find something when I doing GCSEs I would have to take myself to a library and looking it up in a book. These days my dc just have to look it up online. My dc claimed that Mr. Bruff (online English teacher) helped him get a 9. The resources out there now are making a huge difference. Easier though I suppose to just claim that exams are getting easier.

[quote Mamamwmwma]@user1497207191 So kids are breaking under the strain because the GCSE system isn’t representative of actual ability and universities can’t be bothered to read personal statements, set entrance exams etc? What do they do with the fees they charge?[/quote]
'Can't be bothered'?!

Do you have the faintest clue how hard most university staff are working at the moment? They are dealing with all of the same problems teachers have been facing with covid (plus the enjoyable fact that when you bring together thousands of young people from across the country, they will spread covid like mad, possibly even more than schools do).

Do you think that suddenly providing online resources was totally free for universities?