To think the NHS is screwed

[jaspercabbage]

Elderly relative had cancer related surgery before Christmas. The surgery went well but there has been no follow up appointment with an oncologist since. Recently they have taken ill again (clearly to do with the cancer) and have been to a&e four times in two weeks. They are treated for the sickness then sent on their way for the same thing to happen a few days later.

They were admitted again earlier in the week and have been stuck on a trolley, in a bay, in a&e for two nights now due to no beds in the hospital. This is an elderly person quite possibly now requiring end of life care and they can't even have their family with them. I just can't believe it's this bad.

I'm also due to have a baby later in the year, could be complications and to be honest I am shit scared about staff shortages and aftercare. What if something goes wrong in labour and there is nobody to deal with it at the time?

How can things have got to this point? The people are crying out for life going back to normal clearly haven't had to visit hospital lately. Although this is probably to do with a lot more than covid - underfunding, Brexit at so on.

Just a rant really but interested to hear other peoples thoughts.

YANBU

I'm at the point where I'd welcome a fully funded model like in the US

Having had hospital treatment in both the U.K. and US it's far superior In every way possible

The NHS we all knew and loved is dead, time we move on

I'm at the point where I'd welcome a fully funded model like in the US

The US model isn’t fully funded, what are you talking about.

And have you heard of the people that ended up bankrupt because they cannot afford health care?

There is no evidence that private healthcare is better.

When the nhs was properly funded, it was one of the best healthcare systems in the world.

The Tories, who have private healthcare friends, decided to under fund it with the aim of making it look worse.

They did the same with British Rail.

It’s so blatantly obvious.

It's an absolute disgrace. We shouldn't have to have privately funded healthcare, we had a model that worked well and has been neglected and underfunded for years. Obviously covid hasn't helped but some of the scenes we are seeing now are heartbreaking.

I feel so awful for my relative who has been stuck on a&e for 48+ hours in their condition. It's horrible.

Sorry to hear of your relative.
The reality is, it's been like this for many, many years. Especially every winter.

It's got to this point because of the people in government throughout the years.

@Iggly

I'm at the point where I'd welcome a fully funded model like in the US

The US model isn’t fully funded, what are you talking about.

And have you heard of the people that ended up bankrupt because they cannot afford health care?

There is no evidence that private healthcare is better.

When the nhs was properly funded, it was one of the best healthcare systems in the world.

The Tories, who have private healthcare friends, decided to under fund it with the aim of making it look worse.

They did the same with British Rail.

It’s so blatantly obvious.

Fully privately funded

Not state funded

Not sure why you're so hard of understanding

@jaspercabbage

It's an absolute disgrace. We shouldn't have to have privately funded healthcare, we had a model that worked well and has been neglected and underfunded for years. Obviously covid hasn't helped but some of the scenes we are seeing now are heartbreaking.

I feel so awful for my relative who has been stuck on a&e for 48+ hours in their condition. It's horrible.

It's never worked brilliantly though

The NHS has always been at a 6/10, it's now at a 2/10

YANBU. Having been through cancer treatment and other critical medical situations in the last couple of years, I certainly feel the NHS is fooked.

It has been screwed over by the Conservative Government. There fixed that for you OP.
And people that have been burying their heads in the sand ignoring what’s been happening to their NHS ever since Cameron introduced austerity measures have only themselves to blame. Not saying that’s you OP but you act like you are surprised?
Our healthcare system works perfectly well when it’s properly funded and resourced. It’s a good model, not perfect (no system is), but it can work really well for the vast majority of the people. But. we as the public need to demand that it is looked after. Voting Tory is the sure fire way to lose the NHS.

@aristotlesdeathray

YANBU

I'm at the point where I'd welcome a fully funded model like in the US

Having had hospital treatment in both the U.K. and US it's far superior In every way possible

The NHS we all knew and loved is dead, time we move on

What you mean only for the rich? Costing tens times more ?

How on earth would removing free at the point of use healthcare help @aristotlesdeathray?

The NHS needs an infusion of cash from the tax we all pay. What we don't need is to get people into masses of debt for daring to have a baby or being unlucky enough to get cancer or a chronic condition. We also want people to flag worrying symptoms early so we can catch things early before they get more serious and more expensive.

I'm sorry to hear about your relative OP. It's a really difficult time for the NHS and with so many clinicians (Dr's, nurses and others) leaving, I'm also concerned. We need to focus on immigration to boost those numbers now and look to fix the issues at the training/student level for years to come.

It isnt fit for purpose, but i am so disappointed that the states model is the most likely one to replace it. I so hoped for something more like the german system which seems better.
I think we will get some odd transition where its free at point of use, but provided by profit making companies so our tax moves into business profits. They will start by charging for extras and before long it will be very basic healthcare provided at a profit from tax and health insurance for the rest.

