Page 21 | LGBTQ talk in schools

JaggedStone · 2022-01-26T22:50:39+00:00

Named changed for this as could be outing. We are very open with our children and explain life to them in ways they can understand and to ensure they are respectful of everyone and are always open and honest with us. A LOT of parents have kicked up a fuss about the fact that teachers have spoken to the children today about LGBTQ but it is government mandated as compulsory so essentially the parents can not opt out of it unless they are planning to home school. Some of the views seem quite hypocritical and some are saying they shouldn’t have these kind of talks yet. AIBU to think that they are being unreasonable?

Migrainesbythedozen · 28/01/2022 02:34

[quote Pinkrose1111]@DaphneduWarrior believing 5 year olds should be taught about relationships is an OPINION. Not believing
to teach kids about relationships at 5 years old is an OPINION. Everything your saying in MY OPINION can be taught at home. And shouldn't even be mentioned at 5 years old. Like I said when I was younger if I saw a couple kissing (straight couple for that matter) my parents would cover my eyes if I saw ANY form of sexual contact between 2 people, my parents would hide that from me, because at that age it's not appropriate to introduce kids to sexualisation at these young ages. You keep talking about bi/LGBT no offence but I don't care about that. I'm clearly stating my point is I don't want my son exposed to ANY sort of relationship/sexualisation at 5 Years old.[/quote]
@Pinkrose1111 Like I said when I was younger if I saw a couple kissing (straight couple for that matter) my parents would cover my eyes if I saw ANY form of sexual contact between 2 people, my parents would hide that from me, because at that age it's not appropriate to introduce kids to sexualisation at these young ages.

That's very, very said. And I genuinely feel very sorry for you (and I mean it genuinely, I'm not being snarky), there is nothing 'sexualised' about a kiss, and your mother's deranged behaviour does explain a lot about your attitude. Which is why we need to break the cycle. What could be more pure than a human showing love to another? It's what we need more of. And unfortunately if the cycle isn't broken people like yourself who were damaged by your mother and made to feel any sign of love is bad, pass your hung ups you were given onto your son. That's why now more than ever education is vital. We must break the cycle.

EeeICouldRipATissue · 28/01/2022 02:36

I didn't say what she'd been arrested for.
Just pointing out from other stuff it's just such crap to say she's 53! ("WTF? So)
Are people over a certain age if they're women immune from criticism?

Migrainesbythedozen · 28/01/2022 02:37

[quote Pinkrose1111]@Migrainesbythedozen really? I don't know any Muslim/hindhu/Jewish/sikh teenage mothers do you?[/quote]
I absolutely do! And even a quick google will show you how many there are. Time immemorial shows that religion is no barrier to HUMAN NATURE. Those that are raised in a strict religious household are more likely to be uneducated on sexual matters so not know how pregnancy occurs, and also are the most likely to rebel and have teen pregnancies (due to not knowing how to prevent pregnancies).

nolongersurprised · 28/01/2022 02:38

Just pointing out from other stuff

The sticker that says, “Lesbians love ladies, not lads”.

How is that factually wrong and “anti-trans”?

Migrainesbythedozen · 28/01/2022 02:39

@EeeICouldRipATissue

I didn't say what she'd been arrested for. Just pointing out from other stuff it's just such crap to say she's 53! ("WTF? So) Are people over a certain age if they're women immune from criticism?

Regardless of her age, you tried to conflate her trans beliefs with what she had been arrested for, and tried to muddy the waters by suggesting she deserved it for posting her beliefs on twitter. It was clear what you were trying to do by linking the two.

Pinkrose1111 · 28/01/2022 02:41

@DaphneduWarrior don't feel sorry for me because I had a very privileged upbringing and am soo grateful for my parents for protecting me. While watching all of my friends being sexually active with men who didn't care about them and just used them. And becoming teenage mothers, ruining their lives because they were exposed to sexualisation from such a young age. While I saved myself and didn't have my first relationship until 21 (DS father). Because my parents were strict and rightly so. Had it not been for them installing that into me, I 100% would of ended up becoming a teenage mother aswell as all of my friends were doing it.

Migrainesbythedozen · 28/01/2022 02:41

*That's very, very said
should be That's very, very sad.

EeeICouldRipATissue · 28/01/2022 02:42

like I said when I was younger if I saw a couple kissing (straight couple for that matter) my parents would cover my eyes if I saw ANY form of sexual contact between 2 people, my parents would hide that from me, because at that age it's not appropriate to introduce kids to sexualisation at these young ages

That's not being sexual or teaching about inappropriate relationships. No wonder you feel the way you do

Pinkrose1111 · 28/01/2022 02:43

@Migrainesbythedozen honey statistically Asian families have the lowest single parent households/ teenage pregnancy across ALL other demographics.

Pinkrose1111 · 28/01/2022 02:46

@EeeICouldRipATissue Kissing is sexual contact and you're seriously saying we should expose 5 year olds to that?? Every 5 year old I know thinks that's yucky? Why are we trying to force this on kids so young now?? Noone can still explain to me WHY 5 year olds need to know about relationships??

Migrainesbythedozen · 28/01/2022 02:50

[quote Pinkrose1111]@EeeICouldRipATissue Kissing is sexual contact and you're seriously saying we should expose 5 year olds to that?? Every 5 year old I know thinks that's yucky? Why are we trying to force this on kids so young now?? Noone can still explain to me WHY 5 year olds need to know about relationships??[/quote]
@Pinkrose1111 Kissing on the lips is not 'sexual contact', your thought process is so damaged and warped, you don't even know how damaged you are. Are you seriously saying you would cover your son's eyes if they saw something as innocent as a couple kissing goodbye in public? Something so pure, so non-sexual, so innocent?

Pinkrose1111 · 28/01/2022 02:56

@Migrainesbythedozen um, kissing is definitely sexual contact. If you're husband kissed another woman passionately I'm pretty sure you'd consider it as cheating. And if my son saw someone kissing in public of course I'm not going to cover his eyes, I'm not as extreme as my parents. But that doesn't mean I'm going to force that upon him. At 5 it's not age appropriate. What programmes for 5 year olds have people passionately kissing in them??

Migrainesbythedozen · 28/01/2022 03:02

[quote Pinkrose1111]@Migrainesbythedozen um, kissing is definitely sexual contact. If you're husband kissed another woman passionately I'm pretty sure you'd consider it as cheating. And if my son saw someone kissing in public of course I'm not going to cover his eyes, I'm not as extreme as my parents. But that doesn't mean I'm going to force that upon him. At 5 it's not age appropriate. What programmes for 5 year olds have people passionately kissing in them??[/quote]
@Pinkrose1111 Lol, um, no, kissing does not have to be sexual. A quick kiss on the cheek or lips goodbye is NOT sexual.

Pinkrose1111 · 28/01/2022 03:05

@Migrainesbythedozen girl 😒🙄. Stop trying to twist the narrative. You know full well noone was talking about a "friendly peck" goodbye or whatever. I was referring to a full-on making out snogging session.

NotBadConsidering · 28/01/2022 03:10

The thread about a woman being arrested for anti-domestic violence stickers has a lot of information, I would be surprised if @EeeICouldRipATissue hasn’t read it, because no doubt Eeel has read other threads active on that board, so it wouldn’t have escaped notice:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4461798-Jennifer-Swayne-arrested-for-stickering

NotBadConsidering · 28/01/2022 03:12

@EeeICouldRipATissue

like I said when I was younger if I saw a couple kissing (straight couple for that matter) my parents would cover my eyes if I saw ANY form of sexual contact between 2 people, my parents would hide that from me, because at that age it's not appropriate to introduce kids to sexualisation at these young ages

That's not being sexual or teaching about inappropriate relationships. No wonder you feel the way you do

So do you think children should be taught same sex attraction and same sex relationships, or same gender attraction and same gender relationships, as per Stonewall’s official definitions?

It can’t be both, because they’re antithetical to each other. Which is it?

Simonjt · 28/01/2022 05:58

[quote Pinkrose1111]@Simonjt No Offence, but I'm starting to think you're a troll. Where did I say that I told my DS that we're in a relationship??? I've never once told my DS this. To my DS we are just mummy and daddy. The same way Grandma is Grandma and Uncle is Uncle etc. Like I said if he ASKS I'll explain what's relevant and age appropriate. But no more. And DEFINTILEY not to be taught at school.

And of course relationships lead to sexualisation, like hello?? A relationship with zero sexual contact is a friendship. It's the sexual part that makes it a relationship. This is why I'm saying kids do not need to know about any type of relationships at that age.

When they're in secondary school of course teach them all about relationships LGBT etc. I support kids learning about ALL family dynamics esp lgbt. But not at 5 years old. No way on Earth. Call me old fashioned but back in primary school all the kids I remember who were into relationships that young all ended up sexually active by the time they were 13 and pregnant before 18.