We have fewer beds and fewer staff in our hospitals than other developed nations. It is a shambles because it suits the Tories to have it so. Think of grubby Owen and the Randox links. Imagine them all jizzing themselves in excitement at the thought of US health corps coming in.

There is a middle way - looking at countries like France and Germany. But voting this shower of twats out would be a great start.

@SkidmarkOnTheHeadboard

Sorry to hear of your relative. The reality is, it's been like this for many, many years. Especially every winter.

It's got to this point because of the people in government throughout the years.

It hasn't been like this at this level for so long before. We have reached beyond crisis point now

I've worked in nhs for over 20 years. It is absolutely broken. Staff are leaving in droves. We cannot recruit. Newly qualified staff are getting out within a year or so.
Management at my trust are bullies and do not help staff in any way. The labour ward is meant to have 10 midwives but now will run with 5 on a regular basis. What other industry would carry on with half the required staff? It is dangerous for patients. There is no care. I am looking to leave but difficult to find anything else I'm able to do.

I know there are very many genuine bad and terrible experiences but there are also many good ones. Our own experience over many years is good overall. In particular, in the last couple of years, I've had input from two types of physio, long term rheumatology illness being dealt with, colposcopy and more. Ditto DH who has Parkinson's and many incidental issues. SIL and FIL, now quite elderly, eye problems, arthritis problems and more. Other FIL had a stroke some years ago, now quite old and has a variety of problems from falls to skin problems. And many more, none of us have serious complaints about the service or treatment. It can't be a coincidence. We personally live near to two London teaching hospitals, maybe that helps, but the other relatives don't.

I don't think the NHS was ever designed to be used the way it is today. People go for everything, and people now live for a lot longer.

The concept of I've worked all my life so should get unlimited free care is certainly nice, but doesn't work financially.

Nor does paying continually for people who are making themselves sick - overweight, smokers, alcoholics, etc.

A serious discussion needs to happen about it, and it never will because it is political poison to do so.

@tiredofworking

I've worked in nhs for over 20 years. It is absolutely broken. Staff are leaving in droves. We cannot recruit. Newly qualified staff are getting out within a year or so. Management at my trust are bullies and do not help staff in any way. The labour ward is meant to have 10 midwives but now will run with 5 on a regular basis. What other industry would carry on with half the required staff? It is dangerous for patients. There is no care. I am looking to leave but difficult to find anything else I'm able to do.

Sorry you're in the same position. Are you a midwife? I'm a midwife who's also looking to leave. I've stuck it out for as long as I can but it's making me physically and mentally ill. I have ZERO love left for the job. Really hard when people say to me "oh you have the best job in the world" but they don't realise how awful it currently is.

It hasn't been like this at this level for so long before. We have reached beyond crisis point now
I live between 3 major hospitals. 2 are on black alert every winter. People in corridors is not new.

I'm just here to suggest you get hold of your relatives GP to ask for a District Nurse referral. Hopefully an assessment will follow & a care package arranged. This happened for my mum and she was cared for in her own home by Hospice to home which was commissioned by the District Nurse. I feel so much for your situation.

My ideas for improvement would be:

1. Some tax increases, we can't afford much more.
2. Concentrate on real health conditions. I think they have stopped tattoo removal but should stop similar and some of the super expensive fertility treatments.
3. Stop funding for extremely expensive drugs where others are available.
4. Put the responsibility for life-style back to the individual. If people smoke, take drugs, alcohol or are grossly obese tell them to change their behaviour and come back next year. Get better managers and fewer of them.

Yanbu, we have just taken out private health insurance as if something serious happens to one of us I am not risking being stuck on an NHS waiting list.

Sorry to hear about your relative

I left a role in the nhs 15 years ago as it was all too depressing. Critical care departments desperate for funding for new monitoring systems whilst other departments within the same hospital were replacing lights and fittings that didn’t need doing just so they didn’t lose the funding for next year. Totally broken and has been for a long time.

Underfunded for years, against a back drop of growing demand.
Nurse friends of mine have left early, they’ve had enough. One worked in the community, never finished on time, had extra patients at the end of every day. Midwife friend left a few years early, but the stress had already damaged her health.
I was just thinking of trying to keep my registration , but I’ve decided I’m too old and don’t need the stress now.

So sorry to hear about your relative

To be fair to the NHS, I had a lump removed in October and the oncology service locally couldn't have been better. I started chemo before Xmas, have had follow up appointments, tests, phone calls with pastoral care, even a courtesy call from my gp. They've helped me financially, and in lots of other ways. They have been fabulous.

So no I don't think the NHS is screwed. I don't know why services vary so much. I think that is the question that needs asking.