There is literally ZERO reason why 5 year olds needs to learn about relationships.[/quote]
So you think your son thinks you and his Dad are just mates, right…

It’s bizarre that you think any child who knows that relationships exist is sexualised, so in your case, if we pretend that your son hasn’t noticed you’re in a relationship, what age are you happy for him to be sexualised?

Simonjt · 28/01/2022 06:04

[quote Pinkrose1111]@Migrainesbythedozen really? I don't know any Muslim/hindhu/Jewish/sikh teenage mothers do you?[/quote]
I’m not the posted you tagged, but quite a few, getting pregnant is a very very common cause of a very quick wedding in a great number of muslims. Thats exactly how most of my relatives ended up married.

Simonjt · 28/01/2022 06:05

[quote Pinkrose1111]@DaphneduWarrior don't feel sorry for me because I had a very privileged upbringing and am soo grateful for my parents for protecting me. While watching all of my friends being sexually active with men who didn't care about them and just used them. And becoming teenage mothers, ruining their lives because they were exposed to sexualisation from such a young age. While I saved myself and didn't have my first relationship until 21 (DS father). Because my parents were strict and rightly so. Had it not been for them installing that into me, I 100% would of ended up becoming a teenage mother aswell as all of my friends were doing it.[/quote]
At what age were you sexualised/discovered that relationships exist?

Simonjt · 28/01/2022 06:06

@EeeICouldRipATissue

No why does he need to know that? How is that relevant to him? Your comment seems to be it's OK to know straight people and couples exist Not so much one's that aren't though.

She’s also concerned her son may discover that black people can love white people.

So white okay, straight okay.

Migrainesbythedozen · 28/01/2022 06:24

[quote Pinkrose1111]@Migrainesbythedozen girl 😒🙄. Stop trying to twist the narrative. You know full well noone was talking about a "friendly peck" goodbye or whatever. I was referring to a full-on making out snogging session.[/quote]
No I didn't know that at all, because you gave the impression you were talking about just your basic average couple giving each other a kiss. Which is completely different from a "full-on making out snogging session."

Simonjt · 28/01/2022 06:47

@Migrainesbythedozen Are you aware that @Pinkrose1111 had her son as a result of accidental pregnancy (how sexualised), oh and he has ruined her life. Some various inconsistencies in her posts, I noticed that on another thread about money.

YouSetTheTone · 28/01/2022 07:31

It depends on the content. I was concerned that the school would be using Stonewall resources that would confuse the children and undermine the rights and boundaries of the girls - both now and in the future. So I spoke to the PSHE lead and she explained what they would cover and when. I have no problem with age appropriate discussion about puberty and sex, including same sex attraction. I do have a problem with a tenuously defined gender identity ideology that relies on outdated stereotypes and potentially put children on a pathway to damaging their bodies irreversibly.

Fortunately the school’s PSHE curriculum is factual, appropriate and sensitively communicated to the children. There is not a sniff of Stonewall influence.

Jellycatspyjamas · 28/01/2022 08:24

can still explain to me WHY 5 year olds need to know about relationships??

Because they live their lives in the context of relationships, their parents are in (or have been in) a relationship. Their family lives take place in the context of various partner relationships. Because at that early age teaching about respect, care for each other and consent is important for their emotional and social development. Because for some children the only model they have of partner relationships is in a context of domestic abuse - talking about relationships gives children the language to say something is wrong if they need to.

At 5 no one is teaching sex in school, it’s wholly appropriate for a child that age to know what partner relationships look like and how different families fit together. No ones talking about exposing them to people having a full on kissing session but it’s important for children to see affection between their parents and their parents to show physical affection towards them.

Helleofabore · 28/01/2022 08:39

Pinkrose1111

Do you honestly think children don’t understand family structures?

You must be carefully curating your child’s entire world (TV, friendships, books, school interactions, even random playground interactions) to think that they don’t. It doesn’t have to be ‘sexualised’ in anyway.

It is about different families. Normalising those differences. So knowing that families are different and that is ok and knowing you cannot treat children with a different family structure differently.

If your child is at school, they will already be aware that some other children have one parent families, that children may have two mums or dads at five. Because at five we are drawing pictures not our home lives and discussing them.

No need to be discussing anything else about adult relationships at five. (This is where checking what is being taught is recommended).

But I noticed my own child at five wanted to marry me, their best friends, their favourite book character. I might have been similar. All I ever said was when they were an adult, it would be fine with me whoever they chose to marry. No need to bring sexual activity into it at all.

But learning that children have different families, that it is completely normal and to not treat any child differently because of their family structure is very important to do from even earlier that 5, in my opinion. And structure does include religion, sexual orientation, ethnicity.